Can we all agree QB play Makes WRS

[birdwells1]

Genius? If they're on the same team, obviously they have the same QB.

2016 Beasley.
2015 Beasley, Witten and Williams.
2011 Witten.
2010 Witten and Austin.

In 2010 his rookie season he fractured his ankle on a punt return, he had 45 for 561 and 6tds
In 2011 he was outperformed by Witten a HOFer
In 2015 he was injured
In 2016 he missed 3 games and was outperformed by Beasley, I wonder why Beasley didn't do that this year? The league caught up to Dak, you'll never see that from Beasley again.

The NFL defenses have made their move and it was successful now it's time for Dak and the coaching staff to make theirs no matter if Dez is here or not. The league is taking away his easy reads.

 

[Irvin88_4life]

I was just looking at wide outs stats for the 2017 season, when I say wide outs I'm not including slot wrs.

1. Jarvis Landry 112 987 SLOT
2. Fitz 109 1156 SLOT
3. Michael Thomas 104 1245 wide out Drew Brees
4. Keenan Allen 102 1393 wide out Phillip Rivers
5. Antonio Brown 101 1533 wide out Big Ben
6. DeAndre Hop 96 1378 wide out Bad QBing after Watson, outstanding stats
7. Golden Tate 92 1003 SLOT
8. Theilen 91 1276 wide out Case Keenum great year
9. Julio 88 1444 wide out Matt Ryan

11. D. Thomas 83 949 wide out Bad QBing lots of catches no yardage
16. D. Baldwin 75 991 SLOT
16. AJ Green 75 1078 wide out Better than Dez mediocre to poor QBing
16. Tyreek Hill 75 1183 SLOT

23. Mike Evans 71 1001 wide out Bad QBing, better than Dez, better than stats
24. Dez Bryant 69 838 wide out Bad QBing, from inexperienced qb.


FACTS:

1. Dez had a bad year with the drops
2. Dak is not comfortabe throwing to his outside receivers yet.
3. Dez still demands double coverage or safety help, contrary to what some say on this site.
4. Dez had 1 fumble last year. (contrary to the "always fumbling crowd").
5. Dak had trouble reading defenses last year. i.e. wr settling in a zone while he's throwing it like wr is in man .

OPINION:

4. The top wide outs on this list all have good to great qb play, with exception of Hopkins (bad), AJ, and Evans (mediocre) whom everyone agrees are better than Dez but their QB play is also better or at least equal to Dak.
5. If the QB play is going to be like it was this year then we can't pay Dez 16mil because he's not going to be worth it. Does that say more about Dez or Dak though?
6. The coaching staff is the biggest culprit in all this because they didn't have a plan B for Dak, they just came back and tried to do what they did last year and when defenses took away what he likes to do, JG and staff had no answers.
7. T.O. said it, Bryce Butler said it, Dez said it, this offense does not put it's player in a position to succeed. Look at the Patriots and Eagles last weekend. Pick pays pick plays pick plays, crossing routes their schemes won those games our scheme looses games.

NEXT SEASON:

We need new a scheme or new plays, pick routes, rub routes, crossing routes and attempt to attack deep.

Dez needs to be focused (if he's still here).

Dak doesn't need to go back to his rookie year form, he needs to be better. That rookie year is gone, he's not going to sneak up on anyone, he's going to have to put on his big boy pants and throw into NFL windows.

Dez has more TDs then some on your list. Most notably Mike Evans who you said is better then Dez.

 

[kskboys]

Better than any of our WR's.

OMG, no joke. I simply cannot see how anyone else would think otherwise.

Brown is a fiend at WR.

 

[birdwells1]

How about the defending SB champs?

Their top 3 cap hits in 2018 are Tom Brady and two defensive starters.

The Cowboys top 3 cap hits are a WR and two offensive linemen.

I realize some posters don't think defense matters, but it seems the Patriots may be on to something.

They are on to having the Greatest Quarterback of All Times.

 

[skinsscalper]

Genius? If they're on the same team, obviously they have the same QB.

2016 Beasley.
2015 Beasley, Witten and Williams.
2011 Witten.
2010 Witten and Austin.

In 2016 Dez caught 8 TDs to Beasley's 5

In 2015 your argument is laughable considering Beasley, Witten and Williams played all 16 games and Dez played 9 due to injury. Despite that fact the only player that caught more TDs that year than Dez was Beasley (by 2) with 7 more games worth of opportunity. Claiming that that is out producing Dez Bryant is willful ignorance, at best.

2011 Witten caught 5 TDs Bryant caught 9 (again with one one less game played).

2010 was Dez' rookie year and he still caught more TDs than Beasley's best year and Witten's 9 TDs that season (Dez had 6) was his career high. He was also 1 TD behind Austin who had 47 more balls thrown to him that season. All this, mind you, while fighting off a turd in Roy Williams whom the staff was desperately trying to salvage.

I see that you cherry picked yards as the baseline of your argument. I chose the stat that puts points on the board and actually wins games (TDs). Wasn't that fun?

 

[kskboys]

Dez has more TDs then some on your list. Most notably Mike Evans who you said is better then Dez.

Of course he is. That's not even close.

You don't ever go by just one stat when comparing players. And TD #'s is prolly the worst stat to use. Too much involved to get to that TD. Irvin had low TD #'s. Does that mean he sucked?


9
8
12
5
16
12
5
12
4

Those are Megatron's TD #'s. If you'll notice, their all over the charts. Why? Because TD #'s usually are, indicating they're simply not a good evaluation stat.

 

[Bleu Star]

To be precise: Great QBs make good WRs; great schemes make good QBs; and, WRs make WRs.

I can rock with that.

 

[Bleu Star]

If we are in the present Dak isn't good but some are clinging to his rookie year.

Some have zero patience and have forgotten about Romo's first two years.....

 

[birdwells1]

I got this one!!!!!!

2015: DeAndre Hopkins: 111/1521/11 TD's.
QB's: Hoyer, Yates

Hold it......yeah, Hopkins should be a HOFer, barring injuries. Dangitttttttt.

Go back and read my original post, I stated that Hopkins was better even with subpar QBing.

 

[Philmonroe]

Some have zero patience and have forgotten about Romo's first two years.....

You said present right not 10 years ago? That was you or was that a different poster?

 

[kskboys]

Go back and read my original post, I stated that Hopkins was better even with subpar QBing.

Yes, read the last line. I realized you said that!!!!!!!

In fact, in support of your idea, I looked down the list for a few years, and all the WR's who caught 90 or more were great, barring a few exceptions, mostly slot WR's.

So, although my post was basically talking aloud, I agree w/ you!!!!!! Aside from HOF type and slot WR's, you don't see great numbers w/ crapp QB's.

I'm on board!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[birdwells1]

Antonio Brown's stats without Big Ben. Five games 4.8 catches for 68.2 yards that is projected to 77 catches for 1091 yards and zero tds for a 16 game season.

QBs make a wide receiver.

 

[Bleu Star]

You said present right not 10 years ago? That was you or was that a different poster?

I was referring to predicting the future which is always a crap shoot. Go back and read my post....

We can surely reach into the past and compare that which we know. No???

Compare Dak's first two years to Romo's first two years.

Leggo!

 

[birdwells1]

Some have zero patience and have forgotten about Romo's first two years.....

Romo's first year he started and played in 10 games, he threw for 2903 with 19 tds and 9 ints. averaged 290 passing yards a game.
Romo's second year he threw for 4211 with 36 tds and 19 ints.

You could see that Romo was going to be an elite passer, which he was. If Dak had numbers like these and Dez had numbers like he had this year I'd be the first to run him out of town but how can a wr have 100 yards receiving when the QB is throwing for a buck fifty? he threw for under 200 yards 8 times, he threw for over 300 yards once and that was against the Giants where Dez caught a slant for over 50 yards, beasley over 40 yards, and Smith went for 80 plus yards. That a lot of yac.

 

[Ken]

Antonio Brown's stats without Big Ben. Five games 4.8 catches for 68.2 yards that is projected to 77 catches for 1091 yards and zero tds for a 16 game season.

QBs make a wide receiver.

Didnt the Deandre Hopkins example prove this to be false?

The Steelers horrible backup qbs not withstanding...

 

[Bleu Star]

Romo's first year he started and played in 10 games, he threw for 2903 with 19 tds and 9 ints. averaged 290 passing yards a game.
Romo's second year he threw for 4211 with 36 tds and 19 ints.

You could see that Romo was going to be an elite passer, which he was. If Dak had numbers like these and Dez had numbers like he had this year I'd be the first to run him out of town but how can a wr have 100 yards receiving when the QB is throwing for a buck fifty? he threw for under 200 yards 8 times, he threw for over 300 yards once and that was against the Giants where Dez caught a slant for over 50 yards, beasley over 40 yards, and Smith went for 80 plus yards. That a lot of yac.

Who Was Romo throwing to? A young elite Dez Bryant (not an aging malcontent)...ok. Who else?

 

[Ken]

Romo's first year he started and played in 10 games, he threw for 2903 with 19 tds and 9 ints. averaged 290 passing yards a game.
Romo's second year he threw for 4211 with 36 tds and 19 ints.

You could see that Romo was going to be an elite passer, which he was. If Dak had numbers like these and Dez had numbers like he had this year I'd be the first to run him out of town but how can a wr have 100 yards receiving when the QB is throwing for a buck fifty? he threw for under 200 yards 8 times, he threw for over 300 yards once and that was against the Giants where Dez caught a slant for over 50 yards, beasley over 40 yards, and Smith went for 80 plus yards. That a lot of yac.

Romo was in a pass first offense.

How did this logic work when Aikman played?

 

[Bleu Star]

I've got all day @birdwells1 ...

 

[G2]

In 2010 his rookie season he fractured his ankle on a punt return, he had 45 for 561 and 6tds
In 2011 he was outperformed by Witten a HOFer
In 2015 he was injured
In 2016 he missed 3 games and was outperformed by Beasley, I wonder why Beasley didn't do that this year? The league caught up to Dak, you'll never see that from Beasley again.

The NFL defenses have made their move and it was successful now it's time for Dak and the coaching staff to make theirs no matter if Dez is here or not. The league is taking away his easy reads.

You asked me to provide with your posturing "genius" comment and I do and you reply with the very thing I specifically said to not use as an excuse. Injuries. Well done.

So I'll say it one last time for all of you Dezzies. The entire offense struggled, not just one player. That includes the coaching. The reason I stopped supporting Dez is for all of the added nonsense HE HIMSELF brings without any excuses or help from others. The lazy routes, the whining for the ball when we're winning the game, leaving the game early while Romo is out there looking for ways to win, whining to the position coaches on the sideline. Pouting like a 5th grader when he doesn't get targets and when he does it bounces off his hands. Watching plays break down and just standing there, running lazy and limited routes, losing basic fundamentals as an 8 year veteran and holding the ball like it's loaf of bread, losing it and they get a TD. Those are the things an 8 year vet, alleged elite WR should just know. On top of that he's paid enough to have all of those issues go away. mentally, he's just simply not equipped.

 

[OmerV]

No Antonio Brown is good but Ben makes him great. What do you think his numbers would look like here?

Of course they would be less here, but the point is Brown helps make Ben just as Ben helps make Brown. They benefit each other.