2008 Rookie Corner Class (how they performed statistically)

[Bob Sacamano]

that doesn't matter when in the next play they score anyways because they are so close to the end zone BECAUSE of him. in other words, it doesn't matter that he didn't give up that "ultimate big play" when the other team still has more chances for 6 because of his "normal" big plays.

that's alot of assumptions though

you're assuming the big plays he gives up puts the opposition in a position to score

and you're assuming the 10-12 completions that he gave up, resulted in the other team scoring on that drive

 

[burmafrd]

What I would like to see is first down receptions allowed on 3rd downs.
That is the real killer.

 

[AdamJT13]

#1 rule of defense

keep the opponent out of the endzone

Let's say you're up by six points with two minutes remaining, and your opponent has the ball at its own 15-yard line.

Cornerback A gets targeted six times, allows six completions for 83 yards, giving your opponent a first-and-goal at your 2-yard line with 12 seconds left.

On first-and-goal, Cornerback B gets targeted for the first time on the drive, and he allows a 2-yard TD catch. You end up losing by one point.

Of the two cornerbacks, who was more responsible for losing the game?

 

[Bob Sacamano]

Let's say you're up by six points with two minutes remaining, and your opponent has the ball at its own 15-yard line.

Cornerback A gets targeted six times, allows six completions for 83 yards, giving your opponent a first-and-goal at your 2-yard line with 12 seconds left.

On first-and-goal, Cornerback B gets targeted for the first time on the drive, and he allows a 2-yard TD catch. You end up losing by one point.

Of the two cornerbacks, who was more responsible for losing the game?

both
.

 

[zeroburrito]

Let's say you're up by six points with two minutes remaining, and your opponent has the ball at its own 15-yard line.

Cornerback A gets targeted six times, allows six completions for 83 yards, giving your opponent a first-and-goal at your 2-yard line with 12 seconds left.

On first-and-goal, Cornerback B gets targeted for the first time on the drive, and he allows a 2-yard TD catch. You end up losing by one point.

Of the two cornerbacks, who was more responsible for losing the game?

yay! you explain things much better than i do. this is exactly what i meant though.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

yay! you explain things much better than i do. this is exactly what i meant though.

seriously though, why stop at CB A? why not say DE A was more responsible for not getting to the QB and sacking him, or pressuring the QB to throw the ball away?

 

[zeroburrito]

seriously though, why stop at CB A? why not say DE A was more responsible for not getting to the QB and sacking him, or pressuring the QB to throw the ball away?

pressuring and sacking are good plays. them not doing either is pretty normal on a play to play basis, especially in a single drive. getting burned for that much in 1 drive is not normal, it's horrendous. we are talking about the cb position anyways. meaning it would be totally their fault for each play given up, including the touchdown throw at cb 2(for the sake of comparing the importance of yards given up to touchdowns).

 

[Galian Beast]

anyone have weighed stats as in against 1st 2nd and 3rd receivers...

 

[SaltwaterServr]

you know how td's are scored? all of the yards taking them near the goal line. they don't just happen(long bombs and runs happen, but not often).

washington has a really bad qb that can't throw the ball.

And are those yards worth a flying monkey turd if points don't result? No.

You know how many teams won a game by out gaining their opponents in yards but scoring less points?

How important were all of those extra yards we had gained over Arizona? St. Louis? Pittsburgh?

Does the fact that we had only 5 fewer yards than Philadelphia make 44-6 seem any closer of a game?

How about Tampa Bay? You think they take solace in the fact they had 30% more yards gained than we did? Hmmm? Think that made them feel better about the loss?

Yards mean jack * without the points that win games.

 

[SaltwaterServr]

Let's say you're up by six points with two minutes remaining, and your opponent has the ball at its own 15-yard line.

Cornerback A gets targeted six times, allows six completions for 83 yards, giving your opponent a first-and-goal at your 2-yard line with 12 seconds left.

On first-and-goal, Cornerback B gets targeted for the first time on the drive, and he allows a 2-yard TD catch. You end up losing by one point.

Of the two cornerbacks, who was more responsible for losing the game?

Oh! Mr. Adam! Mr. Adam, I know the answer! I know this one! Pick me! Pick me! Come on Mr. Adam, back here! I know this one! Mr. Adam!!! Missssterrrrr Adam!!!! I know this one!

Jacques Reeves!

 

[AdamJT13]

seriously though, why stop at CB A? why not say DE A was more responsible for not getting to the QB and sacking him, or pressuring the QB to throw the ball away?

The question was posed about which of the two players was more responsible. One or the other. If you want to include a third player, feel free. But most people realize which of the two cornerbacks played worse on that drive, all other things being equal. Some are just afraid to admit it.

 

[BBWC]

Very nice link. Once again I'm stunned by what a great year Corey Webster had, probably the best statistical season for any Giants CB in history. He'll be hard pressed to repeat such an unbelievable performance again, but if he comes close he should get the pro bowl bid which he was robbed of the year before.

 

[theogt]

Very nice link. Once again I'm stunned by what a great year Corey Webster had, probably the best statistical season for any Giants CB in history. He'll be hard pressed to repeat such an unbelievable performance again, but if he comes close he should get the pro bowl bid which he was robbed of the year before.

No kidding. That's all time great territory if he can keep up that level of play.

Cortland Finnegan had a crazy good year too. Not bad for a 7th round pick in his 3rd season.

 

[EPL0c0]

I think Jerry found a couple of gems, especially Scandrick. I'd rather have 2 guys that are about evenly consistant than 1 superstar and 1 scrub

 

[Bob Sacamano]

The question was posed about which of the two players was more responsible. One or the other. If you want to include a third player, feel free. But most people realize which of the two cornerbacks played worse on that drive, all other things being equal. Some are just afraid to admit it.

that's better than the "who was more responsible" argument, since if both give up 10 yard completions, and CB B's completion allowed ends up being a TD

but that's not even what's at issue, Adam

for a rookie who was targeted so much, the success rate for TDs against him was on par with most of the rookies in his class

 

[jterrell]

that's better than the "who was more responsible" argument, since if both give up 10 yard completions, and CB B's completion allowed ends up being a TD

but that's not even what's at issue, Adam

for a rookie who was targeted so much, the success rate for TDs against him was on par with most of the rookies in his class

Any way you want to add the stats up Porter had a poor rookie seaosn but it was only 5 games.

As I mentioned it is very likely he gave up huge cushions and thus allowed far too many easy completions in front of him but kept the guy from getting open for TDs.

I can promise you if Porter performs again this year as he did last he will not be starting very long. No CB can allow over 8 yards per completion or 80 yards per game and hold onto a job.

 

[jterrell]

Very nice link. Once again I'm stunned by what a great year Corey Webster had, probably the best statistical season for any Giants CB in history. He'll be hard pressed to repeat such an unbelievable performance again, but if he comes close he should get the pro bowl bid which he was robbed of the year before.

He was vastly better than TNew, Bailey or Samuel last year.

 

[jterrell]

I'd assume those 3 were the killers

yes, he was targeted 8.2 times a games, we know that

Metrics are awesome but they lose all effect if we do not know the measurements used to create them.

 

[DFWJC]

Using the info provided by Theo, I created a formula that took into account completions per game allowed, YPC against, TD against rate, Completion % against, and Plays on Ball Rate. From that, these are the rankings I got for the players.

Chevis Jackson - 13.25
Orlando Scandrick - 12.54
Aqib Talib - 12.16
Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie - 11.02
Brandon Flowers - 10.74
Antoine Cason - 10.23
Mike Jenkins - 9.99
Terrell Thomas - 8.73
Leodis McKelvin - 8.42
Tracy Porter - 4.52

The group average was 10.16.

Really, Tracy Porter is the only one who was far below average.

Just goes to show again how so many times there's not much difference between the guys taken in rd1 and in rd 3 or so.

Eleven corners were we taken before Chevis Jackson. Nice get by Atlanta.
Twenty-four corners were taken before Scandrick. Now that's a bargain!

 

[Bob Sacamano]

Metrics are awesome but they lose all effect if we do not know the measurements used to create them.

I did the math, and if Tracy Porter played 16 games, he was likely to be targeted 131 times

that's unreal