2012 NBA Playoffs Thread

[Cowboys&LakersFan]

you know, I forgot all about Kupcake....he is to blame as well....but didnt stern nix some trades to begin the season, especially one to get Chris Paul?

Yeah screw Stern. That nixed trade could potentially set our franchise back years if not decades.

 

[casmith07]

you know, I forgot all about Kupcake....he is to blame as well....but didnt stern nix some trades to begin the season, especially one to get Chris Paul?

Stern did the Lakers a favor by nixing that trade, but the Lakers screwed it up by trading away Odom and Fisher.

They should have acquired Goran Dragic as a backup or starter with Fisher playing the backup role, and played through with Odom as their 6th man. Being able to go big with Kobe, Artest, Odom, Gasol, and Bynum on the floor down the stretch would completely outmatch OKC's roster, as well as match up very favorably against the Spurs...but they're pretty content on turning into the Western Conference version of the Cleveland Cavaliers. Length wins in the playoffs when the talent is close, and experience even moreso than that. Plus, Odom had a habit of playing big in the playoffs whereas Gasol, other than the year that the Lakers beat the Magic, has a habit of disappearing.

Their only saving grace is if they are able to somehow get Dwight Howard and Deron Williams, and they won't be able to get both. I would say to bring back Lamar Odom after this year too, but he'll probably be damned before he re-signs with the Lakers after the way they did him. I could see him playing for the Clips next year...but there's no guarantee that Chris Paul even signs an extension with the Clippers, and their front office has a penchant for blowing up the team over and over again.

If I were a die hard Lakers fan I'd be pretty upset with what they've done to the team. They didn't want to part with Bynum, when Orlando would've traded Bynum for Howard straight up. Just stupid.

And this has nothing to do with Mike Brown as a coach - he's a really good coach, especially defensively. Offensively the Lakers have also had no problem scoring points and moving the basketball. The fact of this series is simply that the Lakers talent is just thin. The only people on that roster that are mentally tough right now are Kobe and Artest.

 

[Cowboys&LakersFan]

Stern did the Lakers a favor by nixing that trade, but the Lakers screwed it up by trading away Odom and Fisher.

They should have acquired Goran Dragic as a backup or starter with Fisher playing the backup role, and played through with Odom as their 6th man. Being able to go big with Kobe, Artest, Odom, Gasol, and Bynum on the floor down the stretch would completely outmatch OKC's roster, as well as match up very favorably against the Spurs...but they're pretty content on turning into the Western Conference version of the Cleveland Cavaliers. Length wins in the playoffs when the talent is close, and experience even moreso than that. Plus, Odom had a habit of playing big in the playoffs whereas Gasol, other than the year that the Lakers beat the Magic, has a habit of disappearing.

Their only saving grace is if they are able to somehow get Dwight Howard and Deron Williams, and they won't be able to get both. I would say to bring back Lamar Odom after this year too, but he'll probably be damned before he re-signs with the Lakers after the way they did him. I could see him playing for the Clips next year...but there's no guarantee that Chris Paul even signs an extension with the Clippers, and their front office has a penchant for blowing up the team over and over again.

If I were a die hard Lakers fan I'd be pretty upset with what they've done to the team. They didn't want to part with Bynum, when Orlando would've traded Bynum for Howard straight up. Just stupid.

And this has nothing to do with Mike Brown as a coach - he's a really good coach, especially defensively. Offensively the Lakers have also had no problem scoring points and moving the basketball. The fact of this series is simply that the Lakers talent is just thin. The only people on that roster that are mentally tough right now are Kobe and Artest.

The Lakers didn't trade Bynum for Howard because Howard didn't wanna play in L.A. He's scared of playing in Shaq's shadow. Screw him besides even if he wanted play for us it's not like he's a huge upgrade over Bynum. He's better on defense, but Bynum is far superior offensively.

Also we traded Odom because he threw a hissy fit and demanded a trade. Fish was a flat out liability for us and he needed to go. We would've lost to Denver if Fish was still starting for us.

Kobe's time is running out. The FO needs to realize that. Trade Gasol for a couple of solid starters and a bench scorer. Sign Nash in the offseason and let's go win #17.

 

[casmith07]

The Lakers didn't trade Bynum for Howard because Howard didn't wanna play in L.A. He's scared of playing in Shaq's shadow. Screw him besides even if he wanted play for us it's not like he's a huge upgrade over Bynum. He's better on defense, but Bynum is far superior offensively.

You're so amazingly wrong on this.

And he would be a huge upgrade over Bynum. Bynum's offense would've been more than made up for among Gasol, Bryant, Artest, and Odom. But they jettisoned guys who can score in and around the paint like Odom in favor of guys who can't shoot like Ebanks and Jordan Hill.

Also, defense wins championships. Having Dwight on the floor for the Lakers with Kobe and Artest on the perimeter and Odom and Gasol also doing time in the paint would turn every team in the playoffs into a jump-shooting team. You think that series would've gone that far with the Nuggets, or that LA would be down 3-1 if Denver and OKC were basically forced to score everything from 10+ feet, and couldn't get anything in transition?

You're still young. You've got time to learn about the game of basketball. Do yourself a favor and listen to the people on this forum.

 

[juck]

Stern did the Lakers a favor by nixing that trade, but the Lakers screwed it up by trading away Odom and Fisher.

They should have acquired Goran Dragic as a backup or starter with Fisher playing the backup role, and played through with Odom as their 6th man. Being able to go big with Kobe, Artest, Odom, Gasol, and Bynum on the floor down the stretch would completely outmatch OKC's roster, as well as match up very favorably against the Spurs...but they're pretty content on turning into the Western Conference version of the Cleveland Cavaliers. Length wins in the playoffs when the talent is close, and experience even moreso than that. Plus, Odom had a habit of playing big in the playoffs whereas Gasol, other than the year that the Lakers beat the Magic, has a habit of disappearing.

Their only saving grace is if they are able to somehow get Dwight Howard and Deron Williams, and they won't be able to get both. I would say to bring back Lamar Odom after this year too, but he'll probably be damned before he re-signs with the Lakers after the way they did him. I could see him playing for the Clips next year...but there's no guarantee that Chris Paul even signs an extension with the Clippers, and their front office has a penchant for blowing up the team over and over again.

If I were a die hard Lakers fan I'd be pretty upset with what they've done to the team. They didn't want to part with Bynum, when Orlando would've traded Bynum for Howard straight up. Just stupid.

And this has nothing to do with Mike Brown as a coach - he's a really good coach, especially defensively. Offensively the Lakers have also had no problem scoring points and moving the basketball. The fact of this series is simply that the Lakers talent is just thin. The only people on that roster that are mentally tough right now are Kobe and Artest.

I love Dragic. I hope Mavs get him if DWILL stays in Brooklyn.

 

[Cowboys&LakersFan]

You're so amazingly wrong on this.

And he would be a huge upgrade over Bynum. Bynum's offense would've been more than made up for among Gasol, Bryant, Artest, and Odom. But they jettisoned guys who can score in and around the paint like Odom in favor of guys who can't shoot like Ebanks and Jordan Hill.

Also, defense wins championships. Having Dwight on the floor for the Lakers with Kobe and Artest on the perimeter and Odom and Gasol also doing time in the paint would turn every team in the playoffs into a jump-shooting team. You think that series would've gone that far with the Nuggets, or that LA would be down 3-1 if Denver and OKC were basically forced to score everything from 10+ feet, and couldn't get anything in transition?

You're still young. You've got time to learn about the game of basketball. Do yourself a favor and listen to the people on this forum.

Again I don't see how he's a huge upgrade over Bynum. I don't get why your bringing up Odom did you forgot about his play this season? He was terrible. He's done at I pray to God he doesn't come back. That's the last thing we need is another drama queen in our lockerooom. As I was saying about Drew he's much better than Dwight offensively. Howard as I said is superior defensively, but it's not like Bynum is a bad defender. He's a very good defender. Often times he's put in bad spots by the perimeter players because they can't keep their man in front of them. It's ridiculous. Sessions is as bad defensively as Fish and Kobe as much as I love them only plays defense every once in awhile. If we had Howard we'd still be staring at elimination.

 

[casmith07]

I love Dragic. I hope Mavs get him if DWILL stays in Brooklyn.

Dragic is who the Mavericks should've gotten this year, but they wanted to bring back Jason Kidd, who can't score anymore and can't play defense anymore either.

He's not an elite PG, but he's that next tier down where he's good enough to win if you surround him with the correct pieces. He's a distributor type, like Nash. He'd flourish on a team like Dallas where he doesn't need to put up more than 12-15 ppg.

 

[WoodysGirl]

You're so amazingly wrong on this.

And he would be a huge upgrade over Bynum. Bynum's offense would've been more than made up for among Gasol, Bryant, Artest, and Odom. But they jettisoned guys who can score in and around the paint like Odom in favor of guys who can't shoot like Ebanks and Jordan Hill.

Also, defense wins championships. Having Dwight on the floor for the Lakers with Kobe and Artest on the perimeter and Odom and Gasol also doing time in the paint would turn every team in the playoffs into a jump-shooting team. You think that series would've gone that far with the Nuggets, or that LA would be down 3-1 if Denver and OKC were basically forced to score everything from 10+ feet, and couldn't get anything in transition?

You're still young. You've got time to learn about the game of basketball. Do yourself a favor and listen to the people on this forum.

Personally, I like Bynum over Howard any day. Bynum has some growth to do, but he's a beast....that doesn't get fed.

Nobody on the Lakers know how to feed a big man. Bynum gets in position w/his man behind him and they pass it out. On the flip side, he still has some learning to do on what to do with the ball once he gets it, but if he's on that low block, they can't stop him.

Howard on the other hand can't shoot beyond 3 ft from the basket. He's a guy who should have a lot more moves than he does from being in the league all these years. He doesn't work on his game. And he's not big like Bynum who can cave guys chest in. If he incorporated a little jumper or spin move ala Dream, he'd be a next level center, IMO. Howard's only a superstar center now, because there aren't that many out there.

 

[casmith07]

Personally, I like Bynum over Howard any day. Bynum has some growth to do, but he's a beast....that doesn't get fed.

Nobody on the Lakers know how to feed a big man. Bynum gets in position w/his man behind him and they pass it out. On the flip side, he still has some learning to do on what to do with the ball once he gets it, but if he's on that low block, they can't stop him.

Howard on the other hand can't shoot beyond 3 ft from the basket. He's a guy who should have a lot more moves than he does from being in the league all these years. He doesn't work on his game. And he's not big like Bynum who can cave guys chest in. If he incorporated a little jumper or spin move ala Dream, he'd be a next level center, IMO. Howard's only a superstar center now, because there aren't that many out there.

I don't know. Denver did a pretty good job of stopping Bynum on the low block with guys like Danilo Gallinari and Kenneth Faried. And Dwight Howard does have a baby jumper now - he just generally doesn't have to use it because it's literally over if he gets the ball within 3 feet of the bucket. Guys either foul the crap out of him or he puts it in, or dunks on you.

Also, with the NBA being almost exclusively dependent on guard scoring, I'd rather have someone who can defend the paint than a scoring big man. I think Howard fits better with what the Lakers are built for.

I think we can both agree that Gasol is done, however. 3 points, 3 boards against Kenneth Faried? Get out!

 

[WoodysGirl]

I don't know. Denver did a pretty good job of stopping Bynum on the low block with guys like Danilo Gallinari and Kenneth Faried. And Dwight Howard does have a baby jumper now - he just generally doesn't have to use it because it's literally over if he gets the ball within 3 feet of the bucket. Guys either foul the crap out of him or he puts it in, or dunks on you.

Also, with the NBA being almost exclusively dependent on guard scoring, I'd rather have someone who can defend the paint than a scoring big man. I think Howard fits better with what the Lakers are built for.

I think we can both agree that Gasol is done, however. 3 points, 3 boards against Kenneth Faried? Get out!

As I said, Bynum has some growing to do. Bynum can be stopped when he becomes uninterested. First half yesterday, he was getting the ball and he was beasting. 2nd half it became the Kobe show...and yeah.. 2-10 in the 4th quarter. It was turrible. Kobe gets the ball and everyone clears out. No one even tries to get in position for rebounding. SMH

Gasol is an absolute waste of space on the court. He doesn't even attempt a shot anymore. He could pass to Bynum, but he passes out to Artest. He had a clear path to the goal, and he turned it over. It burns me up that my Rockets want this guy cuz he's a legit 7'.

 

[juck]

Dragic is who the Mavericks should've gotten this year, but they wanted to bring back Jason Kidd, who can't score anymore and can't play defense anymore either.

He's not an elite PG, but he's that next tier down where he's good enough to win if you surround him with the correct pieces. He's a distributor type, like Nash. He'd flourish on a team like Dallas where he doesn't need to put up more than 12-15 ppg.

Dragic is young too. He has a lot of will and no quit in him. I wouldnt mind Dragic and KG. Thats a twist huh? KG is FA. KG plays great defense at the 5 spot.

 

[dargonking999]

You can blame Mike Brown if you want, but just like in 2008 against the Celtics (with Phil Jackson) the reason the Lakers are going to lose this series, is because Gasol is playing like he's a soft little teddy bear, instead of a Man who is hungry for that next title like Kobe.

For all the comparsions everyone wants to make between Kobe and Jordan, the one thing that Jordan has over Kobe, over LeBron (who I like), and even Durant is that Jordan Made sure that every single person on that Roster wanted the Ring as bad as he did every year. You don't win 3 straight Championships twice, because of talent. You do it because your best player, makes sure that every single player is playing with the same hunger and fight as him. Kobe can bark, growl, and scowl, but at the end of the day, when it's all said and done, no one cares like Kobe, and that is why they won't win as much as Kobe wants.

 

[casmith07]

As I said, Bynum has some growing to do. Bynum can be stopped when he becomes uninterested. First half yesterday, he was getting the ball and he was beasting. 2nd half it became the Kobe show...and yeah.. 2-10 in the 4th quarter. It was turrible. Kobe gets the ball and everyone clears out. No one even tries to get in position for rebounding. SMH

Gasol is an absolute waste of space on the court. He doesn't even attempt a shot anymore. He could pass to Bynum, but he passes out to Artest. He had a clear path to the goal, and he turned it over. It burns me up that my Rockets want this guy cuz he's a legit 7'.

Agreed!

Dragic is young too. He has a lot of will and no quit in him. I wouldnt mind Dragic and KG. Thats a twist huh? KG is FA. KG plays great defense at the 5 spot.

KG's getting up there in age, but he brings a toughness in the post that Dirk doesn't bring. The Mavs need another strong interior presence if they're going to win next year because Dirk can't/won't do it. He's basically a really tall Small Forward. Not taking anything away from Dirk but that's just not his game. He's more of finesse player.

You can blame Mike Brown if you want, but just like in 2008 against the Celtics (with Phil Jackson) the reason the Lakers are going to lose this series, is because Gasol is playing like he's a soft little teddy bear, instead of a Man who is hungry for that next title like Kobe.

For all the comparsions everyone wants to make between Kobe and Jordan, the one thing that Jordan has over Kobe, over LeBron (who I like), and even Durant is that Jordan Made sure that every single person on that Roster wanted the Ring as bad as he did every year. You don't win 3 straight Championships twice, because of talent. You do it because your best player, makes sure that every single player is playing with the same hunger and fight as him. Kobe can bark, growl, and scowl, but at the end of the day, when it's all said and done, no one cares like Kobe, and that is why they won't win as much as Kobe wants.

Jordan didn't have to constantly spur his teammates like race horses, though...they all did want it as bad at Mike and if they didn't they got sent to play elsewhere.

Kobe's been riding Gasol like I'll Have Another this post-season and Gasol hasn't done anything but play like a muffin out there. It's pathetic he's 7 feet tall and getting slapped around like Darko Milicic.

 

[dargonking999]

Agreed!



KG's getting up there in age, but he brings a toughness in the post that Dirk doesn't bring. The Mavs need another strong interior presence if they're going to win next year because Dirk can't/won't do it. He's basically a really tall Small Forward. Not taking anything away from Dirk but that's just not his game. He's more of finesse player.



Jordan didn't have to constantly spur his teammates like race horses, though...they all did want it as bad at Mike and if they didn't they got sent to play elsewhere.

Kobe's been riding Gasol like I'll Have Another this post-season and Gasol hasn't done anything but play like a muffin out there. It's pathetic he's 7 feet tall and getting slapped around like Darko Milicic.

They shoulda kept the other Gasol, he at least acts like he wants to shove it up someone

 

[casmith07]

They shoulda kept the other Gasol, he at least acts like he wants to shove it up someone

You're right. He doesn't play like a European player.

I had to go back and look and the Lakers definitely drafted him in '07. Wow.

Imagine a starting 5 of (insert PG), Bryant, Artest, M. Gasol, Howard -- with Odom as your 6th man?

Denver would've been swept.

 

[dargonking999]

You're right. He doesn't play like a European player.

I had to go back and look and the Lakers definitely drafted him in '07. Wow.

Imagine a starting 5 of (insert PG), Bryant, Artest, M. Gasol, Howard -- with Odom as your 6th man?

Denver would've been swept.

Lakers would have won the last two titles, even with Bynum

 

[Cowboys&LakersFan]

They shoulda kept the other Gasol, he at least acts like he wants to shove it up someone

Lol wut? We wouldn't have won those two championships without Pau. He's played poor the previous two postseasons, but the three years before he was spectacular.

 

[MC KAos]

regarding bynum vs howard. are you guys serious? offensively, bynum might be slightly better, but howard works harder and averages more ppg for a reason, he is also in a hell of a lot better shape, so he doesnt wear down by the fourth quarter like bynum seems to. and to the "bynum is young, still developing" crowd, he is 24! he has been in the league 6 years! he is only 2 years younger than howard, who is the WAY better defender, and the much better player. bynum gets blocks, but he doesnt consistently alter shots, doesnt consistently rotate correctly and is out of position quite a bit for a guy thats supposed the be the second best center in the league

 

[MC KAos]

and for pau, the people arguing on keeping him over marc, thats just dumb, he developed last year, pau helped them get two titles at the end of kobe's prime. you would have marc coming into his own as kobe starts to decline, they would have wasted 2 titles

attitude aside, pau is still the better player, it wont be till at least 2014 when marc surpasses him or pau declines past his brother.

 

[MC KAos]

Lol wut? We wouldn't have won those two championships without Pau. He's played poor the previous two postseasons, but the three years before he was spectacular.

and its not that he has played poorly, it just seems like he isnt all there, i bet you see a completely different pau in the olympics