The Daklemma

[atlantacowboy]

Derek Carr at 20 million or Dak at 35? What would y’all do

Derek Carr is a better pocket passer than Dak. If Dak ran like Mahomes does when he has too, maybe you could argue Dak gives you an extra dimension to the offense. But, he doesn't.

 

[atlantacowboy]

If we learned anything from last year, it should be that this team is not close to competing for a championship. They just aren't and were just dreadful with the exception of the Rams the entire second half of the season.

I know we won't because McCarthy isn't someone you bring in for a rebuild, but we aren't winning anything with this team the way it's constructed anytime soon.

Why not? He coached some pretty dam good teams and kept GB relevent for over a decade.

 

[erod]

The dilemma is this.

With or without Dak, the prospects of this team don't look good. The window is closing fast, if not already closed.

Dak can't carry a team, and nobody is immediately available who can.

So they'll pay him a bajillion dollars for nothing.

That's the dilemma.

 

[Jake]

Because when enough players go for the gold, the gold runs out. The pie is only so big. And it's all driven by extreme greed.

It's not a player's job to manage the team's salary cap. He's got a few chances to get paid, if he's lucky.

Jerry has worked for decades. Stephen will work for decades. A player's career lasts one decade, if he's lucky.

 

[Diehardblues]

The NFL is no different than any other pro sport. It is all about the stars, what isn't?

Theres a greater disparity in the NFL which the Salary Cap and Rookie contracts have created.

Now that these top drafted stars can’t cash in initially or until 4 or 5 years they are looking for bigger paydays after Rookie contract is up.

 

[Diehardblues]

It's not a player's job to manage the team's salary cap. He's got a few chances to get paid, if he's lucky.

Jerry has worked for decades. Stephen will work for decades. A player's career lasts one decade, if he's lucky.

I totally agree. The Rookie contracts are all owner and team friendly.

Guys like Zeke and Amari at least being 1st round picks were still making well above minimum with tens of millions but lower round picks are stuck if they become stars.

I’m surprised someone hadn’t challenged it legally yet. Dak has been extremely abused financially .

 

[CouchCoach]

The pressure will be on even more on the draft. With so many players in the top 6 paid at their positions and if they let Cooper or Jones walk, they can't have a miss there. And depth will be problematic with older players.

This feeling that the Cowboys are a much better drafting team is really unfounded. They scored on some 1sts with Big Smitty, Jones, Yosemite, Elliott, Martin and Vander Esch, maybe. Gallup and Pollard look like good picks and Smith was a late developing good pick but beyond that, what? Those secondary picks aren't great, the middle of the DL is average or below. They had to bring in Cobb because they lost Beasley and other than Gallup, their WR draft picks have been a stretch to call average. And the TE's ain't nothing to call home about.

Paying their own will keep them from being FA major players so the draft will become more critical and all the while, those top 6 paid players log another season on and Big Smitty is not close to what he used to be so they're going to have to address that as well.

The one thing I never got this past season was this talk about the Cowboys being the most talented team. More talented than 8-8? Yes but barely, this was a 10-6 team at max potential. How could anyone watch this D and lay that all on coaching?

 

[CouchCoach]

Theres a greater disparity in the NFL which the Salary Cap and Rookie contracts have created.

Now that these top drafted stars can’t cash in initially or until 4 or 5 years they are looking for bigger paydays after Rookie contract is up.

The last CBA did that by limiting rookie contracts so the players that have proven themselves can get more. That isn't changing because the rookies have no push. The NFLPA acted on behalf of their largest constituency, the vets.

They've always been about that 2nd contract because most figure that will be their largest and for some, their last. They come into the league playing for that and their agents never let them forget that. Can't you just hear Prescott, Cooper and Jones agents telling them this is what those 4 or 5 seasons were about, everything they done to this point is about this next deal. That's not new, been that was since the cap and FA came into being.

The haves and have not exist in every pro sport, especially in the one with the most players.

 

[Diehardblues]

The last CBA did that by limiting rookie contracts so the players that have proven themselves can get more. That isn't changing because the rookies have no push. The NFLPA acted on behalf of their largest constituency, the vets.

They've always been about that 2nd contract because most figure that will be their largest and for some, their last. They come into the league playing for that and their agents never let them forget that. Can't you just hear Prescott, Cooper and Jones agents telling them this is what those 4 or 5 seasons were about, everything they done to this point is about this next deal. That's not new, been that was since the cap and FA came into being.

The haves and have not exist in every pro sport, especially in the one with the most players.

Yes but this is a newer debacle in the NFL which is watering down the product.

And my intention wasn’t to suggest other professional sports leagues were different. Simply pointing out. Not everyone follows all professional leagues. I believe my initial post said professional sports not just NFL.

 

[Diehardblues]

The dilemma is this.

With or without Dak, the prospects of this team don't look good. The window is closing fast, if not already closed.

Dak can't carry a team, and nobody is immediately available who can.

So they'll pay him a bajillion dollars for nothing.

That's the dilemma.

Unless we could hit a Home Run in the draft ,a journeyman that’s talent weren’t optimized on lesser teams or situations could blossom in this offense or one last hooray by a seasoned veteran .

 

[BBGTYCOON]

Derek Carr at 20 million or Dak at 35? What would y’all do

I'd take Derek and march full speed ahead. That's a dream scenario almost like playing Madden.

 

[Diehardblues]

We’ve seen QB’s have their careers resurrected or blossomed moving to greater teams, offenses and situations before. It’s really not that far of reach.

Guys like Steve Young, Plunkett, Doug Williams go on to win Super Bowls.

We saw Tannehill this year go to a championship game. There’s many others in history who struggled earlier in their careers on lesser teams.

 

[Runwildboys]

We should sign a petition to install a institution (of fans) which replaces the GM. And is chosen in a democratic way by all fans of the Dallas 'boys.

Look at this forum. That'd be like trying to get the Senate to make a decision.

 

[Runwildboys]

He's very forgiving and doesn't hold a grudge. As long as he can hold the remote and a beer.

He's looking over your shoulder as you type, isn't he?

 

[BBGTYCOON]

We can stop the talk that this QB needs support over others. They all need that. Starr, Unitas, Staubach, Montana, Bradshaw, Aikman, Elway, Manning and Brady, which one didn't need support? Too many give it all to Brady and don't consider the D's and DC he's had. That D didn't show up in the playoffs like it has in the past.

The top 100 players of the first 100 years, most of them were on those teams with those QB's.

Is it easier with QB's like that than with Dilfer and Johnson? Sure, but to assume a QB that plays as well as Prescott does and is a very good ball protector, and he really worked on his pocket presence with the fumbles he had the previous season, can't win it all is just bias against the QB.

Would it be easier if the Cowboys had Mahomes? Yes but only one team has him and I don't see a lot like him available. The "don't pay him that much' crowd, who do you want to pay? Where is he? Bring some real options, and going for Burrow or Tua or waiting for Lawrence are not realistic options unless you want to play that lose now to win later mentality. And does Brady fit this offense and is Bridgewater an improvement over Prescott. It is as much about a lack of options as it is this QB and he and his agent know it.

There is no leverage with this FO, none. They will either tag him or sign him. They blink and will again and it is unknown as to the overall effect of his deal on the team at this time.

And there is one thing to consider about this QB that I have not seen with Goff, Garoppolo, Wentz, Watson and even Ryan, Brady, Rivers and Brees. He improved from 2018 to 2019 with a change in coaching. I believe this is an upgrade in coaching and keeping his whisperer is a plus as well. This is a player that works to get better, do you think we've seen the best he has to offer yet?

For the sake of my Cowboys I was thrilled about Dak's improvement this past season but I have to question why it took HIM so long to address those glaringly obvious weaknesses in his game. Was it a hunger to be great, a hunger to get paid or both? Guess we'll see in 9 months.

 

[Runwildboys]

Some complain about that but he explained it one time a I get it. I actually like it and if I want to respond to just part of it, it's easy.

We used to get these posters, more on the old site, that wouldn't even make paragraphs and some refused to use punctuation. It was a game only you didn't win anything for figuring out the puzzle.

Unless you consider a headache to be a prize.

 

[Runwildboys]

Why is everyone forgetting history... EVEN IF you are a Dak fan.. we drafted this dude in the 4th round (for a reason!!) and we plugged him into a legit team and he won the divisional title.. twice in four years.

Why are we soooo convinced that we couldn't do exactly the same thing with a first round QB?!! High rated QBs are making a splash in the NFL faster than ever before.. they are primed to run pro offences from day 1.

I think the Chiefs are a PERFECT template that we need to look at. They had Alex Smith and despite the howls of laughter.. that dude was a solid QB. He put up good numbers, won games.. would have kept KC in the hunt every season he was behind centre. They go out and get Mahomes and he takes them to the next level.

Dak is the Alex Smith in this example. Dak is 'good enough' but he isn't a Superbowl winning level QB.. he would need absolutely everything to be perfect around him and then some. This is not a guy that turns around a game in 9 minutes in the fourth quarter of the SB. He is NOT that guy.

If you want to pay him middle of the road money.. maybe ok.. but it is a no brainer to go out there and start trying to find our guy.. find our Wilson, our Mahomes, our Jackson etc etc.

Dak is not the guy. Full stop. End of Story.

Yes, that's it....Just go get another Mahomes!

 

[Runwildboys]

Good post.

I suggest to you that Jerrah came to an epipheny.

He realized his QB is not who he had hoped.

That he may not ever be that.

So the only way to not have to go out and sign an expensive FA QB..

instead he would pay Dak well but not top dollar money and instead get the best coach he could sign, McCarthy.

Paid him a top contract and fixed the mistake that was Garrett.

So by offering Dak lower money, in Jerrah's mind, Dak is helping pay McCarthy and soon Amari Cooper.

So Dallas is going to stay the course and try to sign Dak to a contract that fits this guideline.

They will offer him $32 mil/yr and if Dak balks..

Tag him for that and let him play in 2020. If he does well, then 2021 becomes his big payday.

If not, the contract numbers tumble and Dak accepts a lower contract.

If not and a FA QB is found or drafted for McCarthy to win with.

Nobody wants to say this but the hiring of McCarthy is the most important move by this franchise.

Not whether Dak is signed or not.

JJ can pay McCarthy as much as he wants without affecting the salary cap. Other than that, I'm with ya.

 

[PAPPYDOG]

Yes, I know, not another Dak thread but this one isn't about paying him or tagging him, it is all based one person's perspective, Big Mike. He has seen first hand what a high % of the cap to the QB can do and he had Tier 1 QB's.

Whether you are a Dakster or Dakater, I think most will agree, he is not a lifter, he needs talent on the field with him as we've seen when the RB1 was missing and there was no WR1.

So if you are this HC, with his experience with QB and salaries, where is the breaking point with Prescott as his QB1? What will paying a 2nd Tier QB 1st Tier money do to his ability to build around him and the D is building around him.

It's not lost on him what they're paying the OL and RB now and he's probably watched a lot of college QB's this past season doing some scouting and evaluating.

I do not doubt he likes Prescott but how much? Does he like him Rodgers, Ryan and Wilson money?

The market has a lot to do with this but if what they do the deal now that puts him in the top 3 now but barely in the top 10 in 2022 and he's not really a top 10 QB?

It is most certainly a dilemma with a QB that you know you need to put the pieces around him but his salary prevents that except for 1st contract players.

The HC's thinking on this is one perspective. Consider the Joneses. What have they said is their biggest regret during the Romo years? Putting the pieces around him.

The other dilemma is the effect of tagging the QB. New HC in his first year and QB maybe in his final. And the assignment is to be better than 2019, the expectations with this hire are as high as they could be from the FO.

And the ultimate dilemma, what's the message tagging sends to the QB, belief or doubt? This is not his first negotiation, the called the last one off with no deal. And the rest of the offense, how do they read a tagging?

No team in the NFL is facing the textbook "damned if you do and damned if you don't" like the Cowboys are this offseason.

There is no Dak dilemma and even Jerry knows he has not PROVEN he is top 5 QB contract material.
In fact, he's had every chance in the book and fallen on his Dak-Face game after important game i.e. the Eagles game for example.
Dude parasites off of massive offense talent and is in the same category as Dalton and Tebow.
The only place he is worthy of a mega-deal is here in the CZ as his Dak-employees remind us daily that its Dak or bust for us.
Tag if he's lucky or major competition from proven VET or a rookie QB if his luck has finally run out.

 

[Runwildboys]

I'm not so sure. I remember Aikman losing 2 in a row without Emmitt. And the struggles when The Playmaker was out. Last time I checked #8 is still in the HOF.

#8 was incredibly accurate when he had a clean pocket, and was the unquestioned leader of the team, even more than his second coach. But he was much like Brady, in that he wasn't particularly mobile, so when he started getting hit, his accuracy suffered greatly.