Was there a reason why Kellen was so predictable?

[khiladi]

Actually, the guy in San Diego that Moore replaced was more like Garrett. The chargers, when hiring Moore, just like when Jerry started revoking they reigns from Jason Garrett as a play-caller spoke about the need for running the ball to maximize the talents of the QB. Joe Lombardi, like Garrett, relied solely on the arm of his QB to move the offense:

Last season, the Chargers called a designed pass on 68% of plays, the second-highest rate in the NFL behind only the Buccaneers (68.1%). The Cowboys called a designed pass on 54.6% of their plays in 2022, the sixth-lowest rate in the league.

This number also demonstrates the myth among Dak-stans that Moore wasn’t putting the QB in favorable conditions to maximize his play and wasn’t running the .

As even Staley pointed out when they want with Moore, it’s the threat of the run game that opened up the explosive passing game, just like it did for the Cowboys when Linehan and Romo worked together. Play action for the Cowboys was generally an explosive play call, while for Dak is was to make the offense simpler.

"In terms of the passing game, that's what we've been able to do at a high level for the last two years, throw the football," Staley said before Moore's hiring. "But to be more explosive, you have to be able to run the football more consistently to put more pressure on people."

The Cowboys under Moore ranked 11th in rate of explosive plays (10.1%), qualified as a 10-yard run or 20-yard pass play, while the Chargers the last two seasons under Lombardi ranked 30th (8.1%).

Dak-fans were looking for any excuse to bash Moore, but there is a reason Moore was picked up in “a matter of seconds”.
As I said in the other post, Chargers fans were livid that Lombardi was not challenging downfield with the phenom QB they have and even when they did, it was mostly Lombardi not knowing what to do, so he’d just have Herbert try and find guys open downfield.

As I said, claiming Garrett and Moore are alike is comical. Moore got as much as he could out of Dak. This year they told him to be aggressive and throw, because it’s most likely they knew he kept sitting on his routes, as he’s slow processing the field. Thus aggressiveness probably explains all the picks, particularly the pick 6s, because no matter what, the QB we have here is limited. Dak is who he is.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id...rgers-hiring-kellen-moore-new-oc?platform=amp

 

[Aven8]

This isn’t news. This is the same offense we’ve ran essentially for 15 years straight. Not that hard to scout us. Occasionally he would pull out new ideas like Tampa, but the majority of the time it was the same thing we’ve ran forever.

 

[Whirlwin]

McCarthy pulled Moore back Because of DAK limitations.

The entire offense limitations

 

[Cowboys93]

You know, it seems like the beginning of the 21-22 season was really the pinnacle of his playcalling. I understand the weapons were better, but I remember seeing a lot more motion, creativity, and flow to the offense. Seems like after that Broncos game the blueprint was out on how to slow this offense down. My best guess is the OC and QB regressed, and fell back on more basic and predictable gameplans. I think Kellen will actually be very successful with the weapons and QB he has in LA. It seems a lot more fitting for what he was trying to do here

 

[RonnieT24]

Was there a reason why we were so predictable, was there a reason why Kellen didn't call certain plays for dak, have dak throw it deep more, why we use so many curl routes, etc etc? We have a lot to say about him, but is there a reason why he was so limited in doing what he did? Please give your thoughts!

The reason is simple.. Moore inherited Garrett's "paint by numbers" approach to play calling. They have a formula for certain plays in certain down and distances against certain defensive looks and they stick to it .. Ray Lewis and his bunch were the first to tell us back in 2008 when they closed down Texas Stadium.. They knew what we were doing based on the looks they gave us and the formations we would come out in based on situations. It has been a recurring theme ever since. The only time it wasn't was 2014-2016 because in those first two seasons Romo reached the point where he would audible out of anything stupid that was sent in and get us into a play tailor made to make the defense wrong. Then in 2016 they had to run a completely different offense to fit a rookie QB. Now we still see it.. DBs standing in the exact spot our receivers are trying to get to before they ever even get out of their breaks. We seen linebackers dropping right into the passing lanes we want to throw in. On running plays defenses are in our backfield so fast at times you would think our line never got out of their stances.

I have said many times that in order for this offense to succeed against a really good defense and a really good coordinator Dak has to get to that level of command of the offense that Romo reached at the end of 2013 heading into 2014. He's not there yet. Some will chime in that he will never get there and maybe he won't. But I am not about to declare that Dak is somehow dumber than Romo. Romo took until year 10 to get to that point in his command of the offense. So Dak still has three years left. Right now there are a few DCs who are smarter than both Dak and Moore and those guys get the better of the matchup. Giving Dak a new OC should really help him against those guys. Even if the OC is not as "brilliant" as Moore.. He will be different.. and hopefully he, unlike Moore, will have a better gut for calling plays. He will attack matchups from the jump instead of playing hunt and peck against the defense early in games. If a starting DB goes out he will call a 9 route against his replacement every time. He will continue to run the ball even if it's not tearing it up because he will understand the need to stay balanced especially in a tight defensive battle where one mistake .. one tipped ball INT, one bad read, one sack fumble can lose you the game. He will be satisfied to play field position in those games.. and we will win more of them with the defense we have.


P.S. And the new OC will hopefully get rid of that damn delay draw up the middle with no one blocking the DE.

 

[khiladi]

Our deep ball was taken away, because defenses started playing way more zone and taking the short, underneath passing game. I told you guys before that teams used up he content with playing Dak in man coverage and putting extra men in the box to stop the RG.

So the offense would get favorable 1 on 1 matchups on the outside. It’s why Michael Gallup ran 71 go routes in 2021 and it was only October.

I always felt teams overly compensated for our RG and this was more than evident when you’d watch Dak play against teams like the Saints when they had the best rushing defense in football and didn’t have to dedicate resources to stop the RG. Dak looked like a train wreck at the QB position.

 

[morat1959]

Easy…Dak! Dak limits any OC in his play calling. Moore won’t be the last he gets fired.

 

[Coogiguy03]

The reason is simple.. Moore inherited Garrett's "paint by numbers" approach to play calling. They have a formula for certain plays in certain down and distances against certain defensive looks and they stick to it .. Ray Lewis and his bunch were the first to tell us back in 2008 when they closed down Texas Stadium.. They knew what we were doing based on the looks they gave us and the formations we would come out in based on situations. It has been a recurring theme ever since. The only time it wasn't was 2014-2016 because in those first two seasons Romo reached the point where he would audible out of anything stupid that was sent in and get us into a play tailor made to make the defense wrong. Then in 2016 they had to run a completely different offense to fit a rookie QB. Now we still see it.. DBs standing in the exact spot our receivers are trying to get to before they ever even get out of their breaks. We seen linebackers dropping right into the passing lanes we want to throw in. On running plays defenses are in our backfield so fast at times you would think our line never got out of their stances.

I have said many times that in order for this offense to succeed against a really good defense and a really good coordinator Dak has to get to that level of command of the offense that Romo reached at the end of 2013 heading into 2014. He's not there yet. Some will chime in that he will never get there and maybe he won't. But I am not about to declare that Dak is somehow dumber than Romo. Romo took until year 10 to get to that point in his command of the offense. So Dak still has three years left. Right now there are a few DCs who are smarter than both Dak and Moore and those guys get the better of the matchup. Giving Dak a new OC should really help him against those guys. Even if the OC is not as "brilliant" as Moore.. He will be different.. and hopefully he, unlike Moore, will have a better gut for calling plays. He will attack matchups from the jump instead of playing hunt and peck against the defense early in games. If a starting DB goes out he will call a 9 route against his replacement every time. He will continue to run the ball even if it's not tearing it up because he will understand the need to stay balanced especially in a tight defensive battle where one mistake .. one tipped ball INT, one bad read, one sack fumble can lose you the game. He will be satisfied to play field position in those games.. and we will win more of them with the defense we have.


P.S. And the new OC will hopefully get rid of that damn delay draw up the middle with no one blocking the DE.

The draw can stay the curls can go the bootleg play can go the one we ran before the playoffs

 

[RonnieT24]

The draw can stay the curls can go the bootleg play can go the one we ran before the playoffs

I don't know what you mean by this one.. The bootleg is one of our best plays. It gets Dak out of the pocket instead of leaving him a sitting duck when the line is getting beat and it creates stress on the defense to either come up and play him or drop and let him run for yards or dump it to one of the tight ends. Though that would be more of a weapon if Dak would go to Michael Johnson's speed school over the summer and come back running at least a 4.6.

 

[acr731]

Was there a reason why we were so predictable, was there a reason why Kellen didn't call certain plays for dak, have dak throw it deep more, why we use so many curl routes, etc etc? We have a lot to say about him, but is there a reason why he was so limited in doing what he did? Please give your thoughts!

Have you considered that maybe, just maybe, there was no trust in the QB being able to complete much more than simple curl routes?

 

[DUO_CORE]

Was there a reason why we were so predictable, was there a reason why Kellen didn't call certain plays for dak, have dak throw it deep more, why we use so many curl routes, etc etc? We have a lot to say about him, but is there a reason why he was so limited in doing what he did? Please give your thoughts!

Yes, because we watched every single game very very intently.

 

[G2]

When you abandon the run game and don't use play-action until the 3rd quarter in a win or go home game you shouldn't be calling plays.
We've had opposing players state they new what was coming.
Pollard wasn't utilized until year 4.
Elliott got run into the ground playing with leg injuries.
Route concepts put WRs into more traffic instead of spreading it out.
Unless the WRs create seperation, the predictability hinders the offense.

Moore needed to go.

 

[CowboyoWales]

McCarthy pulled Moore back Because of DAK limitations.

As with most every aspect with Dak....he could throw long, but you were never sure about that consistency....hence play the percentage.
Recently he's really struggled on the in-routes always seemed late (and behind) on the throw.

 

[erod]

Was there a reason why we were so predictable, was there a reason why Kellen didn't call certain plays for dak, have dak throw it deep more, why we use so many curl routes, etc etc? We have a lot to say about him, but is there a reason why he was so limited in doing what he did? Please give your thoughts!

1. You can only call what your quarterback can actually do.

2. A quarterback, and he can check into any play he wants based on the defensive look he sees.

3. The ball was in Dak's hand, and he chose which route to throw it to. Not Moore.

4. We're about to find out a lot more about Kellen Moore now that he's calling plays for Justin Herbert.

 

[acr731]

4. We're about to find out a lot more about Kellen Moore now that he's calling plays for Justin Herbert.

There's going to be some really upset peeps if the Bolts make the AFCCG next season.... It won't change the Dak-stans views, though.

 

[kevm3]

Garrett lineage and no time to develop as an OC. He pretty much went from backup to QB coach, to OC in a few years. He should have been under a coaching tree learning the game and watching what someone experienced does in critical situations. Instead, he is left to experiment on the fly and to try to figure it out. Not really his fault, but another victim of the Jerry fast track

 

[erod]

There's going to be some really upset peeps if the Bolts make the AFCCG next season.... It won't change the Dak-stans views, though.

Can you imagine that job interview?

"Guys, I had about 15-20 plays he could run. I just tried to disguise it with different looks. I have volumes of more play concepts, here they are, and Herbert can run them."

 

[RonnieT24]

There's going to be some really upset peeps if the Bolts make the AFCCG next season.... It won't change the Dak-stans views, though.

You really think people are going to care what the Chargers do next year? I mean I may watch them from time to time if only to see if Moore has actually learned anything. LIke I said at the outset.. I wish Moore well. I have nothing against him personally and will be happy for him if he succeeds. Though full disclosure I will be pissed if he goes to SD and starts actually using the running game for more than just a place holder for his next brilliant series of pass plays in big games. People look at the Cowboys pass/run distribution over the course of the season and conclude that they were somewhat balanced. In reality they weren't. They were just so good in some games that they blew teams out and spend the entire 4th quarter handing off and just trying to get out of the game without any injuries. The pass/run distribution in tight games would be more telling I think. Especially in losses.

I think it also bears stating that sometimes it takes getting fired for guys to see the light. It took getting canned in Cleveland for Hoodie to figure it out in New England. Some guys are just better on their second try. For Moore's sake I hope he's one of them because if he can't get the Chargers over the hump his career as an OC will be over. If he screws up that QB and that group of receivers his name will be mud around the league.

 

[Acheman08]

Have you considered that maybe, just maybe, there was no trust in the QB being able to complete much more than simple curl routes?

Thats what I have been thinking the last few seasons, maybe thats all Dak can do. We all know he isnt good at timing or accuracy routes (tho sometimes he will hit one every once in a while, but its rare). But, to be fair there are some really dumb plays called at times.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Actually, the guy in San Diego that Moore replaced was more like Garrett. The chargers, when hiring Moore, just like when Jerry started revoking they reigns from Jason Garrett as a play-caller spoke about the need for running the ball to maximize the talents of the QB. Joe Lombardi, like Garrett, relied solely on the arm of his QB to move the offense:



This number also demonstrates the myth among Dak-stans that Moore wasn’t putting the QB in favorable conditions to maximize his play and wasn’t running the .

As even Staley pointed out when they want with Moore, it’s the threat of the run game that opened up the explosive passing game, just like it did for the Cowboys when Linehan and Romo worked together. Play action for the Cowboys was generally an explosive play call, while for Dak is was to make the offense simpler.



Dak-fans were looking for any excuse to bash Moore, but there is a reason Moore was picked up in “a matter of seconds”.
As I said in the other post, Chargers fans were livid that Lombardi was not challenging downfield with the phenom QB they have and even when they did, it was mostly Lombardi not knowing what to do, so he’d just have Herbert try and find guys open downfield.

As I said, claiming Garrett and Moore are alike is comical. Moore got as much as he could out of Dak. This year they told him to be aggressive and throw, because it’s most likely they knew he kept sitting on his routes, as he’s slow processing the field. Thus aggressiveness probably explains all the picks, particularly the pick 6s, because no matter what, the QB we have here is limited. Dak is who he is.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id...rgers-hiring-kellen-moore-new-oc?platform=amp

Do you ever make a post that is not about Dak? Are you capable?