WFT Releases QB Haskins

[RustyBourneHorse]

And then some!

Yup!

 

[SteveTheCowboy]

Here you go you condescending know it all. And thats from the year 2000. So i am giving you an even bigger spread.

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl...t-round-since-2000/16obdsowna7kk1gnhl9iqrp2pg


"Ranking every NFL quarterback drafted in the first round since 2000
From Aaron Rodgers to JaMarcus Russell — the last 20 years have proven that drafting a QB in the first round is far from an exact science"

Go take a look at that list of winners and tell me we should drop a solid QB and pray. Please. Go look. Read it over your coffee.

Than presume to tell me that Beathard is better than Mahomes and Watson again.

Good work!

 

[phildadon86]

This is why I don't tank for draft spots. Especially for over-rated college QB's.

Read the article i posted above. Goes to show you how hard it really is to hit on a QB.

Some posters would have you believe it makes sense to just keep drafting QBs until you hit. When you have a guy under center the team loves and will die for, and plays at an all pro level. You keep him. Plain and simple.

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

How about this..

You show me a list of QBs drafted since 2016 and I’ll answer.

Otherwise it’s too early and I haven’t had coffee and I’m not doing that much work so you can make the stupid point that drafting QBs in the first round is bad or whatever.

I posted a list of QBs taken in the first round since 2015 earlier. I could even go back to 2014 if needed.

 

[CATCH17]

I posted a list of QBs taken in the first round since 2015 earlier. I could even go back to 2014 if needed.

Link..?

That link he sent is too scattered.

 

[SteveTheCowboy]

Read the article i posted above. Goes to show you how hard it really is to hit on a QB.

Some posters would have you believe it makes sense to just keep drafting QBs until you hit. When you have a guy under center the team loves and will die for, and plays at an all pro level. You keep him. Plain and simple.

I may not be Dak's biggest fan....and very far from a hater....I've made it known I want Dak over Lawrence...EASILY.

For me....Dak is 80% away from being my perfect QB. I won't get into specifics unless asked (it's mostly just my opinion rather than cold hard facts and stats)....but that's pretty good in my book.

I'm not giving that up for a costly pick that is unproven. The contract? I dunno.....I'll leave that up to the accountants in Frisco. I feel if we draft well....and make some solid FA moves....we can absorb a big QB contract and still be competitive. But hey what do I know about GMing an NFL team? {shrug}

 

[phildadon86]

I may not be Dak's biggest fan....and very far from a hater....I've made it known I want Dak over Lawrence...EASILY.

For me....Dak is 80% away from being my perfect QB. I won't get into specifics unless asked (it's mostly just my opinion rather than cold hard facts and stats)....but that's pretty good in my book.

I'm not giving that up for a costly pick that is unproven. The contract? I dunno.....I'll leave that up to the accountants in Frisco. I feel if we draft well....and make some solid FA moves....we can absorb a big QB contract and still be competitive. But hey what do I know about GMing an NFL team? {shrug}

Thats the thing. We CAN pay dak and field a good team. Some would have you believe that its impossible. But if we pay Dak and draft our D players well. We will be fine and there is a window there. People will complain about anything. Like I said in the other thread. We could have Mahomes, and people would complain if he missed an open receiver, got sacked holding the ball, etc. Its being a fan.

When you make up things to justify your point. You look like an idiot lol

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

Exactly, and then I see posts like, "Well, if he doesn't work out, we can just draft another." To me, yes, you may hit the jackpot, but there's a higher likelihood of flopping. If you flop, you could potentially set your franchise back by decades. For QB flops, look at the Browns, Jets, Dolphins (before Tua who is a rookie), Buccaneers before Brady, and the Broncos since Peyton. Look how many QBs the Browns and Jets have gone through. The Cardinals before Kyler Murray went through a slew of QBs too.

Drafting poorly in general will set your team back. We don't even have to look outside the division to see this. The WFT hasn't exactly got a record of great QBs lately. Since 2007, the Commanders/WFT have only made the playoffs in 2012 and 2015. They won a playoff game in neither of those matchups. They haven't won a playoff game since 2005 when they were QBd by Mark Brunell (who was in his 11th season), Jason Campbell, and Patrick Ramsey. In addition, since 2005, they have had losing seasons (below .500) in 2006, 2009, 2010 (when they were QBd by Donovan McNabb), 2011, 2013, 2014, 2017, 2018, and 2019. That is 9 such seasons in 15 seasons! Think of how many high draft picks that they have had. BTW, their record in those losing seasons? 5-11, 4-12, 6-10, 5-11, 3-13, 4-12, 7-9, 7-9, and 3-13. So, when they have losing seasons, they tend to fail in style!

Furthermore, and going back to what I was saying earlier, there haven't been many 1st round QB gems since 2015.

2015 1st round QBs:
Jameis Winston - Garbage
Marcus Mariota - Garbage

2016 1st round QBs:
Jared Goff - Average at best
Carson Wentz (Eagles traded a lot to get him) - Average at best/Garbage
Paxton Lynch - Garbage and BUST

The best QB in this draft was selected in a comp pick 4th round pick. I wonder which QB that was and which team picked him......oh yes, Dak! Selected by the Cowboys! Amazing!

2017 1st round QBs (best of the draft classes):
Mitch Trubsiky - Just now seeing the light, but has been putrid.
Patrick Mahomes - Brilliant. One of the all time greats
Deshaun Watson - great QB on a garbage team

2018 1st round QBs:
Baker Mayfield - may finally have something there, but turns the ball over a lot
Sam Darnold - Garbage/Garbage team
Josh Allen - Excellent QB, best of this draft class
Josh Rosen - BUST
Lamar Jackson - Brilliant running ability, decent arm

2019 1st round QBs:
Kyler Murray - Great QB
Daniel Jones - Average at the moment
Dwayne Haskins - Bust and just got cut

That's 4 maybe 5 if you want to count Baker solid/Excellent QBs since 2015. I'm not counting 2020 because rookies take time to develop. With that said, this is a PATHETIC record for 1st round QBs. Then you have 5 or 6 average first round QBs, and 6 garbage QBs in that span. 15 QBs, and 4-5 solid/excellent/brilliant QBs. So, at best, we have seen only one third of those QBs be brilliant. In fact, only Patrick Mahomes is the kind of QB that you can truly say doesn't need all that much help given how elite he is, though having Travis Kelce and the Cheetah on offense helps. Oh, and their defence is excellent. Yet some think a 1st round QB is a cure all to end all? Imagine deciding that you don't want to keep a proven commodity in Dak and you end up with a Dwayne Haskins or Josh Rosen. Guess what? Now you've just dug yourselves a massive hole. Oh, and you have other areas on your team that you need much more desperately. With the way our defence is, specifically against the run, we can't afford a bust QB. So, let's look at the QBs this draft that are slated as first round picks.

Sure, you have Barbie Lawrence, but he can practically begin moving to Jacksonville at this point barring some unforeseen circumstance occurring. After Barbie Lawrence, there aren't many QBs that I can see in this draft that are a sure fire QB. The BYU QB looks decent, but he will need development. Justin Fields might be good, but I'm not sold on him. Trey Lance of North Dakota State is probably the only 1st round QB that we have a shot at that looks good. He is a small school QB like a certain QB in our division that hasn't exactly panned out that great aside from one season. At this moment, we need LB, Safety, and DT (to compliment Gallimore) much more than we need QB at the moment.

@CATCH17 this is what I posted earlier

 

[phildadon86]

Link..?

That link he sent is too scattered.

No its not. You just dont want to look at it. Its literally a link you can open and scroll down but you dont want to look even more dumb.

Ill put it this way.

There have been 56 QB's taken in the first round since 2000. Out of them. There is maybe 20 of note in that list.

Would you like me to also do math for you? Because that isn't going to make your point look any better.

Drafting a QB is risky no matter how good they look in college. You refuse to believe that and would like our team to draft a QB, if he busts, draft another one. How has that worked out for Cleveland? Jacksonville? Jets?

You can pretend its so EASY to pick a QB in the first round. ITS NOT. No matter how much you blab about it. And your amazing QB evaluation skills.

 

[phildadon86]

@CATCH17 this is what I posted earlier

Dont bother. I posted a link of QBs in the first round since 2000. It makes his IDEA of drafting a QB even more stupid. He wont listen.

Lets never forget. This is the same guy who thought Beathard would be better than Mahomes in the NFL.

here is the link if you want to look.

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl...t-round-since-2000/16obdsowna7kk1gnhl9iqrp2pg

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

No its not. You just dont want to look at it. Its literally a link you can open and scroll down but you dont want to look even more dumb.

Ill put it this way.

There have been 56 QB's taken in the first round since 2000. Out of them. There is maybe 20 of note in that list.

Would you like me to also do math for you? Because that isn't going to make your point look any better.

Drafting a QB is risky no matter how good they look in college. You refuse to believe that and would like our team to draft a QB, if he busts, draft another one. How has that worked out for Cleveland? Jacksonville? Jets?

You can pretend its so EASY to pick a QB in the first round. ITS NOT. No matter how much you blab about it. And your amazing QB evaluation skills.

Exactly, and there have been 4 great QBs drafted in the first round since 2015. If you miss on a QB, you can't just simply say, "oh well, we will just have to take another one." That's how you end up being the Browns and Jets. You set yourself back if you draft poorly.

 

[phildadon86]

Exactly, and there have been 4 great QBs drafted in the first round since 2015. If you miss on a QB, you can't just simply say, "oh well, we will just have to take another one." That's how you end up being the Browns and Jets. You set yourself back if you draft poorly.

Exactly.

Lets keep drafting until we hit.

Anyone who says that couldnt have been a fan during the post Aikman years.

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

Dont bother. I posted a link of QBs in the first round since 2000. It makes his IDEA of drafting a QB even more stupid. He wont listen.

Lets never forget. This is the same guy who thought Beathard would be better than Mahomes in the NFL.

here is the link if you want to look.

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl...t-round-since-2000/16obdsowna7kk1gnhl9iqrp2pg

Brilliant list! Goes to show how hard drafting a successful QB in round 1 is. You have to consider what's between the ears, his intangibles, and leadership skills just to name a few beyond just his abilities.

 

[CATCH17]

No its not. You just dont want to look at it. Its literally a link you can open and scroll down but you dont want to look even more dumb.

Ill put it this way.

There have been 56 QB's taken in the first round since 2000. Out of them. There is maybe 20 of note in that list.

Would you like me to also do math for you? Because that isn't going to make your point look any better.

Drafting a QB is risky no matter how good they look in college. You refuse to believe that and would like our team to draft a QB, if he busts, draft another one. How has that worked out for Cleveland? Jacksonville? Jets?

You can pretend its so EASY to pick a QB in the first round. ITS NOT. No matter how much you blab about it. And your amazing QB evaluation skills.

So I look at that and I see about 7 to 8 solid QBs.

3 of them had teams that went to a Super Bowl.

We have a couple MVPs.

This did nothing to sway me from drafting a QB.

Im more scared to pay a QB and risk mediocrity than I am to draft a guy and shoot for the moon.

Show me the list of mega deal QBs winning Superbowls.. That’s my problem with Dak. Always has been.

Rookie QB contracts and vets taking pay cuts are what is winning titles.

These guys eating up 10% or more of the cap space are difficult to win with and I’d rather be terrible than locked into mediocrity.

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

Exactly.

Lets keep drafting until we hit.

Anyone who says that couldnt have been a fan during the post Aikman years.

Exactly, that period between 2000-2006 sucked!!! We only got out of it because Sean Payton got us Tony Romo as UDFA and snatched him away before the Broncos could up their offer. And then we lucked into Dak when we did. Jerry is not good at drafting QBs. Remember Quincy Carter? Stephen McGee? Those of you calling for a change in QB, do you REALLY trust Jerry to select a QB? This is the same owner who wanted Johnny Manziel. That's right! We almost had Johnny Manziel over Zach Martin! Only because of Stephen did we take Martin! And you want HIM to draft a QB in round 1? That's reason enough to keep Dak!

 

[phildadon86]

So I look at that and I see about 7 to 8 solid QBs.

3 of them had teams that went to a Super Bowl.

We have a couple MVPs.

This did nothing to sway me from drafting a QB.

Im more scared to pay a QB and risk mediocrity than I am to draft a guy and shoot for the moon.

Show me the list of mega deal QBs winning Superbowls.. That’s my problem with Dak. Always has been.

Rookie QB contracts and vets taking pay cuts are what is winning titles.

These guys eating up 10% or more of the cap space are difficult to win with and I’d rather be terrible than locked into mediocrity.

Oh my God you are actually ridiculous. Im done with this convo. You need help.

You dont care about drafting QB's for the next 2 decades as long as the CAP is ok.

We can PAY Dak and field a competent defence. Thats the last I speak to you on this subject. You are obviously agenda driven and facts dont matter to you.

 

[CATCH17]

Oh my God you are actually ridiculous. Im done with this convo. You need help.

So what’s wrong.

7 or 8 solid QBs...

What’s debatable?

Our backup QB can get the same results as our starter for a small fraction of the cost.

Im paying elite and letting the solids walk and as you can see solid QBs are abundant.

That list doesn’t even factor in Burrow, Tua, and Herbert.


We need to build a great team.. Paying the QB will just lead to you guys crying about the rest of the team not being good enough for him like you do now.

 

[SteveTheCowboy]

Link..?

That link he sent is too scattered.

It's not too scattered even for a scatter brain like you. Just scroll down. Sure there's some junk in between....but....There's not a lot of detail...you should be able to just read the names and tell what's going on.

 

[SteveTheCowboy]

So what’s wrong.

7 or 8 solid QBs...

What’s debatable?

Our backup QB can get the same results as our starter for a small fraction of the cost.

Im paying elite and letting the solids walk and as you can see solid QBs are abundant.

That list doesn’t even factor in Burrow, Tua, and Herbert.


We need to build a great team.. Paying the QB will just lead to you guys crying about the rest of the team not being good enough for him like you do now.

Those guys are too new to assess. Come on. Barely played.

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

So what’s wrong.

7 or 8 solid QBs...

What’s debatable?

Our backup QB can get the same results as our starter for a small fraction of the cost.

Im paying elite and letting the solids walk and as you can see solid QBs are abundant.

That list doesn’t even factor in Burrow, Tua, and Herbert.


We need to build a great team.. Paying the QB will just lead to you guys crying about the rest of the team not being good enough for him like you do now.

But, if you miss, then you set yourself back even further. Outside of Trevor Lawrence, this draft class isn't that good, and do you really trust Jerry to pick the right guy in round 1? And don't say "we can just pick another QB if we miss". It's not that simple. The draft isn't 1-800-Elite-Quarterback. And we have other needs that we have to fill. I'm not objecting to taking a QB at any point in the draft. I'm just cautioning about taking a QB first round when we have defencive issues that if we don't fix this year will haunt us even more next year. I'd probably take Mac Jones in round 3. This allows us to develop him. We wouldn't need to play him his rookie season because we'd have Dak. However, if something happens, we'd have someone available without burning too much draft capital when we need the bigger cannon fodder for more important positions.