Why Does Tony Romo Have Leverage Over Anyone?

dstone2962

Member
Messages
82
Reaction score
14
Theres no use to have a team thats only asset is their quarterback. If a teams not good enough, they're simply not good enough. Its one thing to be bad and young but an entirely different thing to be bad and old and Dallas' veteran leadership is trending that way.
 

Beast_from_East

Well-Known Member
Messages
30,140
Reaction score
27,231
percyhoward;5028900 said:
Romo has leverage because the passing game took this performance by the rest of the team and turned it into an 8-8 record:

Rushing
yards 31st
yards per rush 31st
TD 27th

Defense
passer rating 29th
scoring 24th

The only other teams that finished out of the top 20 in all those five categories were Jacksonville and Oakland.

"Leverage" is an understatement for what Romo has at this time.

This is exactly what Aikman was saying, that we are a 3 win team without Romo.

The guys saying that would be fine because we would get a high pick obviously are not worried about ticket sales, Jerry is. I will pay $50 for parking, $12 for a beer, and $10 for a hot dog to watch Romo run around and make plays. I ain't paying that to watch some rookie led us to a 3 win season.
 

DenCWBY

Well-Known Member
Messages
7,170
Reaction score
5,929
dalexa1824;5028889 said:
Tony is a premier QB. Probably a better football player than Aikman or Staubach.Certainly a top 5 player in the present NFC. He has not won yet and may never but if your eyes dont see what a great player he is you are missing out.He reminds me of when Labron was in Cleveland. No respect even though he was clearly the best player in the league.When Labron got some help he also got respect.If Tony played in New England he would already have a Superbowl win. I hope he gets it in Dallas.If he does he is going to the HOF. Football is the ultimate team game. Hopefully he will soon get some help. There will be a lot of guys on the Zone who will have to eat Crow if our defense holds up and our offensive line keeps Tony from getting killed.He will do his part if we get him a supporting cast.

Whoa Thar!! Did Romo's mother just sign in?
 

Nightman

Capologist
Messages
27,121
Reaction score
24,038
Hoofbite;5028793 said:
Pretty sure they only own him like 11.5M.

The rest of his cap hit has come from all the previous years of reworking his contract.

If they tagged him, I don't think it would be quite $20M. Pretty sure the tag numbers are based off the top 5 base salaries and there's only 1 QB who has a base salary of $20M. Looks like it would be closer to 14M.

http://www.spotrac.com/top-salaries/nfl/quarterback/

So he's really only looking at having $25M in play for this season and next season.

If I had to guess what the hold up would be, it would be the structure of the contract and not the dollar amount.

I'm just guessing but I think Dallas is probably looking at more backloading than Tony or his agent would be comfortable with at his age. He really only has maybe 2-3 years before we have to wonder when he might slow down a little and that might be a little optimistic.

If his base salaries for the next 2 years are pretty low and his base salaries in the final 2 years are really high to where Dallas gets significant cap relief by cutting him, I think he'd be selling himself short by agreeing to it.

Lets take 5 years, $80M as a hypothetical example. SB of $4M per year leaves $60M in base salaries (not gonna work with roster bonuses or anything like that) that needs to be accounted for.

Code:
Base Salaries By Year (Cap Hit) [Dead Money]:

2013: $3M ($7M)
2014: $6M ($10M)
2015: $13M ($17M) [$12M]
2016: $18M ($22M) [$8M]
2017: $20M ($24M) [$4M]
On a deal like this he would make $23M in year 1 when including his SB and he'd make another $19M over the next two seasons if he stayed with the team. With $4M per year in dead money for each year that he doesn't play, you can pretty much be assured that he's going to make it through 2015. The team would only see about $5M in cap "savings" by cutting him before 2015 and you probably won't be able to win a bidding war for another QB in free agency while having his cap number be just $5M.

In total, he'd make about $42M in the first three years of the contract but that's about all he could reasonably be sure that he'd see. I doubt he's going to decline in 2013 to a point where cutting him is an option and even a bad year in 2014 would be written off as a down year. Combined with minimal cap relief, he'll be on board for 2015.

In 2016 however, the team would get about $14M in relief by releasing him and he wouldn't see that $18M in base salary and at 36 years old and sitting in the position of being cut it's unlikely he could get a contract that would be anything close to paying that much.

This would be my guess of the sticking point. How the numbers are structured. He'd be a fool to settle for a contract that is really "cap friendly" up front because it means that it is "cap unfriendly" on the back end which ultimately puts him in the position of needing to get the team deep into the playoffs or into a Superbowl or he's going to be cut.

I've said it before that players who shoot for the moon on contracts are idiots. Nate Clements, DeAngelo Hall, and I'd even say Flacco. Just idiots. I don't think there's any chance in hell that Flacco sees year 5 of that contract unless the total cap space available goes way up. Outside of a 4 game stretch, that guy hasn't been anything close to a $20M cap hit QB and in year 5 he's gonna count for $31M of cap space? IMO, he'd have to play as well as he did during the playoff run for like 3 seasons in order to warrant that kind of cap hit. I think that's impossible so I don't see him getting beyond year 4, if he makes it there. Cutting him would provide cap relief after year 3, albeit a small $3M but getting $3M in space is a lot better than paying $28M for a player who isn't worth it.

With that said, I don't think he sees 1/3rd of that money. I'm skeptical he makes it to year 4 which means he'd get about half overall. Players that accept these contracts put the burden on themselves to be great. For year four and at a cap hit of $28M, Flacco better be the best damn QB in the NFL or as Ric Flair would put it, he better be "The Man".

People say Tom Brady took some sort of discount and I don't necessarily agree. I think he actually did the smartest possible thing he could do and that is pretty much guarantee that he sees the end of his contract, provided he stays healthy and wants to play. His cap hit this year of $13.8M is 1.2M less than his highest cap hit over the span of $15M in 2017. At $15M, Brady doesn't even have to be the best QB in the league to be worth the cap space. It's likely he doesn't even have to be Top 5 at his position to be worth the cap space. Even if he was 75% of what he currently is, he's still better than more than half the league. If healthy and he wants to play he'll see the end of it because he hasn't backed himself into a corner where he better be Godly in order to justify his cap hit. His cap hit is pretty much constant from here on out. The team won't have to factor in some giant increase and his cap hit is very reasonable.

I suppose if you take a stab at what his total amount could have been he might be giving a discount. He probably could have gotten $100M but playing out the remainder of your career and making $70M is a hell of a lot better than playing 3 years and only coming out with $50M, sitting on the market as a 40 year old player.

For this very reason I think Romo would be wise to take a lesser overall deal that has a little more in guaranteed money. It makes his cap number far more reasonable, makes his dead money less likely to provide cap relief if he were cut which means the team is less likely to cut him and it gives him an opportunity to reach the end of the deal and realize the total amount of the contract.

If you look at the 5 year, $80M with $20 in SB and assume he was cut after year 3 he would ultimately end up with just over half of that contract. In total $42M.

Lets look at taking less total and a little more in guarantees. I'm just gonna say 5 years, $65M with $25M in SB that looks like this.

Code:
Base Salaries By Year (Cap Hit) [Dead Money]:

2013: $5M ($10M)
2014: $7M ($12M)
2015: $9M ($14M) [$15M]
2016: $9M ($14M) [$10M]
2017: $10M ($15M) [$5M]
In this case, he'd make $30M this year and $16M over the next 2 seasons. That's $4M more than he would make on the 5 year, $80M contract but it comes with the benefit of not putting himself in a position where his play absolutely has to justify his 4th year cap hit. It also puts him in a position where the team gets very little cap relief by cutting him before the 4th season. On the more total money contract, the team sees relief of $14M on top of a cap hit of $22M. On the lesser overall contract the team only gets $4M in relief and is only faced with a $14M cap hit.

Even if he played out the 4th year, I think he'd be hard pressed to keep up production to warrant his cap hit on a backloaded contract and ultimately would be cut at the age of 37. There'd he be, free agent at 37 years old and having only earned $60M of his total $80M contract. This opposed to playing out the 5th year and earning the total $65M that he signed for. All the while the team can plan for his cap hit to remain relatively steady and won't be forced to deal with a huge spike 2-3 years down the road.

I've said it for a while, I think players who go for every last dollar they can get are absolutely stupid. Think of all the giant contracts that have been signed by Haynesworth, Clements, DeAngelo Hall (Oakland) and some others and think of how many actually played those things out. DeAngelo Hall is a prime example. He signed for so much in Oakland and like an idiot had so little money guaranteed that when they cut him like a couple of months into the contract he basically shorted himself tens of millions of dollars. Nate Clements signed for $80M but from the looks of things he only came away with a little over $30M after only playing 4 years. Compare that to Hall who signed with the Commanders after 2008 and while having signed for $25M less he walked away with $6M more at the conclusion of his 4 year stint with the Skins.

The trade off for all those eye-popping numbers is a lack security. When you shoot for the moon, you better be able to justify the big fat cap numbers that come a couple years down the road or else you're out the door because your small guaranteed amount couldn't save you. When you start thinking in a realistic fashion and take significantly less overall money with a greater amount guaranteed, then you've increased your chances of hitting those last couple years where your base salary is likely at it's highest but is also at a reasonable amount that gives the team a cap hit that is both justifiable and manageable.

When you're cut after a few seasons because your cap number is too high, you aren't getting another crack at a big contract. You're taking way less and ultimately you lose out.

IMO, Romo and Dallas would be best served to sign a reasonable contract with a good amount guaranteed, allocate the cap space as evenly as possible and enjoy the next 5 years.

Great post. I've for been saying the same things about Romo and Flacco weeks. Right now Romo has no guaranteed money left. I've been proposing a 5/65m deal with 30-38m guaranteed. Hard to turn down 30+m at his age. Playing this year out(possible injury) could be very costly. It paid off for Flacco, but took many, many lucky twists.
 

KB1122

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,328
Reaction score
1,629
If it's a team game and not all about the quarterback, then why would you want to put $20 million/year into an aging quarterback, especially when teams like San Francisco are only paying their quarterback a rookie-contract salary?
 

Blackspider214

Well-Known Member
Messages
13,132
Reaction score
15,995
He has leverage in the sense that we have absolutely no one else. And no matter what you think of Romo, without him, we will be a 5 win team. And that is wasting the years of Dez and the other young guys. At least with Romo, it helps Jerry and company tread water, sell hope to the fans, which in turn will keep revenue up from ticket and merchandise sales.

Romo knows this. Which is why he wants the best deal he can get. And the fact he is getting older and it will most likely be his last big payday.

No reason to bring it up now but Jerry was way to quick to sign him to a long term deal in the 07 season. But that's how he does. Knee jerk signings from a small sample size of performance. Ala Miles Austin.
 

DABOYZ

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,228
Reaction score
416
If I am Jerry Jones>>> Romo has as much leverage as an 8-8 QB should have. Romo deserves above average pay for the Butt kickings he has taken. But if I am Jerry and my plan is to sell Romo to Cowboy's fans like in past years, I must over pay him at least a little.

You can't under pay Romo or the entire fan base will wonder what in the world is going on. At this point in his career there isn't an owner out there willing to pay Romo BIG money.

Some of you will always point to his stats. But I would ask you to do one thing. Place your money on the line and tell me that you are willing to be the guy taking the 1 on the 80-1 odds that Romo will win a Superbowl before his career is over. That 1 equals an owner or coach in the NFL.

Please someone name one team or owner in the NFL who would be willing to take that chance with Romo?! Especially after last year where we had so many rookie QB's come into the NFL and out perform the so called veterans of the league.
 

Beast_from_East

Well-Known Member
Messages
30,140
Reaction score
27,231
KB1122;5028950 said:
If it's a team game and not all about the quarterback, then why would you want to put $20 million/year into an aging quarterback, especially when teams like San Francisco are only paying their quarterback a rookie-contract salary?


Kap is still under his rookie contract, just wait till he becomes a free agent. He will want Flacco money, especially if the 49ers win a SB in the next year or two.

As far as Dallas goes, if you let Romo walk most fans will consider that "blowing the team up". Going to be hard to sell tickets for a 100,000 seat stadium if most of your fans think you are going to suck.

Maybe you dont care if the stadium is half empty on gameday, but I assure you Jerry does. As long as Romo is on the team, Jerry can sell this team as being a playoff contender and that sells tickets.

If Romo is not on the team, then most fans will see no hope of being a contender. You got Aikman saying that this team is a 3 win team without Romo, so how you going to sell tickets when you got a 3 time SB champion, Hall of Fame, Ring of Honor legend like Aikman telling the fans "dont bother, team sucks without Romo".

For alot of fans, Romo is the Cowboys...............Jerry knows this as well.
 

DFWJC

Well-Known Member
Messages
59,982
Reaction score
48,729
CowboysZone LOYAL Fan
If you are trying to calculate franchise and top 5 averages, you need to add up base salaries AND prorated bonuses.
You'll find that Brees and Flacco are both around 20/yr. The Mannings are about 17-18 each. And since it will be for 2013, you're going to have new contracts for Rodgers, Stafford, Cutler, and Ryan as well.
The average will be very close to 20 mil
 

Beast_from_East

Well-Known Member
Messages
30,140
Reaction score
27,231
DFWJC;5028959 said:
If you are trying to calculate franchise and top 5 averages, you need to add up base salaries AND prorated bonuses.
You'll find that Brees and Flacco are both around 20/yr. The Mannings are about 17-18 each. And since it will be for 2013, you're going to have new contracts for Rodgers, Stafford, Cutler, and Ryan as well.
The average will be very close to 20 mil

Tom Condon is also the agent for Romo, Stafford, and Ryan also. Meaning, he is not going to let Romo sign a low ball offer because that affects what his other clients can get.


Romo is going to paid in the $17 - $20 million range per year.
 

Beast_from_East

Well-Known Member
Messages
30,140
Reaction score
27,231
DABOYZ;5028956 said:
If I am Jerry Jones>>> Romo has as much leverage as an 8-8 QB should have. Romo deserves above average pay for the Butt kickings he has taken. But if I am Jerry and my plan is to sell Romo to Cowboy's fans like in past years, I must over pay him at least a little.

You can't under pay Romo or the entire fan base will wonder what in the world is going on. At this point in his career there isn't an owner out there willing to pay Romo BIG money.

Some of you will always point to his stats. But I would ask you to do one thing. Place your money on the line and tell me that you are willing to be the guy taking the 1 on the 80-1 odds that Romo will win a Superbowl before his career is over. That 1 equals an owner or coach in the NFL.

Please someone name one team or owner in the NFL who would be willing to take that chance with Romo?! Especially after last year where we had so many rookie QB's come into the NFL and out perform the so called veterans of the league.

Well, there was a quote awhile back from an "AFC Offensive Coordinator" that Romo would be the highest paid QB in the NFL if he was a free agent.

It was rumored on some other boards that it was the OC from Buffalo that said this, but it was never confirmed.
 

DallasDomination

Well-Known Member
Messages
11,791
Reaction score
6,205
I don't care about the cap hit/space, that's not my job. I will say this though, I'm 100% a ok if Romo walks. People are soooooo afraid of life after Romo around here it's comical. They say it's a 3 win team without Romo:rolleyes: . As far as I see it, it would be a step in the right direction.
 

Idgit

Fattening up
Staff member
Messages
58,971
Reaction score
60,826
CowboysZone ULTIMATE Fan
DallasDomination;5028987 said:
I don't care about the cap hit/space, that's not my job. I will say this though, I'm 100% a ok if Romo walks. People are soooooo afraid of life after Romo around here it's comical. They say it's a 3 win team without Romo:rolleyes: . As far as I see it, it would be a step in the right direction.

It would be straight-up idiocy if we were to just let Tony Romo walk. But we won't do that, so that's ok.

And we're not afraid of life after Romo. We're just not prepared for it right now. You don't easily replace franchise QBs, whether some fans understand how good a player he is, or not.
 

randy932

Active Member
Messages
559
Reaction score
55
dadymat;5028705 said:
he has the leverage the same reason every other top QB has the leverage.....fans and mediots are generally stupid regarding football...they think with too much emotion and place too much on individual players....you say he has a "terrible reputation around the league" I laugh at that...the football guys around the league know exactly how good Romo is

I assume you mean the players? The players that have twice voted him as in the top three of "Most Overrated in the League"?
 

Langonelives

Member
Messages
94
Reaction score
2
dstone2962;5028675 said:
Tony Romo should not have leverage over the Cowboys. If he demands an outrageous number of years or dollars guaranteed, all Jerry has to point to is his amount of success in either getting to or maintaining a post season run. He certainly holds the short term cards but if I were Jerry I'd tell him to start wondering where a 33 year old quarterback with a terrible reputation around the league is going to get a long term deal anywhere else.

Tony Romo has a ton of leverage and doesn't have a terrible rep.

1. Draft Class Sucks
2. He doesn't have young talent behind him
3. He holds the key to sign more talent in FA.
4. He has produced a ton of numbers, with a crappy OL
5. ??????
6. Profit
 

randy932

Active Member
Messages
559
Reaction score
55
zack;5028784 said:
I am confident that he has a chance to do that when he has the same pieces in place that Eli did. Can you imagine how good he could be with a competitent offensive line and a balanced offense?

Look back at the Pittsburgh game for example. I felt that the line played pretty well, we had play action in our back pocket. Who made the critical interception at the end of the game? It wasn't Romo. He played damn good.

That's what I don't get with Cowboys fans. Did you forget all the games that he played well in just to get an opportunity to win the East? Did he play well against Washington? No, but are you comfortable with Garret's adjustment to the blitz in that game?

I guess I am just as confident as you are with his replacement......

That same OL and Defense are on the field when Romo pads his stats... as are there when he fails. The difference from one play to the other and one game to the other, is it's significance... and the effect that significance has on Romo's ability to play. In Romo's case... significance = pressure = failure.
 

silvrandbluefan

New Member
Messages
15
Reaction score
0
Why on earth would you pay Romo big money and tie up future money for another 8-8 season. I would just soon pay Orton to do that and save future money. I just don't see this team as anything but a 500 team for this year and possibly next year, quit paying these idiotic contracts that add up to a 500 team and look to the future and in my book (my opion) it doesn't start with Romo getting big dollars, play his contract out and look to the future with someone else, pay big now and skrew the future or keep it the way it is and try to get better in the future, again my half cent worth opion.
 

DFWJC

Well-Known Member
Messages
59,982
Reaction score
48,729
CowboysZone LOYAL Fan
silvrandbluefan;5029006 said:
Why on earth would you pay Romo big money and tie up future money for another 8-8 season?.
Good question.
The answer is because you don't expect 8-8 seasons going forward.

And because in the six seasons that Romo started the majority of the games, an 8-8 season is the very worst Dallas has ever had and 13-3 the best. So you wouldn't be nuts to think you can and should do better than 8-8.

4 winning seasons
2 8-8 season
0 losing seasons

With Romo starting the majority of the games.
The hope/expectation is that the floor is 8-8 and the ceiling is way, way better.
 

Hook'em#11

Well-Known Member
Messages
4,561
Reaction score
2,001
dstone2962;5028675 said:
Tony Romo should not have leverage over the Cowboys. If he demands an outrageous number of years or dollars guaranteed, all Jerry has to point to is his amount of success in either getting to or maintaining a post season run. He certainly holds the short term cards but if I were Jerry I'd tell him to start wondering where a 33 year old quarterback with a terrible reputation around the league is going to get a long term deal anywhere else.

Do you remember what Dallas looked like before Romo?

Romo knows the Cowboys have crap at QB after him. And Dallas's so called and that sorry excuse for a FO has no ammo. They don't think long term, just for now.
 

ufcrules1

Well-Known Member
Messages
9,652
Reaction score
3,800
Beast_from_East;5028915 said:
This is exactly what Aikman was saying, that we are a 3 win team without Romo.

The guys saying that would be fine because we would get a high pick obviously are not worried about ticket sales, Jerry is. I will pay $50 for parking, $12 for a beer, and $10 for a hot dog to watch Romo run around and make plays. I ain't paying that to watch some rookie led us to a 3 win season.

Yeah, players like Kaepernic, Wilson, RG3, Luck, etc... would only win 2 or 3 games here in Dallas. I'm not paying to watch those bozo's, . It's not Romo's fault he threw those 3 interceptions against Washington, his team sucks. If it wasn't for him we would have never had a chance to play against Washington for the division. Romo 4 life!
 
Top