Why are fans so afraid of taking a RB early?

[Cowboysheelsreds058]

Just saw a mock where we passed on Robinson and took the TE from ND and Cinn took Robinson with their pick. WOW!

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

The reason I compared him to AP is because that’s the only scenario where you get top 10 value out of drafting a RB (or even top 20 due to the position they play.) Even Zeke with his great first few years was not more valuable than the next 5 lineman taken after him.

If all we know is who they are right now, then position becomes the biggest value factor. If you believe positional value should not be heavily considered, do you believe it is not an enormous factor when comparing players?

How was Zeke not more valuable? They won 13 games with him and he got suspended the next season and the Cowboys only won 9 and missed out on the playoffs. Explain that one to me?

Positional value matters when comparing players. Yes. And Bijan still wins in that regard. And I disagree with needing AP in order to get value. If Bijan has...a Christian McCaffery season and I win a ring then I'm set. I don't care what he does he does the rest of the year.

Let me ask you....do you regret drafting Carson Wentz?

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Just saw a mock where we passed on Robinson and took the TE from ND and Cinn took Robinson with their pick. WOW!

Oh boy. If that happened.....I don't see that in a million years though. Just no way. That's not even consistent with what the Cowboys even do. They took Lamb and passed up on Chaisson when they had Cooper and Gallup.

 

[KJJ]

Just saw a mock where we passed on Robinson and took the TE from ND and Cinn took Robinson with their pick. WOW!

I would take a TE before I would take Robinson, but not sure I would take the one from ND. I would take Kincaid and wouldn’t even have to think about it.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Same arguments made years ago as to why we had to take Elliott.

Didn’t change the franchise. TBs have one of the least impacts position wise when you see how reliant they are on the OL, etc.

But Jerry likes his flashy toys, so it would not surprise me to see him go gaga over a TB again.

I know the objective is to win a SB but Zeke did help this team his first few years here. He was a big part in their success. And while Ramsey and Henry would've been better....Zeke did this team wonders. They drafted Zeke and kept the defense off the field for a few years. Won time of possession. If they objective was to fill a need Bosa was off the board so I had less of a issue going with Zeke. I liked him over Deforest Buckner. And even Ramsey to an extent. Ramsey/Henry proved to have been the better move though.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

I would take a TE before I would take Robinson, but not sure I would take the one from ND. I would take Kincaid and wouldn’t even have to think about it.

Interesting....so the TE in the 1st club....is it that you guys don't like Ferguson or think we incorporate both in the offense?

 

[darthseinfeld]

The biggest talking point I keep seeing about the whole "don't take a RB early" is because you can get one in later rounds and they don't last long.

Is it not a asset to take a RB in the 1st round?

I get him for 4 years with a option year which is 5 years on a favorable rookie deal.

I can think franchise him for one year at 11-12 million......

I'm getting 6 years of a guys young prime career on a affordable deal and I'm getting one of the better RB prospects in this draft....

Will you get 6 prime years out of any other position not Quarterback? Maybe wide receiver?

I'm just trying to figure out why should I be afraid to take a RB early like others seem to be. If I was the Eagles and had the 10th pick in the draft I for sure would think long and hard about Bijan Robinson.

You want a 1st round pick to be a two contract guy

 

[Typhus]

So you'd use a top 10 pick on a Punter or a Center?

Ha ha, good try.

 

[TwistedL0g1k]

The biggest talking point I keep seeing about the whole "don't take a RB early" is because you can get one in later rounds and they don't last long.

Is it not a asset to take a RB in the 1st round?

I get him for 4 years with a option year which is 5 years on a favorable rookie deal.

I can think franchise him for one year at 11-12 million......

I'm getting 6 years of a guys young prime career on a affordable deal and I'm getting one of the better RB prospects in this draft....

Will you get 6 prime years out of any other position not Quarterback? Maybe wide receiver?

I'm just trying to figure out why should I be afraid to take a RB early like others seem to be. If I was the Eagles and had the 10th pick in the draft I for sure would think long and hard about Bijan Robinson.

An analogy from a great recent article on the subject: Imagine having a coupon that entitled you to any product in a big store for free. Would you use that coupon on an expensive big screen TV or a toaster? The value of the coupon is entirely dependent on how you use it.

With the fixed slotted rookie salary scale, first round picks are similar. They represent savings. The savings are the difference between what an equivalent veteran would cost vs. what the rookie costs. The least savings is at the RB position. It's like using that coupon for a toaster.

Using first round picks wisely is how a team beats the salary cap.

 

[Kingofholland]

The biggest talking point I keep seeing about the whole "don't take a RB early" is because you can get one in later rounds and they don't last long.

Is it not a asset to take a RB in the 1st round?

I get him for 4 years with a option year which is 5 years on a favorable rookie deal.

I can think franchise him for one year at 11-12 million......

I'm getting 6 years of a guys young prime career on a affordable deal and I'm getting one of the better RB prospects in this draft....

Will you get 6 prime years out of any other position not Quarterback? Maybe wide receiver?

I'm just trying to figure out why should I be afraid to take a RB early like others seem to be. If I was the Eagles and had the 10th pick in the draft I for sure would think long and hard about Bijan Robinson.

I think it all depends where you're talent wise as a team. If you're team with uncertainty at RB and mostly everything else is in place why turn down making your team better with a skill player? If he's great for 4-5 years then you move on so be it, but maybe he's the weapon that puts your team over the top.

On the opposite end if I'm a team rebuilding with a number of holes I just don't see it being worth it.

 

[Acceptablename]

We've contended a lot with Zeke though.

ZEEK was exciting as hell when he first came out. First three years he was electric. And then his extension happened. I’m beginning to believe that you just can’t extend a running backs contract. There’s always exceptions to the rule

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

ZEEK was exciting as hell when he first came out. First three years he was electric. And then his extension happened. I’m beginning to believe that you just can’t extend a running backs contract. There’s always exceptions to the rule

Yeah I don't think its wise....but if you do....don't run him into the ground before you do it.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

You want a 1st round pick to be a two contract guy

In theory yes. But that's not realistic. Every 1st round pick won't be a two contract guy. And the Cowboys do a great job on 1st round picks which is why I'm willing to trade a 1st rounder for a Amari one year or one year take a RB in the 1st round. I'm getting 5 or 6 years of a running back on a cheap deal. I would not do this every year. But yes when I need a back I would for sure do it. Just not realistic to expect every guy in the 1st to be a two contract guy. Taco, Byron...just to name a few. Its gonna happen.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

An analogy from a great recent article on the subject: Imagine having a coupon that entitled you to any product in a big store for free. Would you use that coupon on an expensive big screen TV or a toaster? The value of the coupon is entirely dependent on how you use it.

With the fixed slotted rookie salary scale, first round picks are similar. They represent savings. The savings are the difference between what an equivalent veteran would cost vs. what the rookie costs. The least savings is at the RB position. It's like using that coupon for a toaster.

Using first round picks wisely is how a team beats the salary cap.

Yeah I don't agree with that analogy because before I read your second paragraph I thought you were saying BIjan would be the Big screen TV and the toaster was a Taco Charlton or someone lol.

I think using a 1st rounder on a guy like Bijan is using the cap wisely. Think its smart actually if done right.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

I think it all depends where you're talent wise as a team. If you're team with uncertainty at RB and mostly everything else is in place why turn down making your team better with a skill player? If he's great for 4-5 years then you move on so be it, but maybe he's the weapon that puts your team over the top.

On the opposite end if I'm a team rebuilding with a number of holes I just don't see it being worth it.

Oh for sure. This is all about teams that are contending. I would not do it if I'm a bad team or picking early.....now Eagles being an exception. Now if I'm the Eagles I don't think I'd do it. But I do think it would make sense for them to do it. Make too much sense honestly. But these teams are so caught up on what it takes to win when in theory there's no blueprint on what it takes to win. Every team wins a SB differently.

 

[Sydla]

How was Zeke not more valuable? They won 13 games with him and he got suspended the next season and the Cowboys only won 9 and missed out on the playoffs. Explain that one to me?

Positional value matters when comparing players. Yes. And Bijan still wins in that regard. And I disagree with needing AP in order to get value. If Bijan has...a Christian McCaffery season and I win a ring then I'm set. I don't care what he does he does the rest of the year.

Let me ask you....do you regret drafting Carson Wentz?

Two years before adding Elliott, team went 12-4 and got as far in the playoffs as the 2016 Elliott team and did that with a 3rd round TB.

Plow your valuable resources into important positions, find your TBs like many of the good teams do, elsewhere.

 

[darthseinfeld]

In theory yes. But that's not realistic. Every 1st round pick won't be a two contract guy. And the Cowboys do a great job on 1st round picks which is why I'm willing to trade a 1st rounder for a Amari one year or one year take a RB in the 1st round. I'm getting 5 or 6 years of a running back on a cheap deal. I would not do this every year. But yes when I need a back I would for sure do it. Just not realistic to expect every guy in the 1st to be a two contract guy. Taco, Byron...just to name a few. Its gonna happen.

Im not saying its realistic, but thats the idea. You want your first round pick to be a two contract player, and its generally considered an inefficient use of cap space giving a HB a 2nd contract. Those two beliefs are why people tend to be against a HB in the 1st round.

 

[Sydla]

I know the objective is to win a SB but Zeke did help this team his first few years here. He was a big part in their success. And while Ramsey and Henry would've been better....Zeke did this team wonders. They drafted Zeke and kept the defense off the field for a few years. Won time of possession. If they objective was to fill a need Bosa was off the board so I had less of a issue going with Zeke. I liked him over Deforest Buckner. And even Ramsey to an extent. Ramsey/Henry proved to have been the better move though.

Sure, Elliott was a plus player here. Don't mistake my argument as being Elliott wasn't that good. He was quite good.

But he didn't elevate the franchise beyond where they had been, say in 2014, when the were very good with a third round TB.

The reality is TB is not a game changing, franchise altering position. Use your prime assets on more valuable/important positions.

 

[SuperBowlz]

Sure, Elliott was a plus player here. Don't mistake my argument as being Elliott wasn't that good. He was quite good.

But he didn't elevate the franchise beyond where they had been, say in 2014, when the were very good with a third round TB.

The reality is TB is not a game changing, franchise altering position. Use your prime assets on more valuable/important positions.

The casual fan sees the TB scoring TDs, dancing in the end zone etc. It's the advanced fan who knows football is all about the OLine and DLine.

 

[Sydla]

The casual fan sees the TB scoring TDs, dancing in the end zone etc. It's the advanced fan who knows football is all about the OLine and DLine.

And let's think back to 2016. The only reason they took Elliott was because the Jones' panicked after the 2015 season, which wasn't very good. They had let Murray walk, the correct decision, after 2014 and couldn't replicate that success in 2015. But they erroneously thought it was the running game that was the culprit but it was the fact Romo was hurt. They had a TB run for 1000 yards in 2015 with crappy QB play but for some reason they went into the 2016 draft thinking the missing piece was the TB.

Just bizarre roster building.