Twitter: Stephen Jones admits they would have reached for a cornerback had Horn or Surtain been there

[Big_D]

Alot of teams said??? bahahahhah. Im sure a lot of teams said Claiborne was a for sure bet prior to the draft his year also. You obviously dont pay attention. Please show me where I said JG was great? NOWHERE will you find such a claim. A difference in the Dline? Considering they havent played a single game yet..... but you see some huge difference? Are you at camp evaluating this great improvement int he dline? If not, you cant say one way or the other,... you are going by youtube videos and OTHERS ACTUAL OPINION.

And this guy... Randy Gregory might have a little to do with Dline improvement. Good thing Big Mike went out and got him.

Good thing they took a head case who is finally starting to come around 7 years later? lol I don't know how they'd survive? So coaches need great players to win, but how you actually build and evaluate the team means nothing? Got it. Garrett was a joke. It's not hate, it's the reality of the situation after 13 years. Yes, there's already a difference in just 2 years. Claiborne wasn't worth the trade up. Another stupid move in a long line. Did they trade 2 picks for Parsons? They even grabbed an extra 3rd. You could pretend the same thing is happening here, but I won't really be surprised when you're wrong!!


You really don't see a difference compared to a team that took 1 2nd rounder, 1 3rd rounder and 4 7th rounders at DT in 13 seasons? I got a bridge to sell you!

 

[Kwyn]

Again, they all do the same thing. Watch how good the chargers gm is about to get at doing all those things you just listed. . He must have taken extra gm zoom courses over the past year.

Your argument is wrong
You are wrong
This entire thread is wrong

 

[Reid1boys]

Yeah. I don’t believe it’s “just dumb luck”. Sorry any amount of responses you give me isn’t going to convince me that the Jones’ are fine GM’s. They’re just unlucky.

Good thing they took a head case who is finally starting to come around 7 years later? lol I don't know how they'd survive? So coaches need great players to win, but how you actually build and evaluate the team means nothing? Got it. Garrett was a joke. It's not hate, it's the reality of the situation after 13 years. Yes, there's already a difference in just 2 years. Claiborne wasn't worth the trade up. Another stupid move in a long line. Did they trade 2 picks for Parsons? They even grabbed an extra 3rd. You could pretend the same thing is happening here, but I won't really be surprised when you're wrong!!


You really don't see a difference compared to a team that took 1 2nd rounder, 1 3rd rounder and 4 7th rounders at DT in 13 seasons? I got a bridge to sell you!

\I saw 8-8 last year and a defense that had holes like a cheese grater. When I see a difference on the FIELD then Ill actually say there is a defensive improvement. Every year we hear how great they look in CAMP. Thats like saying I look amazing on a speed back.. then when I get in ring I learn the other guy hits back.

Who said you dont evaluate and have a plan to build a team? Try not to put words in my mouth. If you want to quote me, fine, otherwise stop making stupid comments and attributing them to me.

And Randy isnt a head case, he was working on his mental health just Like Osaka and Biles... hes a real champion and pillar of strength like those two American Heroes.

 

[Reid1boys]

Claiborne is trash and cornerbacks are not worth top 5 picks unless they're generational talents. Fletcher Cox would've been the right pick there.

Generational talents??? Like a Darrel Green??? Who was a generational talent... so much so it was obvious to all that 27 teams passed right over him to draft the likes of Tim Lewis, Leonard Smith, Joey Browner, and dont forget the generational talent of Gill Byrd. Those were all the CBs drafted before one of the greatest cornerbacks to ever play in the NFL... and it was so obvious to all he would be that great, wasnt it. Those guys above actually had decent NFL careers, but they werent close to Darrel Green.
So tell me more about the great evaluations that take place and how easy it was to know that one player would be a HOF top 4 to ever play his position, vs the greart Leonard Smith.

 

[Reid1boys]

Improvement? From what, a totally decimated OL, washed up 2nd string QB, a defense devoid of talent, and a new coaching staff, on top of a pandemic year with all that entailed?? Any noticeable improvement from a mess like that would've required a miracle.
You don't expect much do ya?

If this year produces no marked improvement, then I'll be at the front of the line with you looking for a HC, but till then he deserves a fair chance.

I dont disagree with you here... change for the sake of change means nothing.... but, the team will not rise or fall depending on anything Big Mike does. He isnt reinventing the wheel, and there is NOTHING he can do or say that every other team and coaching staff in the NFL doesnt do on a weekly basis. Im sure after week 3 the Eagles coaching staff is gonna get on that plane going home and be shaking their heads talking to themselves saying... damn, that was a whole new football they were using. WTH did we just see?

 

[Reid1boys]

I fall more on the “rational” results side than I do on the homer side. WTBS, with your logic, you shouldn’t watch until after they perform and reach a title game. Wait until they perform well and win a NFC championship, then jump on that wagon back into town. Or you can see that with the new staff additions, and the new players they have brought in this off season, they’ve actually done a lot of the stuff that fans like you and me have been screaming for them to do.

Other than one more good vet OL, I’m good with the additions. I’m not the fan who is good on bringing in retread QB’s for backups, it NEVER works out and is a waste of money. Every competing team is a franchise QB injury away from looking like the 2020 Cowboys. After watching every second of TC so far this year, I really think they drafted well to fill some major holes.

We will be better on defense for sure. Quinn alone makes it a different team. The DL with Gregory being full time is way better. The LB’s are trending up because #9 won’t be who we are relying on, Parsons is for real. The DB’s are young and being lead buy a true shutdown corner in Diggs. Most importantly, they have finally decided the safety position is important, and worth investing in.

Which player, or what position do you think should have been brought in? What are the things you don’t think were addressed?

I agree with you on back up QBs. Just draft some young stud out of college in round 6ish every year. A career back up isnt gonna due squat if forced into long term playing time anyways... we know what those guys are. BUT, a young kid that nobody has seen?? That just might turn out to be a decent QB. You know there are Kurt Warners out there that just never get an opportunity. If Trent Green doesnt get hurt that pre season, Kurt Warner may have never been more than a back up qb.

 

[CouchCoach]

I think it turned out great with parsons and getting Joseph in the 2nd

I am fine with it. Got to stop the run first.

 

[CouchCoach]

Well, Horn is in CAR and Surtain is in DEN and Parsons is in DAL and DAL had the opportunity to trade up for either.

What's next from this clown? We were going to sign Brady or trade for Rodgers, Watson or Wilson but they weren't available so we paid Prescott 160M.

We didn't want to pay a RB that much money with two years left.....but we did anyway.

It's probably not a good idea to invest in your LB's business.....but we did it anyway........and we gave him a new contract because Daddy said he's our cornerstone and Daddy's the boss.

 

[HungryLion]

Is it fair to grade someone on things beyond their control using hindsight?

Is it fair for someone to say to a couple that one will grade them after one sees the baby years later?

Is it fair to grade the GM and Vice President of player personnel, based on if the team actually wins or not?

yes I think it is.

 

[TheDude]

if only we followed that recipe to land the HOF qb. Its so easy. How many the Dolphins had after Marino? How has the Broncos QB hunt gone since Elway? How bout Cleveland? The Jets? Strangely(except for Manning led Broncos) none of those teams have any SB wins? hmmm, no qb, no sb.. imagine that? I could name more, but we all know it wont matter.

Trent Dilfer, Brad Johnson, Joe Flacco, Nick Foles, Eli Manning (x2).

Tom Brady is not elite now. He is efficient and still the GOAT, but no one would take him over Mahomes and Rogers at this point. Tom had the choice and went with what he saw as the best team (constructed by someone), Explain how Tom Brady made Drew Brees post a 38.1 Rating in the playoffs; Sacked Rogers 5 times and made the Packers not go for on 4th and Goal an sacked Mahomes 3 times; 10 additional hits; 9 passes defended and throw 2 Ints.


Maybe Brad Johnson is better than Marino...he was impressive in 2008; but maybe having 3 1st Rd Def linemen (Sapp, Rice, MacFarland); Derrick Brooks, Lynch played a role. Sure R Barber was a great player for that team, but a 3rd rd pick who like most CBs, benefitted from an elite front 7

 

[TheDude]

But he has a SB title... and dont you forget it, and he isnt JG, and he doesnt clap and cheer on his players, and he doesnt have red hair. He must be an improvement over who was here. Last year he didnt get to have a real training camp and he had to deal with covid, and IM pretty sure he was the only coach in the league that had those conditions..... at least thats what I read in here.

Explain Washington and getting curb stomped by a team on its 3rd string QB


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[HungryLion]

Trent Dilfer, Brad Johnson, Joe Flacco, Nick Foles, Eli Manning (x2).

Tom Brady is not elite now. He is efficient and still the GOAT, but no one would take him over Mahomes and Rogers at this point. Tom had the choice and went with what he saw as the best team (constructed by someone), Explain how Tom Brady made Drew Brees post a 38.1 Rating in the playoffs; Sacked Rogers 5 times and made the Packers not go for on 4th and Goal an sacked Mahomes 3 times; 10 additional hits; 9 passes defended and throw 2 Ints.


Maybe Brad Johnson is better than Marino...he was impressive in 2008; but maybe having 3 1st Rd Def linemen (Sapp, Rice, MacFarland); Derrick Brooks, Lynch played a role. Sure R Barber was a great player for that team, but a 3rd rd pick who like most CBs, benefitted from an elite front 7

Mahomes and Rodgers were obviously intimidated by Brady’s presence on the sidelines.

 

[Batman1980]

Is it fair to grade the GM and Vice President of player personnel, based on if the team actually wins or not?

yes I think it is.

It's certainly what I grade Jason Garrett's 13 years in Dallas on.

 

[TheDude]

Mahomes and Rodgers were obviously intimidated by Brady’s presence on the sidelines.

Obviously. They couldnt even see JPP and Shaq Barret for being lost in Tom's dreamy eyes from afar

 

[Reid1boys]

Trent Dilfer, Brad Johnson, Joe Flacco, Nick Foles, Eli Manning (x2).

Tom Brady is not elite now. He is efficient and still the GOAT, but no one would take him over Mahomes and Rogers at this point. Tom had the choice and went with what he saw as the best team (constructed by someone), Explain how Tom Brady made Drew Brees post a 38.1 Rating in the playoffs; Sacked Rogers 5 times and made the Packers not go for on 4th and Goal an sacked Mahomes 3 times; 10 additional hits; 9 passes defended and throw 2 Ints.


Maybe Brad Johnson is better than Marino...he was impressive in 2008; but maybe having 3 1st Rd Def linemen (Sapp, Rice, MacFarland); Derrick Brooks, Lynch played a role. Sure R Barber was a great player for that team, but a 3rd rd pick who like most CBs, benefitted from an elite front 7

do not bring up a QB that had a defense considered to be HISTORICALLY great.... it does nto help your argument in the slightest. I guess you keep missing the point that 20% of the Fing time a non HOF qb will win a SB. Say that again..... 20% of the time, an Eli, A foles, a Johnson will win the SB.... are you mising that ... here, let me say it again.... 20% of the time a non HOF QB will win a SB. So now go ahead and piint back to another non HOF qb that won a SB, it might make your point for you.....smh.

Lets say this again..... 4 times in the PAST SIX SEASONS that great BUC defense finished in last place in the division prior to Brady's arrival. So go ahead and keep talking up how the Bucs GM had separated himself from all the other GMs out there and constructed a true winner.

You want to use Mahomes.... perfect. The chiefs were also just another team..... good players... but zero threat at a SB title. Mahomes shows up, 3 straight afc title games and 2 straight SB appearances. But tell me more about their great coaching and great front office. If you say it enough I might start believing that nonsense.

 

[Reid1boys]

Explain Washington and getting curb stomped by a team on its 3rd string QB


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lay off the drugs DUDE.... you obviously missed what I was doing there....lol

 

[CowboyFrog]

Trent Dilfer, Brad Johnson, Joe Flacco, Nick Foles, Eli Manning (x2).

Tom Brady is not elite now. He is efficient and still the GOAT, but no one would take him over Mahomes and Rogers at this point. Tom had the choice and went with what he saw as the best team (constructed by someone), Explain how Tom Brady made Drew Brees post a 38.1 Rating in the playoffs; Sacked Rogers 5 times and made the Packers not go for on 4th and Goal an sacked Mahomes 3 times; 10 additional hits; 9 passes defended and throw 2 Ints.


Maybe Brad Johnson is better than Marino...he was impressive in 2008; but maybe having 3 1st Rd Def linemen (Sapp, Rice, MacFarland); Derrick Brooks, Lynch played a role. Sure R Barber was a great player for that team, but a 3rd rd pick who like most CBs, benefitted from an elite front 7

Defense matters..Bob posted a great thread on how our GM views defense....

 

[Reid1boys]

Defense matters..Bob posted a great thread on how our GM views defense....

yep, that defense was amazing in the previous years before Brady arrived in Bucs world. They made the playoffs,......... exactly zero times in the previous 12 years prior to Brady. Cant imagine how poor they would have done if they didnt have that D.

 

[Loso86]

Uh ah ah ah ah.

Your wording of Reached is a stretch and that's how negative stuff gets started with the media and articles lol smh

 

[TheDude]

do not bring up a QB that had a defense considered to be HISTORICALLY great.... it does nto help your argument in the slightest. I guess you keep missing the point that 20% of the Fing time a non HOF qb will win a SB. Say that again..... 20% of the time, an Eli, A foles, a Johnson will win the SB.... are you mising that ... here, let me say it again.... 20% of the time a non HOF QB will win a SB. So now go ahead and piint back to another non HOF qb that won a SB, it might make your point for you.....smh.

Lets say this again..... 4 times in the PAST SIX SEASONS that great BUC defense finished in last place in the division prior to Brady's arrival. So go ahead and keep talking up how the Bucs GM had separated himself from all the other GMs out there and constructed a true winner.

You want to use Mahomes.... perfect. The chiefs were also just another team..... good players... but zero threat at a SB title. Mahomes shows up, 3 straight afc title games and 2 straight SB appearances. But tell me more about their great coaching and great front office. If you say it enough I might start believing that nonsense.

A whole defense being historically great doesnt help my argument that someone with GM as a title constructed .... ??. OK.

I guess we will just overlook NE #1 Defense in 2003 yielding < 14 pts per game, or 2004 when they were 3rd in pts allowed Turnovers (Bellicheck just a lucky DefCor) , or 2005 When Pitt had the 3rd ranked Def in pts, TO, YPP against Ben playing 12 games and amassing 2385 yards and 17 TD and 9 INTs. I guess Ben had to overcome the #1 defense in 2008 as well when he posted a 80.1 rating and 17TDs vs 15INTs. What was GBs Defe Ranked in 2010 , yup, #2.

Seattle - #1 Defense in Yards, TO, YPP.. Of course all this is meaningless because in your argument, Dallas could have won anything with Rich Kotite and Bruce Allen Jr as GM in the early 1990s - because Jimmy just was on a lucky roll, huh.

As for recent Bucs....He hired Bruce Arians, jettisoned 30 INT QB Winston for Brady, signed Gronk, Brown, JPP, Suh, Shaq Barrett Fournette. Drafted Devin White with the 5th overall in 2019, drafted MIke Evans, Chris Godwin, Tristen Wirfs and Vita Vea.

I mean it is no Trysten Hill, but I would take that action

As for KC. They have the 10th most wins since 2000 in the NFL and 5 most since 2010. How has that QB situation been the past 20 years.

Are you just shaking a magic eight ball and blathering any thought that comes to your head or do you actually watch the game of football?