CFZ Why an elite nose guard is almost as important as an elite QB

[blueblood70]

"Why an elite nose guard is almost as important as an elite QB"
Come on, seriously? There have been some poor football takes on here, but this one is a doozy. I think we all understand the value an elite NT can bring to a team, but it isn't in the same neighborhood of an elite QB. Also, then you go on to say that with this belief you think DQ agrees with you because we drafted one in the 6th round last year and the 5th round this year and signed no one to really speak of at the position? Clearly he doesn't agree.

agreed 100% didn't bother reading went off title alone for my response.

 

[phildadon86]

They're valuable and grossly underrated by this front office.....but they aren't almost as important as an elite quarter back. It's not even close.

Not the only position this team doesnt care about.

Go look at safety. Derwin James was right there. LVE is what we got. I remember watching the war room cam and seeing them fist bumping and thought they had traded up for him.

Thats the last time I watched the war room.

 

[jazzcat22]

NFL Bizzaro land here.....anyone???

Not as bizarre as a fan of a team hating his own QB with a passion. That he wishes for bad games so he can toot his own horn over it.

 

[blueblood70]

Not as bizarre as a fan of a team hating his own QB with a passion. That he wishes for bad games so he can toot his own horn over it.

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

ill have to disagree without reading going by title only..the QB is and always has been they hardest to fill and find a gret qb..elite or not..DL DT DE all very important in team building as a CB/DB is i mean we are talking about team here..

sure if you get licky to get an elite defense to cover upa weak offense led by a lessor qb, yes then your debate becomes true but no ones trading an elite NT like umm who are they name them how many are there, for Tom Brady(or others like Montana, big ben, etc etc Pmanning etc etc) in his prime.

you have to have great talent everywhere so if its not NT its DE or 3T its not necessary to have an elite NT i dotn know many true 1T in this era that are considered elite. Not hybrids, true NTs.. name them? them, show me how they won a SB because of just their presence??

how many 1st round and 2nd round picks plus players are given up for a NT? i see this all over the league for QBs..rigfht or wrong QB is always king..

Again, by almost, I don't mean on par. I mean that it's in the top 5 of things you need in order to have a contender. I'll go with some Cowboys DTs that played a big role. Jethro Pugh is someone people have mentioned. When I watch videos of him, he made a big impact for the Doomsday Defense. In my mind, he was up there with Randy White in terms of importance, and it's a shame he's not in the HOF. Bob Lilly was a nose guard. I don't need to go into detail there on here. Russell Maryland was an important piece of the 90s D, and he was a DT as was Leon Lett and Tony Casillas. Oh and I saw mentions about Jimmie Jones. I don't think I need to go into that much detail as to what they did that set up our 90s D. And that's just a few of the DTs we've had that Jerry seems to have forgotten about and how important they were to our legendary defences. It's time we get back to that so we can make our defence legendary and bring back the Doomsday Defense.

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

Not as bizarre as a fan of a team hating his own QB with a passion. That he wishes for bad games so he can toot his own horn over it.

Not to mention that I'm pointing out that there's more to a successful team than just a QB. Yes, the starting QB is the most important player on an NFL team. You will never hear me argue otherwise, and that's not what I was saying with the title. I am, however, saying that it's one of the top 5 things you need. As stated, a top nose guard is how you stop an elite QB.

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

agreed 100% didn't bother reading went off title alone for my response.

Maybe I could've titled the thread differently then, but my point was that the Nose Guard is one of the top 5 things that you need.

 

[PAPPYDOG]

Not as bizarre as a fan of a team hating his own QB with a passion. That he wishes for bad games so he can toot his own horn over it.

How sad is it how the Cowboys Anti-Christ Prescott 666 has split the fan base........just another negative in the age of Dak friendly!

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

Not the only position this team doesnt care about.

Go look at safety. Derwin James was right there. LVE is what we got. I remember watching the war room cam and seeing them fist bumping and thought they had traded up for him.

Thats the last time I watched the war room.

That said, our safety play was better last season. Partly because we started rushing the QB better. If Ridgeway can be what we need him to be, then this defence can reach legendary levels with Parsons, Tank, Sam Williams, and Diggs.

 

[blueblood70]

Again, by almost, I don't mean on par. I mean that it's in the top 5 of things you need in order to have a contender. I'll go with some Cowboys DTs that played a big role. Jethro Pugh is someone people have mentioned. When I watch videos of him, he made a big impact for the Doomsday Defense. In my mind, he was up there with Randy White in terms of importance, and it's a shame he's not in the HOF. Bob Lilly was a nose guard. I don't need to go into detail there on here. Russell Maryland was an important piece of the 90s D, and he was a DT as was Leon Lett and Tony Casillas. Oh and I saw mentions about Jimmie Jones. I don't think I need to go into that much detail as to what they did that set up our 90s D. And that's just a few of the DTs we've had that Jerry seems to have forgotten about and how important they were to our legendary defences. It's time we get back to that so we can make our defence legendary and bring back the Doomsday Defense.

stay in our ear but RM umm in todays games hes a3T not big NT not an elite NT..
I said NOW today today's game ,todays defenses geared up tpo stop the pass 3-5 WR sets all day every day...who ,what DT is elite and how many have them show me?

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

How sad is it how the Cowboys Anti-Christ Prescott 666 has split the fan base........just another negative in the age of Dak friendly!

Why is it that every thread has to involve Dak with you? This thread has nothing to do with Dak other than the fact that this can help him. This has everything to do with the fact that a nose guard is a vital part of a team and is one of the top 5 things you need. Would the Doomsday Defense of the 70s been as legendary if not for the likes of Bob Lilly and Pugh? What happens to the 90s teams of you remove the nose guards we had then? What have we lacked since then, particularly under Garrett? That's one of the biggest legs that Jerry has overlooked.

 

[jazzcat22]

Not to mention that I'm pointing out that there's more to a successful team than just a QB. Yes, the starting QB is the most important player on an NFL team. You will never hear me argue otherwise, and that's not what I was saying with the title. I am, however, saying that it's one of the top 5 things you need. As stated, a top nose guard is how you stop an elite QB.

I have not heard the term in years. But they used to refer to a few players as being the "QB on defense" and at times that was the defensive signal caller. Usually a LB or I believe they had Darren Woodson doing it at the time. It was like he was the coach on the field. But you still need that DT to control the LOS and be the disruptor. I don't recall a DL being that signal caller though.

The held on to Tyrone Crawford way too long trying to make him that type of player, but he wasn't, and they missed out on many DT's because of it.

 

[jazzcat22]

How sad is it how the Cowboys Anti-Christ Prescott 666 has split the fan base........just another negative in the age of Dak friendly!

Dak has split nothing other than defenders on the field completing passes.

It is fans that have split brains that do not see him as a very good QB.

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

stay in our ear but RM umm in todays games hes a3T not big NT not an elite NT..
I said NOW today today's game ,todays defenses geared up tpo stop the pass 3-5 WR sets all day every day...who ,what DT is elite and how many have them show me?

Ok, Suh would be an example, at least recently. Vita Vea is another. He's a massive reason the Bucs had success. Between Suh and Vea, Mahomes was completely and utterly shut down. He had no time to throw, and the Chiefs couldn't run the ball.

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

I have not heard the term in years. But they used to refer to a few players as being the "QB on defense" and at times that was the defensive signal caller. Usually a LB or I believe they had Darren Woodson doing it at the time. It was like he was the coach on the field. But you still need that DT to control the LOS and be the disruptor. I don't recall a DL being that signal caller though.

The held on to Tyrone Crawford way too long trying to make him that type of player, but he wasn't, and they missed out on many DT's because of it.

Tbh, I learned the term from Mark Holmes, but the argument is still correct. Nose guard or nose tackles are very important, and Vita Vea is a big example.

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

Ok, Suh would be an example, at least recently. Vita Vea is another. He's a massive reason the Bucs had success. Between Suh and Vea, Mahomes was completely and utterly shut down. He had no time to throw, and the Chiefs couldn't run the ball.

Oh yes, and Aaron Donald is also a DT.

 

[blueblood70]

Ok, Suh would be an example, at least recently. Vita Vea is another. He's a massive reason the Bucs had success. Between Suh and Vea, Mahomes was completely and utterly shut down. He had no time to throw, and the Chiefs couldn't run the ball.

without Brady that doesn't happen, its why Winston gone, Brady in SB win..whatheppend last year those payers didn't help the bucs repeat? same 22 2nd round exit..

suhs been on a lot of teams and not all won Sbs or even won playoff game lol

 

[blueblood70]

Oh yes, and Aaron Donald is also a DT.

yes but not a NT not 1t not considered a big ugly..Hes streamlined 300lbs when dressed ..hes small fast and powerful rare breed name them all not even 5 yet we have 32 teams and the DL rotates a lot. however, without Stafford rams fell short with Donald...
.
we need Vince Wilfork but they don't grow on trees. but with a QB Wilfork has no rings,, ) Team game build teams, not positions. Our 90s teams on defense had few names but mostly depth and team effort with scheme helped us win those games.

 

[Jarntt]

Compared to Marinelli. And again, I am not saying that it's more or on par with QB. I'm just saying that it's one of the top 5 things a team needs to be a contender in my view. Marinelli never drafted nose guards. Now we've done it in two consecutive years. I'd have liked to have had Jordan Davis, but I was thrilled that we got Ridgeway, especially after Mark Holmes broke down the tape on Ridgeway. I think we are going to be very pleased with that selection. If he can be at least a good nose guard, which he seems like he can be, this will be the best defence we have seen in decades.

This clarification I agree with

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

without Brady that doesn't happen, its why Winston gone, Brady in SB win..whatheppend last year those payers didn't help the bucs repeat? same 22 2nd round exit..

suhs been on a lot of teams and not all won Sbs or even won playoff game lol

But, the combination of Vea and Suh made a big difference. Of course Brady made a huge difference too, and, again, I'm not saying that the starting QB isn't the most important. I'm just saying that those two did make a huge difference in their own way. Without them AND Brady, the Bucs don't win that SB. Brady turned that offense around, but the impact of Vea and Suh is undeniable.