When Will Mo Officially Be A Bust?

[Alexander]

I'm not sure why it matters that they are drafted in the top-10

It matters a lot when you draft them top ten and trade resources to draft them.

I honestly am a little shocked I have to explain why it matters to you.

 

[Alexander]

Truthfully, I get tired of the same old argument and don't have the desire to go back and forth with him for an hour. It is useless to point out that only Alex and his minions could look at 3 seasons of 8-8 and 3 straight chances to win and go into the playoffs is a whole lot worse than going 3-13 and sucking outright.

I mean honestly, we're all just killing time on here, but that seems even more useless.

So I just give him an insult because I got nothing.

I appreciate that. You are a gentleman and a scholar.

 

[honyock]

Actually, Dallas was counting on Raghib Ismail not going to the Canadian Football League that year. Jimmy really didn't think he'd do it, but he did. At that point, Johnson had made the mistake of already trading for the #1 overall pick, when Ismail was the only true talent worthy of going #1 overall. Once Ismail was out of the picture, Jimmy was stuck with the first pick and in order to save face I remember him talking about controlling the draft, etc.

Maryland was a nice player, but in no way was he worth the first overall pick. There really wasn't anyone worth that choice one Ismail chose the CFL.

That makes sense. If I'd ever heard the part about them wanting Ismail, I had long since forgotten it. I do remember having the impression at the time that they were a little underwhelmed by ending up with Maryland as the #1 pick.

 

[Brooksey]

I will absolutely take their history over the reign Jones has had since Johnson left. Without hesitation.

If that means putting up with some lousy seasons where the organization ultimately recognizes failure, starts over and does not spin it as just a function of bad luck, yes.

Being 8-8 is purgatory. If you do not eventually9 break through, it is just much failure as three years of 5-11 if it means you do not acknowledge the problems and correct them.



Stop whining. We know you are right. I got it.

You can't pick and choose the history can you? Jerry fired Landry and hired Jimmy.He has three Super bowl rings. As much as I don't agree with some of his GM duties, I wouldn't bet my deck against him.

 

[AsthmaField]

That makes sense. If I'd ever heard the part about them wanting Ismail, I had long since forgotten it. I do remember having the impression at the time that they were a little underwhelmed by ending up with Maryland as the #1 pick.

Yeah, I remember it well because I had a man crush on Ismail and when Dallas made the trade a few days before the draft, I was ecstatic because Jimmy loved speed and I knew that's who who was going after. I, like Jimmy never thought the CFL could get him. Little did we know that that idiot CFL owner would throw crazy money at him in an effort to give the league legitimacy. Of course, Ismail eventually did make it to the NFL and even found his way to Dallas for a little while.

If I remember correctly, you never saw Jimmy make a trade like that before the draft ever again.

 

[Alexander]

You can't pick and choose the history can you? Jerry fired Landry and hired Jimmy.He has three Super bowl rings. As much as I don't agree with some of his GM duties, I wouldn't bet my deck against him.

He has done nothing since he captured lightning in a bottle with Jimmy Johnson. If that is something that does not register with you, kudos to a long memory.

We are rapidly approaching an entire generation of Cowboys fans that are no different than a lot of teams.

It has to be tough to hang your hat on a couple of wildcard round wins.

I honestly feel sorry for a fan of this team that has not witnessed the greatness I have been fortunate to see over and over again and I appreciate it and value it.

However, I do not use those memories to assume it will just happen again.

 

[AsthmaField]

I appreciate that. You are a gentleman and a scholar.

Thank you. I'm glad there are no hard feelings. It is always nice when fans can disagree on a subject and still remain close.

 

[Alexander]

Yeah, I remember it well because I had a man crush on Ismail and when Dallas made the trade a few days before the draft, I was ecstatic because Jimmy loved speed and I knew that's who who was going after. I, like Jimmy never thought the CFL could get him. Little did we know that that idiot CFL owner would throw crazy money at him in an effort to give the league legitimacy. Of course, Ismail eventually did make it to the NFL and even found his way to Dallas for a little while.

If I remember correctly, you never saw Jimmy make a trade like that before the draft ever again.

That was a crazy trade. Eleven to one and it was not even lopsided.

Never really have read much about that trade other than everyone insisted we meant to draft Maryland.

 

[Idgit]

It matters a lot when you draft them top ten and trade resources to draft them.

I honestly am a little shocked I have to explain why it matters to you.

If we were playing dodgeball right now instead of trading posts, your coach would be telling you you're supposed to dodge *before* the ball hits you in the face.

Anyway, you pulled an argument out of your backside, asked for examples to refute it, and you got them. It's as I said: sometimes players need time to develop into quality NFL starters--even at CB.

 

[lwehlers]

Well, he had no hope of ever being worth the trade up and the pick used on him.

That being said, I thought he'd at least be a solid CB running around impacting nothing. I didn't expect this level of bust.

I would have loved to see him in a Parcells camp. I think he may have quit by now.

But to answer your question, TD....is he a bust in terms of being an NFL player? Not yet. But the move to acquire him is one of the worst any team has ever made.

And these geniuses would do it again. That's the worst part.

if Claiborne cannot play the whole season this year I would consider him bust. also the jones have already done a stupid trade up in this past draft and from looks of it we may have drafted yet again another injury prone player.

 

[WPBCowboysFan]

I heard on the radio yesterday Mo Claiborne has played in three of the eleven pre-season games since joining the Cowboys. He seems to be constantly hurt and is taking a roster spot of someone who potentially could be on the field.

When is this guy officially a bust in your mind? If not, then who is?

And, do you think he may be the biggest bust of any player selected or picked up in free agency for any team in Dallas, and not just the Cowboys?

Have you ever considered joining the ranks of the DFW mediots. I really think you have what it takes.

 

[lwehlers]

Is RG3 as bust?

the jury is still out on RG3. if he does not get back to his rookie level he has the looking of a bad trade on the Commanders part.

 

[Idgit]

the jury is still out on RG3. if he does not get back to his rookie level he has the looking of a bad trade on the Commanders part.

I'd say he's already been a disappointment, and he was never really going to live up to that trade. They just gave up too much. If they gave up too much, and then whiffed, well, that's awesome. Then they can let him walk and he can rehabilitate from the bench in Dallas and get to play with Terrence again in a few years.

 

[AsthmaField]

That was a crazy trade. Eleven to one and it was not even lopsided.

Never really have read much about that trade other than everyone insisted we meant to draft Maryland.

Jimmy has such a golden reputation with trades and talent acquisition in general during his time in Dallas that people have trouble finding fault with anything he did then. He was very good, but he wasn't flawless.

I remember thinking at the time that surely nobody could believe that they didn't have Ismail in mind when they moved up to first overall. As much as Jimmy liked speed and as much as he didn't like Alexander Wright who he had drafted the year before and who couldn't catch at all. Then, add in that he took Alvin Harper with the 12th overall pick, proving that he wanted another WR, and it is clear that he wanted Ismail. He even drafted a poor copy of Ismail later in the draft when he took Damon Mays, a smaller, quicker WR who was in the mold of Ismail (only much less talented).

Jimmy had a vision of what type of team he wanted Dallas to be, and that started with fast... and Ismail was maybe the fastest player in pads that I've ever seen.

Plus, just common sense told you that there wasn't anyone worth moving up for except Ismail. He was the only player that had any rare qualities at all. Everyone else was like Maryland: a good player and first round worthy... but not someone you would give up a lot to move up to #1 overall for.

 

[Alexander]

It's as I said: sometimes players need time to develop into quality NFL starters--even at CB.

No, I posed a question to your vanilla response, which was "players need time".

Sorry, maybe my brain works differently. I do not bother debating things that are self evident.

And if it turns to "how much time", that goes back to my specific question, which you conveniently ignored.

 

[TwoDeep3]

Have you ever considered joining the ranks of the DFW mediots. I really think you have what it takes.

Considering I take that as a compliment. It's easy to sit on a message board and pop off. Being tasked to write as much as they do now with all the social media and the limited practice availability, those guys earn their money.

If you think they are mediots because they don't agree with you - a fan - then so be it.

But there are a lot of wannabe's here that can't last the season even giving recaps of the games on this site. deadlines and demanding editors make that even a tougher proposition.

Back when I was young and fresh out of the service I hung out at this nightclub. It was fun. Lots of women and rock and roll. I talked my way into working there. It was great for about a year. Then it became just like everything else, a job.

I suspect the requirements to be in the media here is daunting. I suspect those who call them mediots are a lot like I was before i worked at that spot for a while.

One last point - did you or anyone else that has toasted me on this thread noticed the first sentence I posted in the OP? Doesn't look like it.

 

[Idgit]

...And if it turns to "how much time", that goes back to my specific question, which you conveniently ignored.

Sorry...which question of yours did I ignore?

 

[Alexander]

Jimmy has such a golden reputation with trades and talent acquisition in general during his time in Dallas that people have trouble finding fault with anything he did then. He was very good, but he wasn't flawless.

Johnson was not much different from Gil Brandt/Schramm.

Brandt is hailed as an all timer genius, but he had huge mistakes. And a lot of misses where "our guy" got taken right in front of us.

You stockpile picks and you take shots. Not that hard.

It is just amazing we are doing the exact opposite and "roll the dice".

The price of having a wild catter, I guess.

 

[AsthmaField]

Johnson was not much different from Gil Brandt/Schramm.

Brandt is hailed as an all timer genius, but he had huge mistakes. And a lot of misses where "our guy" got taken right in front of us.

You stockpile picks and you take shots. Not that hard.

It is just amazing we are doing the exact opposite and "roll the dice".

The price of having a wild catter, I guess.

Montana and Rice... both guys that Brandt/Schramm had their collective eyes on. That is still hard to live with.

 

[TwoDeep3]

I had a media book back in 96 or so and went through each draft and figured out what Johnson really did.

If I recall, in five years he had something like 99 picks, of which he traded away down to about 69. Of those, the ones that started or played a significant role for this team from the draft was around 30. Then there were another dozen that stayed with the team past the first season.

The rest did not last one training camp.

So yes, he missed.

But there is no denying he hit big time and was also able to lead those men to championships.

Going from worst to first and hanging there for three maybe four seasons is amazing. Having seventeen years since without a sniff of the NFC Championship game, even though this team was 13-3 in one season is also amazing. But in a different way.