Anyone but skin homers really think

[Vintage]

If Owens is 95 on a 100 scale what is Moss? Lets see what the skins homers have to say.

What is with these arbitrary numbers you like?

I give.

Moss is a 98.

Owens is a 97.

Moss is a 1
Owens is a 1.1

There, I proved Moss is better than Owens for the Commander fans.

 

[Doomsday101]

I've BEEN asking you to do that for how many pages now? Now you want me to prove you wrong on a argument you can't even defend yourself.

How about this? Actually come up with analysis why Owens is "much better" than Moss and I'll counter it.

Best reason I can give is Owens ability in the redzone, he is one of the toughest to defend and his size and strenght are much greater than Moss. Both Moss and Owens have speed to get deep but where Owens I feel is better is as you get down towards the goal line.

 

[cowboywho?]

Stats: I only put in 5 seasons

Satana Moss:

Year 1 : 40 yards. Averaged 20 yard per catch
Year 2 : 433 yards. Averaged 14.4 yards per catch
Year 3 : 1105 yards. Averaged 14.9 yards per catch
Year 4 : 838 yards. Averaged 18.6 yards per catch
Year 5 : 1483 yards. Averaged 17.7 yards per catch (best year)

Terrell Owens:

Year 1 : 520 yards. Averaged 14.9 yards per catch
Year 2 : 936 yards. Averaged 15.6 yards per catch
Year 3 : 1097 yards. Averaged 16.4 yards per catch
Year 4 : 754 yards. Averaged 12.6 yards per catch
Year 5 : 1451 yards. Averaged 15 yards per catch (best year)

 

[cowboywho?]

As you can see if you take out moss first two seasons (because he didnt play much during his first two seasons)

They pretty much have the same stats. However owens have more yards but moss has way better ypc percentage.

Not to mention Ownes had one of the great qb to throw to him.

Only time can tell if moss really is better then owens.... when they both retire. but for now he is doing pretty well. So dont even say that owens is league ahead of moss.

 

[Doomsday101]

Stats: I only put in 5 seasons

Satana Moss:

Year 1 : 40 yards. Averaged 20 yard per catch
Year 2 : 433 yards. Averaged 14.4 yards per catch
Year 3 : 1105 yards. Averaged 14.9 yards per catch
Year 4 : 838 yards. Averaged 18.6 yards per catch
Year 5 : 1483 yards. Averaged 17.7 yards per catch (best year)

Terrell Owens:

Year 1 : 520 yards. Averaged 14.9 yards per catch
Year 2 : 936 yards. Averaged 15.6 yards per catch
Year 3 : 1097 yards. Averaged 16.4 yards per catch
Year 4 : 754 yards. Averaged 12.6 yards per catch
Year 5 : 1451 yards. Averaged 15 yards per catch (best year)

Throw the TD's into the mix and there is the differance.

 

[Doomsday101]

As you can see if you take out moss first two seasons (because he didnt play much during his first two seasons)

They pretty much have the same stats. However owens have more yards but moss has way better ypc percentage.

Not to mention Ownes had one of the great qb to throw to him.

Only time can tell if moss really is better then owens.... when they both retire. but for now he is doing pretty well. So dont even say that owens is league ahead of moss.

Owens put up good numbers when Garcia was QB'ing the 9ers, not sure I would call him one of the greats.

 

[cowboywho?]

Owens put up good numbers when Garcia was QB'ing the 9ers, not sure I would call him one of the greats.

Not garcia but Young as his QB. BTW Garcia did made the pro bowl, we wasnt a great qb but he did gave Owens his fair share of yards.

My point is, comparing owens stats to moss isnt that big of a difference. you guys just overblown owen worth.

 

[cowboywho?]

Throw the TD's into the mix and there is the differance.

So who would you take a WR with 1500 yards of receiveing but 5 TD to a Wr with 1100 yards with 10 TD?

if you havent notice but even though last year moss didnt get many TD but our offense still work. he just march us down the feild. then people like clinton portis, chris cooley and mike sellers took over.

I believe that cooley and sellers had 14 TD between them.

Maybe because you guys dont really have those type of endzone guys you might use owens better.
But the Commanders do. So a Satana Moss type of guy fit us perfectly

 

[jazzcat22]

Moss has had one great year; Owens has had many. That alone should give Owens the edge. Glenn has the edge over Lloyd as well. Whether RL is better then Clayton remains to be seen- both should be pretty much equal now. Witten is better and has done more longer. So clear edge there.
Anyway you try and look at it the Boys have a better set.

Plus Bledsoe's arm is better, stronger than Brunell.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

True but just as the case with Moss both are hitting their prime. Both will be entering their 6th season. And just like Moss, Smith has put up 2 1,000 yard season. Frankly they compare pretty good with each other.

No, we just aren't reading what they are saying. Terrell Owens is really no different than a 43 year old Jerry Rice...or no he isn't. :abuseme:

Terrell Owens is much more likely to have a greater season than Moss, but he's not that much better than Moss. :abuseme:

I don't care if somebody believes Moss isn't much worse than Owens, just the silly comparisons of Owens to a retired Jerry Rice and contradicting one's self is plain batty.

But these are the same people that want me to believe that inserting Lavar Arrington into their starting lineup last year didn't have that much of an affect on their defense.


Rich..............

 

[Doomsday101]

Not garcia but Young as his QB. BTW Garcia did made the pro bowl, we wasnt a great qb but he did gave Owens his fair share of yards.

My point is, comparing owens stats to moss isnt that big of a difference. you guys just overblown owen worth.

His 1st 3 season were with Young however he put up even bigger numbers with Garcia and yes Garcia made the Pro Bowl but that helps when you have a WR who can catch a 5 yard pass and take it to the house. If you look at my post I think Moss is a very good WR who is in his prime and someone who should not be overlooked or underestimated. However I do feel around the redzone Owens is much better because he has the size and strenght to work that area of the feild more so than Moss

 

[cowboywho?]

His 1st 3 season were with Young however he put up even bigger numbers with Garcia and yes Garcia made the Pro Bowl but that helps when you have a WR who can catch a 5 yard pass and take it to the house. If you look at my post I think Moss is a very good WR who is in his prime and someone who should not be overlooked or underestimated. However I do feel around the redzone Owens is much better because he has the size and strenght to work that area of the feild more so than Moss

Well, um..... your just restating what i said

I said Owens is better in the Endzone, but Moss is better with getter more yards per catch. I'm just saying that Moss and Owens are different kinds of WR and that we dont need a Owen type players since we have alot of other players that can get the ball into the endzone. While you dont.

 

[Doomsday101]

So who would you take a WR with 1500 yards of receiveing but 5 TD to a Wr with 1100 yards with 10 TD?

if you havent notice but even though last year moss didnt get many TD but our offense still work. he just march us down the feild. then people like clinton portis, chris cooley and mike sellers took over.

I believe that cooley and sellers had 14 TD between them.

Maybe because you guys dont really have those type of endzone guys you might use owens better.
But the Commanders do. So a Satana Moss type of guy fit us perfectly

Name of the game is putting up TD, yards are great but points win games. I respect Moss but when comparing the strenght Owens has the speed just as Moss does but again the differance is Owen working a shorter field is better than Moss. Most big physical guys are better than the small WR in those areas.

 

[cowboywho?]

Name of the game is putting up TD, yards are great but points win games. I respect Moss but when comparing the strenght Owens has the speed just as Moss does but again the differance is Owen working a shorter field is better than Moss. Most big physical guys are better than the small WR in those areas.

And I agree. Not arguing with you here.
I was responding to the guy who said Owen is WAY better then Moss and asked for stats.

I know that Owen is one hell of a WR but he been in the league longer and you cant really tell if Moss really is better. Both need to retire before you can really tell.

 

[skinsngibbs4life]

Point is who is better. Owens.

I think almost every skins fan posting on here won't deny that Owens is better. Because the fact is, he is a better reciever. But you trying to say that he is head and shoulders above Moss is ridiculous. Why can't you just concede the fact that they are both great recievers in thier own respect? It's not hard to give respect to a player when he deserves it.

Anyway, I think what really needs to be looked at is the type of offenses that these two teams will be playing this year. Because they are both going to be playing two very different system, but both have the personnel to make them work out very well.

The skins will be playing mainly 3 and 4 WR sets. With the ammount of depth that we have at WR, that system should suite us very well.

The 'boys should be playing a 2 Wr 2 TE set(correct me if im wrong???). Since you all have better #1 and #2 than us, and two good TE's, this should work well for you all as well.

You see, it is almost pointless to argue the #1 and #2 slots for both teams, because in fact, both teams are playing very different systems. The Commanders depth should play great into thier offense, and the cowboys personnel should play great into thiers. Maybe we should just leave it at that?

 

[Yakuza Rich]

Not garcia but Young as his QB. BTW Garcia did made the pro bowl, we wasnt a great qb but he did gave Owens his fair share of yards.

My point is, comparing owens stats to moss isnt that big of a difference. you guys just overblown owen worth.

Here's a look at Garcia's and McNabb's numbers without and with Owens:

- Percentage completed went from 58.2% (no TO) to 61.8% with TO (a 5.7% actual increase)

- Yards per attempt went from 6.4 ypa to 7.2 ypa (a 10.9% increase)

- Average passing attempts per TD went from 26.6 passing attempts per TD to 18.5 passing attempts per TD (a 30.4% increase in frequency)

- Average passing attempts per INT went from 39.6 passing attempts per INT to 45.7 passing attempts per INT (a 13.4% decrease in INT frequency)

- Sacks allowed ratio went down 26% with Owens.


I don't know what Moss' numbers would look like. But with stats like this, and perhaps it's just a coincidence, but I can see why so many coaches and scouts think so highly of his effectiveness on the field.


Rich..........

 

[Doomsday101]

Well, um..... your just restating what i said

I said Owens is better in the Endzone, but Moss is better with getter more yards per catch. I'm just saying that Moss and Owens are different kinds of WR and that we dont need a Owen type players since we have alot of other players that can get the ball into the endzone. While you dont.

And Dallas has other players as well. Glenn has had success against the skins and we have one of the top TE in the league. I agree both guys are different WR but Owens has very good speed just as Moss does but Moss does not have the size or strength of Owens. I give the edge to the guy who brings it all over the guy who relies solely on his speed. I do have a lot of respect for Moss and I don’t feel like I’m being a homer saying Owen is a bit better. I say this as a Cowboy fan who was opposed to getting Owens, I’m not having a love fest with Owen on this team but I will give credit where credit is due

 

[cowboywho?]

I think almost every skins fan posting on here won't deny that Owens is better. Because the fact is, he is a better reciever. But you trying to say that he is head and shoulders above Moss is ridiculous. Why can't you just concede the fact that they are both great recievers in thier own respect? It's not hard to give respect to a player when he deserves it.

Anyway, I think what really needs to be looked at is the type of offenses that these two teams will be playing this year. Because they are both going to be playing two very different system, but both have the personnel to make them work out very well.

The skins will be playing mainly 3 and 4 WR sets. With the ammount of depth that we have at WR, that system should suite us very well.

The 'boys should be playing a 2 Wr 2 TE set(correct me if im wrong???). Since you all have better #1 and #2 than us, and two good TE's, this should work well for you all as well.

You see, it is almost pointless to argue the #1 and #2 slots for both teams, because in fact, both teams are playing very different systems. The Commanders depth should play great into thier offense, and the cowboys personnel should play great into thiers. Maybe we should just leave it at that?

Thank you, at least my fellow 'skin fan get it

 

[cowboywho?]

Here's a look at Garcia's and McNabb's numbers without and with Owens:

- Percentage completed went from 58.2% (no TO) to 61.8% with TO (a 5.7% actual increase)

- Yards per attempt went from 6.4 ypa to 7.2 ypa (a 10.9% increase)

- Average passing attempts per TD went from 26.6 passing attempts per TD to 18.5 passing attempts per TD (a 30.4% increase in frequency)

- Average passing attempts per INT went from 39.6 passing attempts per INT to 45.7 passing attempts per INT (a 13.4% decrease in INT frequency)

- Sacks allowed ratio went down 26% with Owens.


I don't know what Moss' numbers would look like. But with stats like this, and perhaps it's just a coincidence, but I can see why so many coaches and scouts think so highly of his effectiveness on the field.


Rich..........

Wow you did your research didnt you?
I dont have that time but i will put this out there.
2005 Commanders offense > 2004 Commanders Offense
With the addition of Satana Moss.

 

[burmafrd]

Glad to see that at last the skins are seeing the light. Boys WR/TE are better then theirs as a unit (1,2,3 WR and TE)