Will Anthony Fasano be better then Jason Witten?

[Chuck 54]

Who knows?

I do know this: Witten dropped in the draft, dropped quite a bit because there were some more athletic TE's at the top...even when drafted, before a ProBowl, he was considered a great value pick in the third round.

Fasano was selected considerably higher than anyone expected...that is usually not a good sign.

My guess is that we still took Fasano too soon...I seriously doubt that he'll pan out to be a great 2nd round pick the way Witten has turned out to be a steal in the 3rd.

That doesn't mean Fasano won't be a solid TE in the NFL, but we took him pretty darn high, much higher than anyone had predicted.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

This is one of those thread topics that I consider somewhat goofy. But I guess that's what you get in the offseason.

 

[InmanRoshi]

Fasano was selected considerably higher than anyone expected...that is usually not a good sign.

That doesn't mean Fasano won't be a solid TE in the NFL, but we took him pretty darn high, much higher than anyone had predicted.

The Cowboys took him with the 53rd pick.

Here is where he ranked on some of the most respected final Top 100 lists.

Goose - 54
Pro Football Weekly - 43
Scouts, Inc - 48
Frank Coyle - 53.

Goose, PFW and Scouts ranked 1st, 3rd and 4th respectively in THR's ranking of the top 20 most accurate Top 100's.

I don't know who's draft information you're using, but I hope you're not paying a membership.

 

[JackMagist]

I haven't read much of this thread but to the original question I would say that it is unlikely that Fasano will be better than Witten. Witten is a rare talent and you don't find many guys even as good much less better. If Fasano is even close to as good we will be in great shape.

Another thing about Fasano; I would not want to have to hang my hat on him being our TE for a lot of years. He comes in with a steel plate and screws in his back; something many seem to forget or chose to ignore. Some here may have noticed that I have almost a phobia about players with back problems. But this just makes me think that he will have a relatively short career. I expect Witten to be around much longer than Fasano.

 

[AsthmaField]

Another thing about Fasano; I would not want to have to hang my hat on him being our TE for a lot of years. He comes in with a steel plate and screws in his back; something many seem to forget or chose to ignore.

I heard this too, Jack. But then I also heard that that rumor wasn't true. Do you know for a fact that he does indeed have a steel plate in his back? I can't remember where I read that it wasn't true... but where ever it was, it was valid enough for me to think it may be correct.

Have you heard anything?

 

[InmanRoshi]

I heard this too, Jack. But then I also heard that that rumor wasn't true. Do you know for a fact that he does indeed have a steel plate in his back? I can't remember where I read that it wasn't true... but where ever it was, it was valid enough for me to think it may be correct.

Have you heard anything?

I've never heard of it. A Google search of Anthony Fasano and Steel Plate turns up nothing.

Here's his known injury history ...

2003: Sat out the Navy game (11/08) with back spasms.
2004: Did not play vs. Stanford (10/09) due to a shoulder sprain.
2005: Played most of the second half of the year with his left thumb heavily taped because of a ligament strain (10/08)...Also suffered a slight shoulder contusion vs. Southern California (10/15).

He didn't suffer any injuries in high school.

 

[JackMagist]

I heard this too, Jack. But then I also heard that that rumor wasn't true. Do you know for a fact that he does indeed have a steel plate in his back? I can't remember where I read that it wasn't true... but where ever it was, it was valid enough for me to think it may be correct.

Have you heard anything?

Like most of us here I can only go by what I have read or seen on TV. I read two different articles that made mention of the steel plate when we drafted him. One said that a doctor that does physicals at the combine recommended that he not be taken higher than the third round due to the risk his back poses. The other said that many teams thought he had a steel rod fused to his spine and were surprised to learn that it was a steel plate screwed to the spine instead. I have not seen anything refuting the claims since then; if you have seen such a refutation I would be interested to see it or hear what was said. I would feel much better about Fasano if this turned out to be false.

 

[lspain1]

I want to make another point on Fasano. Does anyone remember the excellent Kirwin article about the two TE set on offense?

Kirwan said the following in this article...

"When you look at the possible matchup problems in the red zone, especially with a team like Kansas City, which has been the top point producer over the past few years, it appears Dallas has the matchup game covered again. Also, it's a place Fasano could come alive because he definitely will get linebacker coverage down there, and he could resemble Parcells' old favorite, Mark Bavaro."

LINK

For the two TE approach to work effectively, Fasano must be a legitimate receiving threat as well as a blocker. If the OL comes together, we might just end up looking back on the Fasano pick as one of the springboards to the Super Bowl.

 

[Billy Bullocks]

Where you are drafted has little to do with anything if you establish yourself as a good player. If you re did certain drafts, players like Brady selected in the 6th round would be a top pick...if teams knew Witten would be this good he would have gone 1st round.

 

[Vintage]

Shockey is a moron, and a jealous moron at that, because Witten is better than he is...

He knows it so why would he tell people that the Best TE in the NFC East plays for the Dallas Cowboys... Shockey wouldn't do that. His ego wouldn't allow it...

Stats for the following TE's in their first 3 years in the league...

Witten
1: 35 Receptions 347 Yards 1 TD
2: 87 Receptions 980 Yards 6 TD
3: 66 Receptions 757 Yards 6 TD

Totals: 188 Receptions 2084 Yards 13 TD

Shockey
1: 74 Receptions 894 Yards 2 TD
2: 48 Receptions 535 Yards 2 TD
3: 61 Receptions 666 Yards 6 TD

Totals: 183 Receptions 2095 Yards 10 TD

Cooley
1: 37 Recedptions 314 Yards 6 TD
2: 71 Receptions 774 Yards 7 TD

Totals: 108 Receptions 1088 Yards 13 TD

Outside of the NFC East, some notable TE's...

Gates
1: 24 Receptions 389 Yards 2 TD
2: 81 Receptions 964 13 TD
3: 89 Receptions 1101 Yards 10 TD

Totals: 194 Receptions 2454 Yards 25 TD

Heap
1: 16 Receptions 206 Yards 1 TD
2: 68 Receptions 836 Yards 6 TD
3: 57 Receptions 693 Yards 3 TD

Totals: 141 Receptions 1735 Yards 10 TD

Crumpler
1: 25 Receptions 330 Yards 3 TD
2: 36 Receptions 455 Yards 5 TD
3: 44 Recpetions 552 Yards 3 TD

Totals: 105 Receptions 1337 Yards 11 TD

 

[Funxva]

Crumpler
1: 25 Receptions 330 Yards 3 TD
2: 36 Receptions 455 Yards 5 TD
3: 44 Recpetions 552 Yards 3 TD

Wow, I thought Crumpler would have had a lot better stats, as it seems that Vick ONLY throws to him.

 

[ringmaster]

BP was actually entertaining the idea of taking WItten in the 2nd, he passed because he felt a lineman (Al Johnson) was a more pressing need, he was fortunate that the rest of the league had a brain-fart after that until our pick in the 3rd

to answer your question...no, Fasano is, and will probably always be a better blocker than WItten, he's built lower to the ground and has excellent technique, but Witten's speed and athleticsm set him apart, and I think in a big way, both have great hands though and are smooth route-runners

You know something man, the only team that took a TE, in the first round of the 2003 Draft, was the Colts, when they drafted Dallas Clark.

The weirdest thing was that most draft guides had Witten, as the best all-around TE, in that Draft

I wonder what did the Colts, and the other 30 teams, saw in Witten, that they just passed over him that one baffles me to this day.

The Cowboys drafting of Witten, a first round talent in the 3rd round that year was probably the greatest find in their history.

Jerry Jones, would be a fool if he lets him walk after this season but we all know that Witten, will be a very rich man in about three weeks before TC takes place.

As for Fasano, I watched a couple of Norte Dame games last year don't believe everything you read in most draft mags, Fasano, is no slouchy TE, and when did a 4.7, become slow trust me what I saw he too has some speed to get down the seam.

He can beat most LBs, and Safeties in college and I believe he will do that in the NFL.

They said the same thing about Witten, coming out of college about not having any speed to get down the seam but look at the Pro Bowls this "slow" TE went to.

Those of you who never saw Fasano, play at Norte Dame will be pleasantly surprised when he does come into his own in the NFL, he doesn't have the speed of Vernon Davis, but he's going to fit nicely into the Cowboys' offense this season.

 

[ringmaster]

When Witten was drafted the TE was not a featured position as it is now and Witten was not featured at Tennesee.With that said there were some who projected Witten as a possible late first rounder, i still have not figured out why he dropped to the 3rd.

That's is still a mystery to me too.

The TEs, that I remember that year was Dallas Clark, (Iowa) Jason Witten, (Tennessee) and Bennie Joppru, (Michigan).

The only team that could've taken Witten, was the Colts, and if they did rest assure that the Cowboys, would've drafted Clark, in the 3rd round.

That one will be a mystery always to me.

 

[littlewebs]

You know something man, the only team that took a TE, in the first round of the 2003 Draft, was the Colts, when they drafted Dallas Clark.

The weirdest thing was that most draft guides had Witten, as the best all-around TE, in that Draft

I wonder what did the Colts, and the other 30 teams, saw in Witten, that they just passed over him that one baffles me to this day.

The Cowboys drafting of Witten, a first round talent in the 3rd round that year was probably the greatest find in their history.

Jerry Jones, would be a fool if he lets him walk after this season but we all know that Witten, will be a very rich man in about three weeks before TC takes place.

As for Fasano, I watched a couple of Norte Dame games last year don't believe everything you read in most draft mags, Fasano, is no slouchy TE, and when did a 4.7, become slow trust me what I saw he too has some speed to get down the seam.

He can beat most LBs, and Safeties in college and I believe he will do that in the NFL.

They said the same thing about Witten, coming out of college about not having any speed to get down the seam but look at the Pro Bowls this "slow" TE went to.

Those of you who never saw Fasano, play at Norte Dame will be pleasantly surprised when he does come into his own in the NFL, he doesn't have the speed of Vernon Davis, but he's going to fit nicely into the Cowboys' offense this season.

TE's chosen before Witten in 2003:

24th: Dallas Clark
41st: Bennie Joppru (who???)
61st: L.J. Smith
63rd: Teyo Johnson

Witten went 69th.

 

[ringmaster]

Fasano doesn't have the huge upside that Witten had coming out. Fasano is far more polished than Witten coming out.
Fasano will block really well for you and catch 1 or 2 passes a game.

I'm thinking they will use Fasano, as an H-back like you guys use Cooley.

That's just me though.

 

[ringmaster]

Good research, but the projected quality at the top of the 06 class exceeded the 2003 draft. Leonard Pope was to some a sure 1st rounder, but he slipped to the 3rd round because he was pushed there-- 06 had two 1st rounders while 03's first pick, Dallas Clark, was not taken until 24. At the top of the 06 class, Vernon Davis(6) is a freak compared with Clark.

The Niners made a good pick with Davis, he will be known as the fastest TE in the history of the NFL Combine.

But it's different to translate that speed on to the field get ready because Davis, will have alot of balls thrown at him often this season barring injury.

 

[InmanRoshi]

Witten really isn't that great of a pure athlete. He's not in Shockey's, Gates, Gonzales and probably not Heap's league as an athlete. That's why he fell to the 3rd. Again, he tested mostly the same as Fasano ... pretty much the same on straight line speed, a little bit stronger but also a little bit slower in some of the quickness drills. But he's got great hands, great instincts, great feel for the game and runs great routes. That's all you need to beat a linebacker in coverage.

Again, I'm not saying Fasano will be better than Witten. The bar is set a little high there. But this idea that Fasano is this big, lumbering plodder while Witten is this sleek, speedster is inaccurate.

 

[ringmaster]

TE's chosen before Witten in 2003:

24th: Dallas Clark
41st: Bennie Joppru (who???)
61st: L.J. Smith
63rd: Teyo Johnson

Witten went 69th.

Thanks for the research with the exception of Clark, and that's because he's playing with Manning.

The other TEs on the list are a brisk in the wind as compared to Witten.

Johnson, and Smith were drafted based on their speed and neither one are in the same league with even Clark.

 

[ringmaster]

Witten really isn't that great of a pure athlete. He's not a guy that stretches the seam like Gates, Shockey or Gonzales. That's why he fell to the 3rd. Again, he tested mostly the same as Fasano ... pretty much the same on straight line speed, a little bit stronger but also a little bit slower in some of the quickness drills.

But he's got great hands, great instincts, great feel for the game and runs great routes. That's all you need to beat a linebacker in coverage.

But does it really matter if he can't stretch the seam.

Name one of those speed TEs you mentioned that can block and Witten, is decent in that department.

Gonzalez, and Gates were basketball players turned into TEs so they do have that advantage over Witten, and even Shockey.

But that sure didn't stop Witten from going to consecutive Pro-Bowls now did it.

In regards to Gonzalez, and Gates they have to make plays because they're their teams best recievers so you would expect them to have gaudy numbers

In 2004 Witten, had the numbers 980 yds 6 TDs and that was from a "slow" TE.

If he was that slow then why would did the Chargers and other teams try to phase him out of the game rolling LBs, Safeties, and even CBs.

It really doesn't matter to me as long as they can make plays which Witten, has done then he's alright with me.

 

[InmanRoshi]

But does it really matter if he can't stretch the seam.

Name one of those speed TEs you mentioned that can block and Witten, is decent in that department.

Gonzalez, and Gates were basketball players turned into TEs so they do have that advantage over Witten, and even Shockey.

But that sure didn't stop Witten from going to consecutive Pro-Bowls now did it.

In regards to Gonzalez, and Gates they have to make plays because they're their teams best recievers so you would expect them to have gaudy numbers

In 2004 Witten, had the numbers 980 yds 6 TDs and that was from a "slow" TE.

If he was that slow then why would did the Chargers and other teams try to phase him out of the game rolling LBs, Safeties, and even CBs.

It really doesn't matter to me as long as they can make plays which Witten, has done then he's alright with me.

Ugh, I'm not arguing with you. I like Jason Witten a lot. Really. I'm just saying the reason he fell to the 3rd is because he's not that great of a raw athlete. Lucky for us.