Are we going to be able to build a super bowl contender w/ Jayon and LVE?

buybuydandavis

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Sure, if the FO puts some quality DTs in front of them at both 3T AND 1T.

I hope 3T is the highest pick, if someone is there, though I'm trading back from 10.

Maybe big run stuffing 1T in the 3rd or 4th, but with Gallimore and Woods to take 1T, I don't see a big rush there.
 

buybuydandavis

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With the players we have on defense we're better suited running the 3-4. Because LVE and J.Smith need three DT's in front of them to stop the run.

So I say we trade DLaw, then make Anae and Gregory our 3-4 outside linebackers (putting LVE and JSmith inside). Gallimore and Hill could be our starting DE's in the 3-4, with another big body like Marvin Wilson at NT.

Because if are moving forward with these two guys at LB in the 4-3, we'll never have a top ten defense against the run. And if you can't stop the run, you can't stop anything else.

Story was the new DC is going back to more straight 4-3.
 

buybuydandavis

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Maybe that year was the exception, just one year wonders

Jaylon's leg regressed. Should have never stopped wearing the orthotic.

LVE had weird health issues in 2019, then clearly was just confused in 2020. Maybe his lack of experience was showing up, especially with the switch to a new and more complicated defense on a limited training camp.

I still have some hope for him, but it's just hope, not expectation.
 

armadillooutlaw

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I would say no. I do think the interior (DT) needs major fixing and would make the rest of the defense better, but a prime Vince Wilfork anchoring the D-line wouldn't fix Jaylon's problem with constantly filling the wrong gap, lack of lateral agility, low football IQ or the fact that LVE is always hurt and has major inconsistencies even when he's healthy.
 

ICP

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It's not the players it's the owner/GM you should be questioning, and since he had input choosing LVE & Jaylon well...........
 

Cmac

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We have more problems than just those 2......starting with the guys that have headphones on.
 

DuncanIso

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You're right on about Jaylon though.
He just doesn't do anything exceptionally and does not justify his contract.
As a Mike, lack of instincts/IQ take him out on plays.
As a Sam, just seems to get blocked too easily and blown out of a play when he needs to disrupt the play.
As a Will, deosn't cover well enough.
He'd be a great 4th LB, sort of like what we want out of Joe Thomas, (guy who could be a 3 position reserve). Trouble is Jaylon's not playing for a minumum deal like Joe, he earns like a top level starter, but does not perform as one.
It's a recipe I've unfortunately seen repeated too often under the Jones' as GM's, overpaying for guys they like personally.
I thought the same thing last year when we rushed out and signed Anthony Brown.
I like him some. I just question what he is. He's NOT a starting outside corner. Is he a starting slot corner (3rd corner, which is essentially like a starter in today's game?). I guess the Jones' think he is, but I have serious questions.
I don't dislike the guy, but when I look at film I see him getting ravaged by slot receivers, so I question if he is that 3rd corner.
I think he'd make a great 4th corner. A guy who can come in and play out or in depending on situation/injury etc.
But a 4th corner can't justify a 5.75 mil cap number like he has.
As an example, last season, Dre Kirkpatrick was released late by the Bengals and signed on with the Cardinals for like $880K. He ended up starting outside for them, essentially their #2 corner, and played well.
Now look at Brown, and what he made, as a 3rd or 4th corner, and Kirkpatrick and what he made, as a #2.
What team got the better deal for the $?
Lack of an objective football professional strikes again, as it did with Jaylon.
Therin lies the problem with the Cowboys, right? Poor, non objective football decisions.


154 tackles.

2nd in the NFL.
 

CowboyRoy

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W/ Jaylon starting? Unlikely.

Its going to take this draft and probably another before we can expect big changes. Once we can get rid of Zeke and Jaylon after next season that will open up cap space.
 

kskboys

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Dump Jaylon. Gotta do that before his contract gets guaranteed in March. Without the guarantee, we'd keep him til camp and see, but I wouldn't guarantee that money for what we've seen for the last 2 years. No way.

For LVE, he's on his 1st round rookie contract, so 2021 is already guaranteed. He'll be back for his last year. Only 2mil anyway. I wouldn't dump him for that even if we could. I still have some hope for him. So much promise in 2018. Maybe he revives himself and we extend. Maybe he gets us some kind of comp pick.

We need to pick up a starting LB in the draft to go with LVE. 2nd or 3rd round. And play them. I'm trading back to get us more high picks, pending what we do in free agency.
LVE is Sean Lee. Very good player who can't stay healthy. We should've learned the first time.
 

kskboys

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I hope 3T is the highest pick, if someone is there, though I'm trading back from 10.

Maybe big run stuffing 1T in the 3rd or 4th, but with Gallimore and Woods to take 1T, I don't see a big rush there.
You think they're going to put weight on Galley and make him the 1 tech?
 

Haimerej

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LVE is Sean Lee. Very good player who can't stay healthy. We should've learned the first time.

Didn't he grade lower than Jaylon this year?

I'd rather see them back in a defense they're suited to play before proclaiming either to be a bust.
 

kskboys

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Didn't he grade lower than Jaylon this year?

I'd rather see them back in a defense they're suited to play before proclaiming either to be a bust.
Possible, don't know.

W/ Jaylon, it's not the D, it's the fact that his leg has robbed him of superior athleticism, and he has major issues w/ burst, lateral agility, and burst out of the breaks(Plant and go). I don't see those things going away. If he's going to heal completely, he should be further along at this point. Nothing personal, he seems like a very nice young man. However, his contract is one of our major issues at this point.
 

kskboys

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Jaylon's leg regressed. Should have never stopped wearing the orthotic.

LVE had weird health issues in 2019, then clearly was just confused in 2020. Maybe his lack of experience was showing up, especially with the switch to a new and more complicated defense on a limited training camp.

I still have some hope for him, but it's just hope, not expectation.
At this point, Jaylon is a straightline athlete. Those guys are a dime a dozen and are backup types.
 

Haimerej

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Possible, don't know.

W/ Jaylon, it's not the D, it's the fact that his leg has robbed him of superior athleticism, and he has major issues w/ burst, lateral agility, and burst out of the breaks(Plant and go). I don't see those things going away. If he's going to heal completely, he should be further along at this point. Nothing personal, he seems like a very nice young man. However, his contract is one of our major issues at this point.

I think his injury history is a convenient excuse. His struggles this year weren't physical and I also don't think they were all on him. It's hard to play MLB behind two gapping guys who suck at their job. Even Ray Lewis struggled in the years between Adams/Siragusa and Ngata.

When his linemen weren't getting blown up in front of him he struggled making the correct read. LVE struggled with his reads in the new scheme, too. That's why I think we'll see improvement this year. They're going back to a simpler scheme designed for them to play fast, just like they had in 2018 when they were being projected as one of the better LB corps in the league.
 
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