2 Questions For the Zoners Who Want to Let Moore Go

[Ken]

So Dak couldn't step up when needed to is what you are saying. I agree.

SF scored 23 points in last year's playoff game, 7 of those points in part because of a Dak INT....and SF scored 19 points this playoff game, 6 of those points in part because of Dak's 2 INT's......so without the turnovers the Dallas defense held SF to 28 points in 2 games for an average of 14 points/game....and Dak lost both games....period.

Yes, Dak lost.

Dak beat the Bucs.

 

[Ken]

My argument???? You are the one repeating the same half-truth talking point to defend a mediocre overpaid choke of a QB.

K guy.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Oh yes, the TB game that you and others point to as 'proof' Dak is great.....so Dak can beat up on an 8-9 team playing piss-poor football and barely limped into the playoffs.......so Dak beat up on the slow fat kid and that is supposed to mean something? Interesting how when there is a viable opponent Dak sucks it hard.

I didn’t say it’s proof Dak is great. Dak was top 10 prior to that game.

Dak doesn’t beat teams, teams beat teams.

Brady is better than Dak why didn’t he win? Is Dak 19 points better than Brady?

 

[G2]

You didn't answer either question.

Because your mind is made up! Silly questions.

 

[TwentyOne]

For all the people who want to ditch Moore, help me understand. If you drop the Andy Dalton year, the last 3 years the Cowboys have been 4th,
1st and 6th in scoring. For those 3 years combined, the Cowboys are 2nd in scoring only behind KC.
The OC accomplished this with a QB that everyone but those completely in the tank for Dak agrees has fatal limitations, torpedoed
our post season this year with turnovers, and ended our post season last year with the stupidest in game decision I've seen since.....well ever.

Seems like the obvious problem is the QB not the OC, and if anything this OC has over achieved.

My 2 questions to the legion of Zoners who want to ditch Moore are:
1. Given Dak's liabilities, what exactly do you think a new OC will realistically accomplish that Moore hasn't already accomplished?
2. Given how profilic Moore's offenses have been compared to those of other OC's, do you realize it's likely that any offense under a new OC
will be worse not better?

If you are not sure if the climate changes who you gonna believe ? The 10.000+ scientists or the oil industry ? Of course the latter because they are independent ;-)
Same with Moore and the Dak fanboys. Of course Moore is the problem because Dak is the one who made us have such great stats.

But seriously i too think we should keep Moore. Because he is a very good OC who is very limited with a bad QB but still is able to give us a very productive offense.
We always make the same mistake: first it was Callahan who was the scapegoat, then Linehan, Garrett and now Moore. We listen to mediots instead of looking at the one constant.

The QB position is a very important one. And football has the same mentallity like in the army: Principle of order and obedience. Rah rah rah, dont question just execute. And its a taboo to question your leader. Thats a big problem when your leader is a bum.

 

[Romo_To_Dez]

Some posters here think you can only do one thing at a time. I suppose they have never heard of multitasking. We can literally change OCs AND draft a QB this year or next year to get ready for 2025. But an OC change is needed, especially when one of the top defences literally said days before the game that they knew what was coming and proved that they weren't joking.

Like some many on here love to point out when defenders talk about Dak's limitations. Just like they mentioned the 49ers defender who said that Dak had a problem with Zone defense. When plenty of defenders have talked about how predictable the Cowboys offense was or how they knew that was coming. Which is on the play calling. I'm open to the Cowboys drafting a new QB, but does anyone believe that the new QB could thrive under Kellen Moore's current play calling style? Or with Kellen Moore not being able to scheme weapons open and constantly calling curl routes.

If Kellen Moore is fired and no one else picks him up, than that would mean other teams seeing how the issue isn't solely with Dak, but because they see limitations to his play calling or ability to learn more as an OC. If he does get another chance with another team, then we would be able to see whether or not the theory of how his play calling is all on Dak is true or now. Oe if he would have the ability to call and develop different plays with a new QB and offense.

 

[Romo_To_Dez]

Well just going by what we have seen, without Dak this offense is bottom tier... Most likley answer is we have seen the best that Dak/KM can do and it isnt good enough.
2nd and most important point, Dak is not going anywhere without a major team over haul, you can however change the OC and see if that works. This defense is worth trying the OC change in my opinion as moving on from Dak is going to cost you this defense and again if this FO had shown it could retool a defense quickly i would no problem with it. I am not down for another 15 years of mediocre defense as they jack around while blowing up the team cap.

We have seen what Kellen Moore's offenses are capable of without Dak, both with Andy Dalton and with Cooper Rush, they were bottom of the NFL or weren't nearly as productive as they were with Dak. And Dak with Linehan had one of his best seasons as a rookie. So Dak is at least capable of putting up productive numbers without Kellen Moore, but Kellen Moore isn't shown to put up productive numbers without Dak.

Since the Cowboys are stuck with Dak for the next couple of years, the only choice which remains an option is to change the OC to see what happens. While also drafting a QB in the near future just in case Dak does not work out.

 

[CowboyFrog]

We have seen what Kellen Moore's offenses are capable of without Dak, both with Andy Dalton and with Cooper Rush, they were bottom of the NFL or weren't nearly as productive as they were with Dak. And Dak with Linehan had one of his best seasons as a rookie. So Dak is at least capable of putting up productive numbers without Kellen Moore, but Kellen Moore isn't shown to put up productive numbers without Dak.

Since the Cowboys are stuck with Dak for the next couple of years, the only choice which remains an option is to change the OC to see what happens. While also drafting a QB in the near future just in case Dak does not work out.

Its your only option that does not include blowing up a damn good defense, it is what it is.

 

[JBS]

Some people need to realize you can only do so much with a flawed QB....

AS LONG AS THE Cowboys keep going woke...they will stay broke.

Read the thread. Nobody is defending dak. We are stuck

 

[JBS]

You're right, time to let Dak go.

I’m not against it. Dumb and dumber are

 

[JBS]

But what if this is the best you can get out of Dak? I want to see Moore gone only to see who the real culprit is. Dak has had 2 OCs whether some like them or not. Maybe, the third time is the charm. I just hate for it to turn into the Baker Mayfield OC trial and error.

If it is you lose nothing. That’s the point. It’s broken as is

 

[Whirlwin]

For all the people who want to ditch Moore, help me understand. If you drop the Andy Dalton year, the last 3 years the Cowboys have been 4th,
1st and 6th in scoring. For those 3 years combined, the Cowboys are 2nd in scoring only behind KC.
The OC accomplished this with a QB that everyone but those completely in the tank for Dak agrees has fatal limitations, torpedoed
our post season this year with turnovers, and ended our post season last year with the stupidest in game decision I've seen since.....well ever.

Seems like the obvious problem is the QB not the OC, and if anything this OC has over achieved.

My 2 questions to the legion of Zoners who want to ditch Moore are:
1. Given Dak's liabilities, what exactly do you think a new OC will realistically accomplish that Moore hasn't already accomplished?
2. Given how profilic Moore's offenses have been compared to those of other OC's, do you realize it's likely that any offense under a new OC
will be worse not better?

He is just too easy to figure out. We are simply a vanilla offense

 

[Whirlwin]

You wrote down the issue w Moore yourself. He can’t get the most out of Dak. Period. Somebody else needs to try.

More than that. He is predictable from other coordinators.

 

[Stak78]

The only reason we are discussing whether to keep Moore is because how well the offense has performed as far as stats. However, the lack of being able to execute screens, misdirection and any trick plays is a huge red flag. At times the pass offense looks great, except when it really matters. The run scheme has taken a huge step back. Moore struggles to call the right play in critical points in the game. I will defer to Bill Parcells recent take on Kellen Moore. Dak's play is a huge issue, but Kellen did him no favors.

 

[BoysForLife]

This is not a defense of Dak, but trying to use Linehan to try to prove a point is not helping your point. Linehan has been out of the league, but that wasn't because of Dak, his concepts were tried and old.

His concepts worked pretty well with daks predecessor IMO

Cowboy offense was prolific in 2014

 

[Captain-Crash]

hum, my memory might be flawed, but I remember guys in here saying we should simplify the offense as we did for Rush because the offense was too much for dak. We tried but egos got in the way and we couldn't do that. Our problem is we have a quarterback who thinks he's better than he is. shrugs. The new offensive coordinator will be the scapegoat next year then fat mike. Oh well, same crap different years.

 

[Romo_To_Dez]

Yes, Dak lost.

Dak beat the Bucs.

So some in this thread points to Dak's poor performances against the 49ers and his inability to score points against their defense for the reason he isn't the answer. Which again IMO I myself have no problem with the idea of moving on from Dak eventually. But at the same time say that Kellen Moore deserves the benefit of the doubt to be remain the Cowboys OC for years to come, even when we have seen have limited his offenses have been in scoring/production with Cooper Rush and Andy Dalton? Both QBs who this forum deemed to be much better than Dak. And yet they can't put up bigger and better numbers than Dak, despite some insisting that Dak is the problem and not at all Kellen Moore.

They point to the Cowboys having the number one offense with Kellen Moore, but would he have the number one offense with Andy Dalton or Cooper Rush under center? I ask mainly because of those who insisted that both of these QBs were better than Dak.. So if that were the case, then Moore should be able to put up equal to or better offensive results with them, than he has been able to put up with Dak.

 

[CowboyFrog]

His concepts worked pretty well with daks predecessor IMO

Cowboy offense was prolific in 2014

Did we win in 2014? again i find it hard to "Filter" our playoffs failures but i guess if i squint hard enough I can define all of them in whatever light i like. Did 2014 and 2016 not look like groundhog day... great running attack, PA passing game, Watch A-Rod move on....Im aquinting i swear.

 

[Romo_To_Dez]

Did we win in 2014? again i find it hard to "Filter" our playoffs failures but i guess if i squint hard enough I can define all of them in whatever light i like. Did 2014 and 2016 not look like groundhog day... great running attack, PA passing game, Watch A-Rod move on....Im aquinting i swear.

The coaching and offensive play calling was questioned or blamed as a big reason for why the Cowboys couldn't get over the hump with Romo. Now some consider Kellen Moore to be the scapegoat of Dak. Yet don't apply that same logic to say how the number of coaching changes which occurred under Romo, were the scapegoat of the Cowboys being unable to get past the divisional round with him as the QB.

Interesting enough. Both Romo and Dak are viewed as QBs who puts up great offensive stats in the regular season, but chokes or doesn't get it done in the playoffs when it matters the most.

 

[Captain-Crash]

Moore sucked so bad he won 4 games with a guy with a limited arm against very good teams. . I guess we need to get rid of him because he can't force dak to run the plays and process what he sees on the field.