Why is Carpenter playing inside?

[Doomsday101]

Agreed...But Practice is one thing and real games are another...Color me skeptical at this point.

Fair enough, He gets his 1st test aginst the seahawks this weekend and even though one outing is not going to tell us everything it at least give us some indication of how he is coming along.

 

[wileedog]

so when the Eagles send Westbrook out into the pattern the safety is just going to ignore him so that he can take the guy that Ellis re-directs?

And Carpenter or Ayodele or James or Burnett are just going to ignore Westbrook?

 

[dboyz]

I don't know about that...Ellis rushing from DE is one thing...Coming from OLB is another...Hell he's never even played the position before like Carpenter has.

Actually Parcells addressed this in a PC a few days ago. He said the only difference in what Ellis is doing now when he is going forward is his hand position. He is lining up in the same spot and doing the same type of things. Maybe someone else can remember the press conference that was from.

 

[AbeBeta]

And Carpenter or Ayodele or James or Burnett are just going to ignore Westbrook?

Maybe maybe not -- depends on who is on the other side. Certainly the Eagles are going to try to design it that way.

But of course you are very much over simplifying Ellis' role in coverage. A 3-4 OLB is going to have to do much more than just hit his guy and release. He will end up 1 on 1 at times. And you know damn well that teams are going to try to get guys who are questionable in coverage locked in one on one when they can.

 

[Alexander]

Senator Ellis, I watched Jason Taylor play. Saw Jason Taylor sack QB after QB. Watched as Taylor went to pro bowl after pro bowl. Senator Ellis, you are no Jason Taylor.

Well, Ellis is ten times the worry wart and complainer Taylor is, you cannot take that away from him.

 

[Concord]

Actually Parcells addressed this in a PC a few days ago. He said the only difference in what Ellis is doing now when he is going forward is his hand position. He is lining up in the same spot and doing the same type of things. Maybe someone else can remember the press conference that was from.

Well then what the Hell is Ellis complaining about then?:

 

[AbeBeta]

Well, Ellis is ten times the worry wart and complainer Taylor is, you cannot take that away from him.

if only there were a pro-bowl spot designated for complainers.

 

[Alexander]

And Carpenter or Ayodele or James or Burnett are just going to ignore Westbrook?

Apparently you do not understand.

The ILBers in the 3-4 never pass rush, nor do they have coverage responsibilities, they are just told to play the run. It is ALWAYS the OLBers. They have to do everything.

 

[Concord]

Apparently you do not understand.

The ILBers in the 3-4 never pass rush, nor do they have coverage responsibilities, they are just told to play the run. It is ALWAYS the OLBers. They have to do everything.

The way Zimmer calls Defense you're right. Carpenter will be a WASTE inside.:

 

[dboyz]

Well then what the Hell is Ellis complaining about then?:

I know you jest, but the point is going forward is the same. It's the dropping back or coverage that is new to him.

On the plus of that is that you have a guy 6'6" dropping back.

Regarding this coverage stuff, I'm sure Ellis will have to cover the flat and probably even drop into zone at times. However, keep in mind that either Ware or Ellis could be rushing on every play and we can still play coverage with 7. If both rush we can play coverage with 6. Oh and BTW, we have some pretty good coverage guys on this team.

I think the point about coverage mismatches is valid, but you have to also consider the potential blocking mismatches or issues that could come up. Teams have to be prepared to block Ellis and Ware on every play in addition to the 3 DL. They will never know who is coming. That is pretty significant.

 

[wileedog]

But of course you are very much over simplifying Ellis' role in coverage. A 3-4 OLB is going to have to do much more than just hit his guy and release. He will end up 1 on 1 at times. And you know damn well that teams are going to try to get guys who are questionable in coverage locked in one on one when they can.

I think you are overcomplicating it. The kept Ellis because he can rush the QB. When he goes on the field, if they are asking or expecting him to do anything else with any regularity, then keeping him was a waste of a roster spot.

Teams can scheme until they are blue in the face, but as long as every TE and RB is accounted for by one of the other LBers or safeties, then it doesn't mean Ellis needs to be 'forced' into running down the field with them.

He's not going to be a typical OLB, nor do I see him as the 'starting' 3 down LBer on every play anyway as all the media is going on about. He was told before camp he would be a nickel LBer in passing situations, and despite all the hoopla I think that is exactly what he is going to be.

 

[wileedog]

Well then what the Hell is Ellis complaining about then?:

Good question.

 

[Concord]

Good question.

I mean really if there is no difference...and he could even be in a better position to rush the QB...What's the problem.

Obviously Ellis thinks there is a Difference.

 

[Alexander]

I mean really if there is no difference...and he could even be in a better position to rush the QB...What's the problem.

Obviously Ellis thinks there is a Difference.

Obviously Ellis doesn't know much as he thought he would be destroyed as a 3-4 end last year and he had the same kind of year he has always had in the 4-3 in terms of his overall production.

 

[wileedog]

I mean really if there is no difference...and he could even be in a better position to rush the QB...What's the problem.

Obviously Ellis thinks there is a Difference.

He's nervous about the pass coverage stuff. Right now they are throwing the kitchen sink at him, even covering slot receivers in practice. He doesn't like it.

He will NOT be covering slot receivers in games unless he actually turns out to be really good at it or Parcells has lost his marbles.

In all of the Ellis rantings he has mentioned this "going backward" thing over and over and over. Never once has he said "I'll have trouble getting to the QB from this spot."

 

[Rack]

Let's just say I'm not sold on Ellis out there -- nor do I think Singleton can be more than a stopgap. With Ellis, I'd be more comfortable with him in there situationally but not every down. Once teams start to game plan, he's going to be seriously tested by some TEs. And there are a few very good ones in our division.

If Ellis and Singleton weren't at least adaquate (sp?) don't you think Parcells would do something about it?


And no offense, but I'm more inclined to trust Parcells' knowledge then yours.


Or it could be Parcells just wants Ellis to get as many reps as possible in practice to give him a better chance to learn the position. If he fails, he can still move Carpenter back outside.


I think you're just overanalyzing things, or you just want something to complain about.

 

[Concord]

He's nervous about the pass coverage stuff. Right now they are throwing the kitchen sink at him, even covering slot receivers in practice. He doesn't like it.

He will NOT be covering slot receivers in games unless he actually turns out to be really good at it or Parcells has lost his marbles.

In all of the Ellis rantings he has mentioned this "going backward" thing over and over and over. Never once has he said "I'll have trouble getting to the QB from this spot."

Ah Screw Ellis at OLB...He's not the Future anyway...Get Carpenter in there..He's likes covering Slot receivers!

 

[AbeBeta]

I think you are overcomplicating it. The kept Ellis because he can rush the QB. When he goes on the field, if they are asking or expecting him to do anything else with any regularity, then keeping him was a waste of a roster spot.

Teams can scheme until they are blue in the face, but as long as every TE and RB is accounted for by one of the other LBers or safeties, then it doesn't mean Ellis needs to be 'forced' into running down the field with them.

He's not going to be a typical OLB, nor do I see him as the 'starting' 3 down LBer on every play anyway as all the media is going on about. He was told before camp he would be a nickel LBer in passing situations, and despite all the hoopla I think that is exactly what he is going to be.

Gregg is playing OLB with the first unit right now. He's getting most of the snaps and doing things that he wouldn't have to if he weren't starting.

I totally understand the move if he's going to be a SITUATIONAL OLB but as the starter he's going to have to cover at least a few time a game. Obviously the chess match involves not having him in coverage too often.

The position calls for some coverage. I doubt strongly that other positions are going to roll into coverage in situations where the OLB would normally have the guy - it creates too many holes in other spots. The defense would simply be torn apart if they had to excuse Gregg from coverage against various schemes.

 

[AbeBeta]

I think you're just overanalyzing things, or you just want something to complain about.

What is your problem Rack?

I start a thread that has folks talking about something other than TO or some ridiculous trade and you call it complaining.

 

[Concord]

Gregg is playing OLB with the first unit right now. He's getting most of the snaps and doing things that he wouldn't have to if he weren't starting.

I totally understand the move if he's going to be a SITUATIONAL OLB but as the starter he's going to have to cover at least a few time a game. Obviously the chess match involves not having him in coverage too often.

The position calls for some coverage. I doubt strongly that other positions are going to roll into coverage in situations where the OLB would normally have the guy - it creates too many holes in other spots. The defense would simply be torn apart if they had to excuse Gregg from coverage against various schemes.

Yep...People thinking otherwise are kidding themselves.