Bob Sturm takes on Cowboys drafted record 09-present

[visionary]

Strum is obviously completely wrong for the following reasons;

1. He completely ignored important stuff like RKG and is looking at ludicrous metrics like starter seasons and productivity on the field. What's next? Wins and losses? Talk about unimportant stuff

2. How can he say Cuskowski and McClay are not important. Will McClay is the architect of this team along with Jason Garrett. The Joneses are just place holders and tie breakers. The real puppet masters are Jason and Will. CZ insiders have repeatedly assured us of this over many many years.

3. He is trying to convince us with facts. FACTS I tell you! Have you heard of anything more ludicrous ? When I have expert posters on this very forum that can clearly refute them with their personal completely uninformed opinion, why would I believe facts?

I could go on but I'm sure you get the gist ....

 

[the_h0wey]

Much truth, but on the flip side.....

Dallas has built the best offensive line in football, with a solid receiving corps, and now a potential superstar running back. Don't forget perhaps the best kicker in football.

Defensively, if Cheech and Chong put down the bong, and Jaylon Smith heals, there is much to be optimistic about moving forward.

I wouldn't call our receiving corps solid by any means.

 

[KingintheNorth]

Over the past 5 drafts the Cowboys have used picks 34, 34, 40, 47, and 60 in the 2nd round.

For a variety of reasons, they won't get a single snap from any of those picks for the first 4 weeks of the 2016 season.

That's going to leave a mark.

 

[HanfordDixon]

Be wary of writers who bury their point in a ton of numbers. What I know is Bryant, Smith, Martin, Fredrick and Jones are outstanding first round picks. Only one top 10 pick there, too. What I know is Dallas can't really bid on big free agents because it has so many of its own home-grown players to sign to second contracts. Fredrick needs a contract, then Martin, then Lawrence, then Collins and Jones.

 

[Common Sense]

Be wary of writers who bury their point in a ton of numbers. What I know is Bryant, Smith, Martin, Fredrick and Jones are outstanding first round picks. Only one top 10 pick there, too. What I know is Dallas can't really bid on big free agents because it has so many of its own home-grown players to sign to second contracts. Fredrick needs a contract, then Martin, then Lawrence, then Collins and Jones.

Yes, let's be wary of facts and quantitatively verifiable data in favor of feel-good emotional BS.

 

[erod]

I wouldn't call our receiving corps solid by any means.

When healthy, they're more than solid. They're elite.

But when Dez (or Romo) is out, they are a collection of parts.

 

[gimmesix]

I think his analysis of 1st rounders is a bit incomplete. We've actually had great success with first rounders from 2009-2015 (assuming Byron works out). We had one major bust (Claiborne), and we didn't have a first round pick in '09 which skews the data. Probably best to look at first round picks from 2010-2015 due to that since Dez, Tyron, Fred and Martin has performed well as they have earned 9 Pro Bowls between them.

To me, the bigger issue is the 2nd round picks. We've offset our issues in rounds 3-7 with great UDFA pickups, but the 2nd round picks need to be high quality starters and Pro Bowlers and we've struggled miserably from there.








YR

I think we've got incomplete data for the past couple of years in the second round, too, because we don't know how Lawrence and Gregory will turn out. Not sure we know how Escobar will turn out, but we haven't got a lot of return on that investment.

So out of seven players drafted in the second round since 2009, we've had one emerge as a second-contract player (Lee), three incompletes (Lawrence, Gregory and Smith), one probably not (Escobar) and two nots (Bennett and Carter). That's a low success rate if the incompletes become nots, but more than 50 percent if they become second-contract players.

From 1989-1993 (the Jimmy years), two (Daryl Johnston, Darren Woodson) out of seven second-rounders we drafted went on to receive second contracts. Now, we did end up with several contributors (in the same way Carter, Bennett and Escobar have been contributors) in Dixon Edwards, Godfrey Myles, Alexander Wright, Robert Jones, Kevin Williams and Darin Smith. (Two other players went on to star for other teams — Steve Wisnewski and Jimmy Smith).

So 1-4 out of 7 from 2009-16 compared to 2 out of 8 (or 10) from 1989-93, but it really depends on how you rate the role players. I use second contract as a standard because other methods of rating them are subjective.

 

[jjktkk]

I don't mean to be Captain Obvious here, but the drop-off in developing late round talent also coincides with Parcells leaving. Something else to consider.

This is true, but Parcells bombed on some draft picks on his own: Like Al Johnson, Bobby Carpenter, Jacob Rogers, and Stephen Peterman, to name a few.

 

[cowboyblue22]

the cowboys have wasted a lot of second round picks since 2009 and several other picks as well the drafting hasn't been as good as some would think or needs to be to compete with the better teams.

 

[Zordon]

Maybe now that Sturm has said it, it will start to sink in with the groupthink crowd.

I don't know how many times I've said it the last few years but the biggest myth going on this site is that drafting has improved under Garrett. Thank you @Sturm1310 for making this even clearer.

 

[John813]

This is true, but Parcells bombed on some draft picks on his own: Like Al Johnson, Bobby Carpenter, Jacob Rogers, and Stephen Peterman, to name a few.

We gave up on Peterman too fast. Had a decent career after being cut by us.
Who also suffered some injuries to his knee/leg his rookie year

Johnson was hampered by his knee injury, in TC, which needed microfracture surgery.
Who knows how he could of turned out if he didn't mess up his knee.


Rogers and Carpenter were terrible selections.

 

[Risen Star]

He hears your complaint, takes full responsibility for it, used to be poor and will try the same exact thing again next year.

Go Cowboys.

 

[tyke1doe]

The 2009 draft was absolutely, unequivocally HORRENDOUS!

Jerry thought he was Bill Walsh and Jimmy Johnson moving up and down the draft board to collect multiple picks. We selected 12 guys, and I don't think any of them are still in the league.

But I can remember posters hailing the draft savvy of Jones and saying virtually the same things they've said about this draft - seeing hope despite evidence to the contrary.

By the way, did anyone connected with that draft get fired?

 

[CWR]

This is true, but Parcells bombed on some draft picks on his own: Like Al Johnson, Bobby Carpenter, Jacob Rogers, and Stephen Peterman, to name a few.

Lets make sure to get him credit for Julis Jones too, while S Jax was sitting there waiting for us.

 

[visionary]

He hears your complaint, takes full responsibility for it, used to be poor and will try the same exact thing again next year.

Go Cowboys.

I'll take Jerry Jones for 500 please

 

[kiheikiwi]

This is another example of why Sturm is the best writer of Cowboys information out there.
Another factor that leads to the low production numbers is the insistence to trade away 2nd and 3rd round picks. Not sure what we gave for trading up for Dez (3rd ?). But Claiborne 2nd and 3rd. Lawrence 3rd and our 2nd. And they just tried to give away our 2nd and 4th this year (wouldn't go 2nd and 3rd). Im sure there are more but I'm at work : )
Just another reason I'm always weary of trading up, for anybody. It reduces the chances you have every year.
I do feel like we are doing better lately, but stop giving away picks ! Or trying to.

 

[CyberB0b]

When healthy, they're more than solid. They're elite.

But when Dez (or Romo) is out, they are a collection of parts.

No. One player on that squad is elite. When he went down, you saw the results.

 

[BigStar]

That's not really an impressive list when you consider that it goes back an entire decade, and one of them is a kicker. I'm not even sure I would consider Carter, Wilcox, or Gregory quality finds.

The list are JAGS with some stars (Murray, Lee-ish, Collins, Scandrick as great players and average/good starters in Lawrence, Crawford, and Free; people forget the ugly seasons too). You could add Wilbur, Beasley, (1 trick pony) to the list of meh as well. Post 1st round is pitiful tbh. Just glad we're not the ones looked at as being "negative/realist, etc." now that Broadus backs this obvious observation. Like you said, this covers a decade of post 1st round players.

 

[CyberB0b]

I think we've got incomplete data for the past couple of years in the second round, too, because we don't know how Lawrence and Gregory will turn out. Not sure we know how Escobar will turn out, but we haven't got a lot of return on that investment.

We've been hearing this for years. It's a pretty convenient way to actually dodge any criticism of the draft, if you think about it. The average NFL career is slightly over 3 years. By the time you are done "evaluating" the draft, the player will more than likely be out of the league or on another team. This isn't the Tom Landry era. Kids start learning concepts in the pony league that they take with them to the pros. High schools have pro caliber facilities now. The physical curve isn't nearly what it used to be and with technology being implemented the way it is, the mental curve is much, much lower.

 

[jjktkk]

We gave up on Peterman too fast. Had a decent career after being cut by us.
Who also suffered some injuries to his knee/leg his rookie year

Johnson was hampered by his knee injury, in TC, which needed microfracture surgery.
Who knows how he could of turned out if he didn't mess up his knee.


Rogers and Carpenter were terrible selections.

Let me also say, that I loved Parcells and what he did to turn this team around back then. Just trying to point out that even Parcells had some whiffs in the draft as well.