Why is Carpenter playing inside?

[Alexander]

the point was he's seeing pretty much zero action outside.

I'd think that if you want to prepare a guy to take snaps there that he'd have to at least practice at the position

Right now, we probably aren't preparing him to take snaps outside. For the Seattle game, the plan might be so give him a bunch of action inside to see how he reacts to a new position. And if that doesn't go well, then they could always move him back outside. You will probably see Junior Glymph get a serious look backing up Ellis and Singleton.

Right now, it is a numbers game and the numbers are better inside for now.

This could and will probably change as the numbers get smaller in the coming weeks.

 

[Rack]

no -- but my point was that he's not really seeing any action at OLB - as I understand it, he's mostly been playing in the nickel package as an ILB - with all the rotating etc. you'd expect to see him at least get some snaps outside - and most reports have it that he isn't seeing much action out there.

I think it's probably just a matter of Parcells wanting to put him in a spot where he has the highest chance of getting on the field. At OLB Ellis and Burnett have done much better then expected so he won't have a chance to get much PT out there. Carpenter can play inside so why not put him there for now where he'd have a higher chance to contribute?

Just cuz he's at ILB now doesn't mean he'll always be there. Al Singleton won't be here next year (I don't see them resigning him. ON a side note, wasn't AlS suppose to be gone like 2 years ago? ) so Carpenter will likely be moved back outside next year.

At the end of the day, who cares? As long as the OLB position is strong and Carpenter is contributing, isn't that all that matters?

 

[AbeBeta]

At the end of the day, who cares? As long as the OLB position is strong and Carpenter is contributing, isn't that all that matters?

Let's just say I'm not sold on Ellis out there -- nor do I think Singleton can be more than a stopgap. With Ellis, I'd be more comfortable with him in there situationally but not every down. Once teams start to game plan, he's going to be seriously tested by some TEs. And there are a few very good ones in our division.

 

[wileedog]

Ok sorry I meant switching after they were in the NFL...Like McGinest and Ellis are doing.

What's the difference?

If anything, it should be easier for a guy already accustomed to the NFL and the speed of the pro game.

Also, IIRC isn't Jason Taylor doing it?

 

[dboyz]

A few thoughts.

I believe Jason Taylor last year had a successful transition to OLB from DE.

The pass rush combination of Ellis and Ware is definitely more impressive than Carpenter and Ware.

In the 3-4, I think all of the LB's are important playmakers, not just the OLB's. ILB is very important in the 3-4.

Carpenter was a safe pick in the draft, not a real sexy pick. At the time, I thought maybe we should have taken someone with more playmaking potential. However, I'm not sure who it would have been. The way the draft played out, there weren't too many options. A couple safeties had already gone, and it looks like passing on Santonio Holmes was a good idea.

The only thing to question though I think is money thrown at Ayodele, if it turns out the position is redundant. However, that is 20/20 hindsight and worst case scenario Carp and Ayodele would split snaps 50/50

 

[Alexander]

I believe Jason Taylor last year had a successful transition to OLB from DE.

That's right he did. He was also upset at first, then changed his tune and had another great year.

 

[wileedog]

Let's just say I'm not sold on Ellis out there -- nor do I think Singleton can be more than a stopgap. With Ellis, I'd be more comfortable with him in there situationally but not every down. Once teams start to game plan, he's going to be seriously tested by some TEs. And there are a few very good ones in our division.

I'll be shocked if we ever wind up in a situation where Ellis' main responsibility on a play is chasing around Shockey. He will be re-routing these guys to safeties and covering the flat.

 

[Alexander]

I'll be shocked if we ever wind up in a situation where Ellis' main responsibility on a play is chasing around Shockey. He will be re-routing these guys to safeties and covering the flat.

You mean we aren't ignorant enough to run Ellis man-to-man with a back or tight end? You have got to be kidding me.

 

[wileedog]

You mean we aren't ignorant enough to run Ellis man-to-man with a back or tight end? You have got to be kidding me.

Well if McGinnest can run with all those TE's....

Oh, wait.

 

[AbeBeta]

That's right he did. He was also upset at first, then changed his tune and had another great year.

Senator Ellis, I watched Jason Taylor play. Saw Jason Taylor sack QB after QB. Watched as Taylor went to pro bowl after pro bowl. Senator Ellis, you are no Jason Taylor.

 

[AbeBeta]

I'll be shocked if we ever wind up in a situation where Ellis' main responsibility on a play is chasing around Shockey. He will be re-routing these guys to safeties and covering the flat.

and I would be shocked if opponents don't design schemes to try to isolate Shocker or Cooley or LJ Smith on Ellis.

 

[Concord]

What's the difference?

If anything, it should be easier for a guy already accustomed to the NFL and the speed of the pro game.

Also, IIRC isn't Jason Taylor doing it?

Just a question.

I don't know about it being easier. A lot of DE's in college come in and play linebacker in the Pro's.

My point is Not many have done it once they are in the Pros and to expect Ellis to repeat what McGinest did is asking a lot.

 

[AbeBeta]

You mean we aren't ignorant enough to run Ellis man-to-man with a back or tight end? You have got to be kidding me.

But lets take this further -- if Ellis is going to be protected and will no be in coverage much -- what does this do over on the other side? Doesn't this suggest Ware is going to have more coverage responsibility?

 

[Doomsday101]

Just a question.

I don't know about it being easier. A lot of DE's in college come in and play linebacker in the Pro's.

My point is Not many have done it once they are in the Pros and to expect Ellis to repeat what McGinest did is asking a lot.

I agree it is asking a lot but thus far things have been going good for Ellis and the coaches appear to like what they are seeing. No doubt the 1st test comes sat.

 

[wileedog]

and I would be shocked if opponents don't design schemes to try to isolate Shocker or Cooley or LJ Smith on Ellis.

If his job is hit the TE and then let him go to a safety, what scheme are you going to design that is going to force Ellis to cover him?

 

[Concord]

A few thoughts.

I believe Jason Taylor last year had a successful transition to OLB from DE.

The pass rush combination of Ellis and Ware is definitely more impressive than Carpenter and Ware.
In the 3-4, I think all of the LB's are important playmakers, not just the OLB's. ILB is very important in the 3-4.

Carpenter was a safe pick in the draft, not a real sexy pick. At the time, I thought maybe we should have taken someone with more playmaking potential. However, I'm not sure who it would have been. The way the draft played out, there weren't too many options. A couple safeties had already gone, and it looks like passing on Santonio Holmes was a good idea.

The only thing to question though I think is money thrown at Ayodele, if it turns out the position is redundant. However, that is 20/20 hindsight and worst case scenario Carp and Ayodele would split snaps 50/50

I don't know about that...Ellis rushing from DE is one thing...Coming from OLB is another...Hell he's never even played the position before like Carpenter has.

 

[wileedog]

I don't know about that...Ellis rushing from DE is one thing...Coming from OLB is another...Hell he's never even played the position before like Carpenter has.

Ellis in a better position now than he was playing a 3-4 DE. He's back on the outside shoulder of the OT instead of square up.

There's not a whole lot of difference rushing the passer as a 4-3 DE or a 3-4 LB, Parcell even mentioned that himself in the PC the other day.

 

[Concord]

I agree it is asking a lot but thus far things have been going good for Ellis and the coaches appear to like what they are seeing. No doubt the 1st test comes sat.

Agreed...But Practice is one thing and real games are another...Color me skeptical at this point.

 

[AbeBeta]

If his job is hit the TE and then let him go to a safety, what scheme are you going to design that is going to force Ellis to cover him?

so when the Eagles send Westbrook out into the pattern the safety is just going to ignore him so that he can take the guy that Ellis re-directs?

 

[Concord]

Ellis in a better position now than he was playing a 3-4 DE. He's back on the outside shoulder of the OT instead of square up.

There's not a whole lot of difference rushing the passer as a 4-3 DE or a 3-4 LB, Parcell even mentioned that himself in the PC the other day.

We'll see...To me beating a OT right off the ball is one thing but if he has time to see you coming...With Ellis I don't know.