What would you do about Roy? Trade him?

[Hostile]

This season, his interceptions came when the game was out of hand , what a playmaker.

Let's go to school.

Name a better playmaker at Safety.

 

[WoodysGirl]

This season, his interceptions came when the game was out of hand , what a playmaker.

Why discredit the INT? No matter when it occurred, if he drops it, then he gets bashed for having stone hands.

 

[dallasfaniac]

So is it your contention that the people on this board are more qualified to produce "facts" than the ex-players whom the networks pay to provide analysis?

I already told you the facts: No one outside of the Dallas Cowboy's organization knows diddly. Which is why I said if the coaches know he is a liability and want to trade him, so be it. But until that time I must believe that he is doing what they want, otherwise they would bench him.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

But that's EXACTLY what the Patriots did -- and that's all you have to do against that coverage, if it is what you think it is.

You run the tight end right at Roy at the goal line. Roy immediately covers him, because he's in his zone. The tight end turns outside, and Roy has to stay with him because it could be a hook and the tight end could stay right there, in his zone. Meanwhile, the outside receiver runs a post into the back of the end zone, behind Roy. If Roy stays on the tight end, the tight end keeps going outside, pulling Roy out of the throwing lane to Moss. If Roy drops into the back of the end zone, the tight settles in at the front instead of drifting outside and makes an easy catch at the goal line with nobody there to cover him.

THAT is the problem with the scheme. The only way to cover both the tight end at the goal line and the receiver in the back of the end zone is for Hamlin to get out of the middle of the field (where no receivers were) and get over to Moss sooner. We had three defenders in the end zone on the left side of the field against two receivers, Hamlin in the middle against no receivers and only two guys on the right against two receivers. If Hamlin slides over -- or even if Ware drops on HIS side instead of crossing all the way over to the left side -- we have balanced coverage, and Hamlin (or Ware) is in better position to defend against Moss.

Nice explanation Adam.

 

[AdamJT13]

I agree. But notice whose assignments are attacked?

The Patriots attacked all of our secondary at one time or another. And they attacked Roy the least.

That's not coincidence. It's design. The opposing offense pressures him to think and react quickly - he doesn't ,they score.

It doesn't matter who the defender is, if the coverage scheme requires him to cover two players 10 yards apart, he'll never succeed.

 

[zrinkill]

This season, his interceptions came when the game was out of hand , what a playmaker.

What I find very funny about these kind of stupid statements is, if Roy had made a bad play in a game we easily won ..... these kids would be hanging him for it.

Just like that missed tackle during the bears game.

pathetic.

 

[ScipioCowboy]

Can't be true Adam. He assures me that Roy makes very few big plays.

I wish you and I knew what we were talking about.

There's absolutely no question that Roy makes big plays.

The issue for me is the extent to which he's a liability in coverage? Put simply, do the bad plays negate the good plays?

Jacksonville, for instance, used to have this explosive punt returner (whose name escapes me). However, when he wasn't running kicks back for TDs, he was fumbling the ball to the other team.

Again, I'm not saying Roy fits that category, but my opinion of him is definitely in a state of transition.

 

[Hostile]

I agree. But notice whose assignments are attacked?

Roy Williams'

That's not coincidence. It's design. The opposing offense pressures him to think and react quickly - he doesn't ,they score.



And that was my point.

He needs to improve in that are for his and the team's good.

Of course it is design.

Come on Stash, you're one of the good football guys here. Put aside the media bandwagon for a second.

Let's talk about Bruce Smith. How did teams attack the Bills in Bruce's heyday?

Answer, they ran right at him. Why? Because his liability was run support.

Did this make him a bust?

Come on man. Does this even really need to be asked?

Why judge Roy any differently? Give him one litmus test and ignore the rest of it? Because the media harps on it?

Be truthful with me. Do you think Offensive coordinators salivate at the chance to have their players face him? If you do then you'd be sadly mistaken. They know that this guy can hurt him. How do they gameplan it then?

The same way they did Bruce Smith. They attacked where he was weak.

How did teams attack Deion? They made him have to make tackles by putting someone underneath his cover. This way either he had Safety help or he had to make a tackle. Why? Because throwing right at his Zone was suicidal.

Him not being great in coverage hardly makes him a bust. The guy is one of the best players on this team. It is foolish to think we can get better by removing him.

 

[I LOVE ME SOME ME!]

29 pages of this? Whoa.

 

[ScipioCowboy]

I already told you the facts: No one outside of the Dallas Cowboy's organization knows diddly.

Alright.

If you believe that no one outside the Cowboy organization is capable of accurately assessing or critiquing the organization (a group that would presumably include board members), I certaintly won't challenge you.

 

[Hostile]

Why discredit the INT? No matter when it occurred, if he drops it, then he gets bashed for having stone hands.

Because he likes the taste of his own feet.

 

[WoodysGirl]

There's absolutely no question that Roy makes big plays.

The issue for me is the extent to which he's a liability in coverage? Put simply, do the bad plays negate the good plays?

That's for you to decide. As you can tell by the unreal length of this thread, people are decidedly split on the issue.

My opinion says no. Others say yes.

 

[HighTechDave]

I say no. What he needs is a Ken Norton Jr or someone he'll respect, to TEACH HIM HOW TO TACKLE!!!!!

all I got...

 

[WoodysGirl]

Because he likes the taste of his own feet.

Hey, some people like toe jam.

 

[ScipioCowboy]

That's for you to decide. As you can tell by the unreal length of this thread, people are decidedly split on the issue.

My opinion says no. Others say yes.

I'm a definite maybe.

 

[Kangaroo]

Actually I think most people do not fear Roy anymore

People where afraid to go over the middle for a while in Dallas (his first couple years here) now everyone does it and does not blink. No one fears going over the middle or catching the ball anymore in Dallas. I use to be alright because Roy use to cause phantom drops because guys where worried about Roy. Since the rule changes in the last three years Roy is not feared anymore. He can no longer hit a defenseless wr rule; the 5 yard contact rule; then the Roy horse collar rule. All 3 of those rules have made Roy a non factor on this team. I use to believe Zimmer was part of Roy's problem yet i still see the same glaring weakness in his game from the past two years.

 

[Stash]

The Patriots attacked all of our secondary at one time or another. And they attacked Roy the least.

And yet the still scored two touchdowns against him?

It doesn't matter who the defender is, if the coverage scheme requires him to cover two players 10 yards apart, he'll never succeed.

Sorry, but I don't see it that way.

Roy had a zone to cover firstly, no matter what else happened.

He vacated that zone because of what Watson did in front of him which allowed Moss to open up behind him.

If he had let Watson go, Newman would have covered him.

That was the design of the coverage.

The Patriots schemed to attack the player that they felt would have the hardest time adjusting to the play.

And they were right.

And for the record, I don't agree with playing zone so close to the endzone.

 

[dallasfaniac]

Alright.

If you believe that no one outside the Cowboy organization is capable of accurately assessing or critiquing the organization (a group that would presumably include board members), I certaintly won't challenge you.

Did I say no one could guess right? No. I only state that they don't know, they are 'guessing', which gives them no more credibility than anyone on these boards. The fact that Dallas hasn't benched Roy but try to take advantage of his strengths and still put him in positions where he needs to cover only shows what they feel they have in the player.

 

[utrunner07]

i keep thinking this thread will go away...but everytime i look it seems to be back at the top.

 

[dallasfaniac]

i keep thinking this thread will go away...but everytime i look it seems to be back at the top.

It was just starting to fall off when you posted. Doh! Back up again.