Why are Gurley/Fournette considered better than Elliott?

Status
Not open for further replies.
VACowboy

VACowboy

Well-Known Member
Messages
7,006
Reaction score
3,896
GloryDaysRBack said:
Good write up...I agree w a lot here...I don't see any mccoy in Zeke though...mccoy is way quicker and way more shifty..zeke is quicker and shiftier than fournette for sure...I need to see more of gurley before I compare...
Click to expand...

Oh, I agree that McCoy is quicker. He oughtta be. He's 25 pounds lighter. But I think they both use quickness and vision to thrive in a zone run game. The great thing about Elliot, IMO, is that he can run off tackle behind man blocking too.
 

tyke1doe

Well-Known Member
Messages
54,312
Reaction score
32,716
VACowboy said:
Roger Craig is a great comparison, especially physically, but I think Zeke will be a better runner than Craig and maybe not quite the receiver. I think it's safe to say that Zeke will get a lot more opportunities to carry and a lot fewer to catch. Interesting, at least to me, is that both were fantastic track athletes. The only 40 time I could find for Craig is 4.8. That can't be right.
Click to expand...

4.8 doesn't really mean much in track because indoor and outdoor track sprinters don't run 40 meter races. 60 is the staple for indoor; 100 for out door.

A runner can have a slow forty split but gain speed down the stretch.

Besides quickness isn't necessarily indicative of overall speed.
 
VACowboy

VACowboy

Well-Known Member
Messages
7,006
Reaction score
3,896
tyke1doe said:
4.8 doesn't really mean much in track because indoor and outdoor track sprinters don't run 40 meter races. 60 is the staple for indoor; 100 for out door.

A runner can have a slow forty split but gain speed down the stretch.

Besides quickness isn't necessarily indicative of overall speed.
Click to expand...

When I said 40, I meant combine 40. I mentioned it because Craig was being compared to Elliot and lots of people think 40 times are ultra important. The only one I found for Craig was 4.8. http://www.answers.com/Q/How_fast_is_roger_Craig_40_yard_dash_time

I don't know anything about track. I just thought it was interesting that these guys were so physically similar, played RB at a high level and starred at track as well.

But you're preaching to the choir about quickness, speed and forty yards run in underwear, especially when judging RBs. A lot of people look at the 40-yard dash as the gospel of football speed metrics, however, so my point was kind of that LeSean McCoy is "a lot slower" than Fournette/Gurley too, with strengths similar to Zeke, and I don't think anyone would complain if Zeke turned out to be a similar player to McCoy.

Besides that, neither Gurley nor Fournette has run a 40 in Indianapolis, and Gurley didn't even run at the GA pro day,, so I don't see the point of comparing 40 times they supposedly ran to anyone's combine numbers. I bet Elliot would have run a hell of a lot faster if a team manager was timing him too.
 

tyke1doe

Well-Known Member
Messages
54,312
Reaction score
32,716
VACowboy said:
When I said 40, I meant combine 40. I mentioned it because Craig was being compared to Elliot and lots of people think 40 times are ultra important. The only one I found for Craig was 4.8. http://www.answers.com/Q/How_fast_is_roger_Craig_40_yard_dash_time

I don't know anything about track. I just thought it was interesting that these guys were so physically similar, played RB at a high level and starred at track as well.

But you're preaching to the choir about quickness, speed and forty yards run in underwear, especially when judging RBs. A lot of people look at the 40-yard dash as the gospel of football speed metrics, however, so my point was kind of that LeSean McCoy is "a lot slower" than Fournette/Gurley too, with strengths similar to Zeke, and I don't think anyone would complain if Zeke turned out to be a similar player to McCoy.

Besides that, neither Gurley nor Fournette has run a 40 in Indianapolis, and Gurley didn't even run at the GA pro day,, so I don't see the point of comparing 40 times they supposedly ran to anyone's combine numbers. I bet Elliot would have run a hell of a lot faster if a team manager was timing him too.
Click to expand...

Fair enough. I didn't mean my comments to be a negative critique on your post. I was just trying to add some perspective as a former track guy. :)
 
VACowboy

VACowboy

Well-Known Member
Messages
7,006
Reaction score
3,896
tyke1doe said:
Fair enough. I didn't mean my comments to be a negative critique on your post. I was just trying to add some perspective as a former track guy. :)
Click to expand...

Oh, I was agreeing with you. I guess I need to work on clarity.
 
texbumthelife

texbumthelife

Well-Known Member
Messages
22,738
Reaction score
23,273
FuzzyLumpkins said:
Zeke is 6' that isn't squatty. I don't see it. Zeke is a ZBS guy and Smith was all lead gap behind Moose. Different styles.

Barry was overrated because he was ineffective in the red zone to the point he was taken off the field. It's one thing to rotate. It's quite another to replace. I'm not saying he wasn't a great back but we're talking generational talent and trying to separate.

Zeke reminds me of Roger Craig.
Click to expand...

Was Emmitt all lead gap in college? That's what we have to compare at the moment.
 
FuzzyLumpkins

FuzzyLumpkins

The Boognish
Messages
36,574
Reaction score
27,859
VACowboy said:
Roger Craig is a great comparison, especially physically, but I think Zeke will be a better runner than Craig and maybe not quite the receiver. I think it's safe to say that Zeke will get a lot more opportunities to carry and a lot fewer to catch. Interesting, at least to me, is that both were fantastic track athletes. The only 40 time I could find for Craig is 4.8. That can't be right.

I think overall, a lot of people are underselling Elliot's strengths as a runner when comparing him to Fournette and Gurley. To me, Zeke looks like the quickest of the three, by far. He makes cuts and eludes tacklers that the other two guys just don't. I agree that Zeke probably isn't as strong, but I think he also sees the field better than Fournette or Gurley and therefore is better at exploiting holes and running lanes. I don't think it's a bad thing when a RB makes a guy miss instead of running over him. Elliot does fall forward when he's in a pile, though, which I think is more important than blowing linebackers up.

So while I like the Roger Craig comparison, Elliot looks like a bigger Lesean McCoy to me. They are both quick, with great vision and cutting ability that allows them to thrive in a zone running attack. An inch shorter and 24-lbs lighter, McCoy ran 02 faster than Elliot did at the Combine, so if the 40-yard dash is the end-all for football speed, I guess Shady is a bunch slower than Fournette/Gurley too. Although, Gurley didn't run at the Combine and Fournette is still in college, so I'm not sure the 40 comparisons are valid. The League should move the Combine to Blacksburg. Everyone would run a heck of lot faster.
Click to expand...

The yahoo answers 4.8 is unsubstantiated. He looks a lot faster than Kyle Wilber to me.
 
FuzzyLumpkins

FuzzyLumpkins

The Boognish
Messages
36,574
Reaction score
27,859
texbumthelife said:
Definitely man to man. I think he did a good bit of running without a FB though. I could be wrong. I am asking in earnest.
Click to expand...

Generally the dichotomy is between man/gap and ZBS. I just said lead gap with Emmitt to be more precise; he shared the backfield with Moose most snaps from what I can remember. OSU ran that type of thing too but they were a hybrid that ran both styles.

It might be Zeke's vision is better than 22 as ZBS is harder to read.

I just compare to taller backs because of his size. He doesn't run upright like Dickerson and there are not all that many taller backs in his mold. Craig is one of the few and has the receiver credentials as well.
 
vlad

vlad

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,507
Reaction score
2,436
FuzzyLumpkins said:
Zeke is 6' that isn't squatty. I don't see it. Zeke is a ZBS guy and Smith was all lead gap behind Moose. Different styles.

Barry was overrated because he was ineffective in the red zone to the point he was taken off the field. It's one thing to rotate. It's quite another to replace. I'm not saying he wasn't a great back but we're talking generational talent and trying to separate.

Zeke reminds me of Roger Craig.
Click to expand...

That's an interesting comparison - Roger Craig was very unique...and very good. I personally don't see it, but I'd take it!
 
ABQCOWBOY

ABQCOWBOY

Regular Joe....
Messages
58,929
Reaction score
27,716
When I watch Elliott run, I see more Fred Taylor. Taylor was a little bigger and maybe a little faster but I think their running styles are similar.
 

marchetta

Well-Known Member
Messages
4,185
Reaction score
1,653
Blair Thomas was considered better than Emmitt Smith when they entered the NFL. We all know how that turned out.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top