Can we really cheer for a high draft pick?

[wileedog]

Because it's the difference from having a winning attitude versus a loser attitude. Those that find this hard to understand obviously have the latter.

 

[wileedog]

Some here seem to look more forward to draft day and having a high pick than having a good season that will lower our draft position.

A "good season" went out the window a while ago. 8-8 is not "winning" - it's the same stranded in mediocrity we have been mired in for 20 years.

There's teams that have high picks every year and continue to lose.

Because those teams draft like crap no matter where they pick, and even then are terrible are developing the talent they do pick. Just because they are incompetent shouldn't mean a higher draft pick isn't a better thing for us.

 

[Rockport]

I want us to have a decent chance at winning a SB. What I don't want is knowing that I'll be eliminated from the early in the playoff. If we had a TEAM that has a chance then I am all for it. But we all know (don't kid yourselves) that this team has ZERO chance at winning SB then I rather get a higher pick than winning some meaningless games and a moral victory. I want a chance to get a better player so the team is better in the future.

It's all about not being losers. Most players as soon as they get on the field want to win. They don't care about loser fans hoping for a higher draft pick, one that might replace them I might add, they are competitive and want to win.

 

[KJJ]

A "good season" went out the window a while ago. 8-8 is not "winning" - it's the same stranded in mediocrity we have been mired in for 20 years.

True, but finishing the season strong can at least give you something to feel good about entering the offseason. When you end a season you want to feel like you're at least heading in the right direction. To end up 8-8 with a backup QB after being 3-8 would make everyone feel a little better about the future. Anything is better than a losing season. Losing out and ending up 3-13 gives you little to no hope the following season but winning your last 5 games wth a backup QB gives you a lot of hope the following season.

 

[wileedog]

True, but finishing the season strong can at least give you something to feel good about entering the offseason. When you end a season you want to feel like you're at least heading in the right direction. To end up 8-8 with a backup QB after being 3-8 would make everyone feel a little better about the future. Anything is better than a losing season. Losing out and ending up 3-13 gives you little to no hope the following season but winning your last 5 games wth a backup QB gives you a lot of hope the following season.

I hear what you are saying, but I think you are giving too much emphasis on the carryover from year to year, particularly when you are just talking about the last 5 games of an already wasted season.

I would take the increased chance of getting better talent in the draft over a meaningless win streak at the end. Getting Tony and some new impact players in the draft will bring as much if not more hope and anticipation to the team at the start of next season than remembering what the team did 9 months prior. Some of these players will be gone and replaced by new ones anyway.

 

[Nightman]

What pick would you rather have? The 3rd or the 8th? Give me the 3rd every time. Does it guarantee that you'll get the better player? No. You still have to pick the right guy. Does it give you a chance to get a more highly rated player for your team? Yes. Do each of your picks have a higher trade value? Yes. So if I want to trade down a few spots from 3, I can likely get more in return than I would if I were picking 8th. So if I have a choice of finishing 6-10 or 3-13, give me 3-13 every time. I want to be in the best position to help my team during the draft and having a higher draft pick gives me more ammo to do just that. That doesn't meaning rooting for players to quit or for the team to get killed. I want to see young guys step up and for the team to play hard. However, I know it is probably better for us to have fewer wins in the end because of how it impacts our draft position.

2015 Dante Fowler vs Vic Bealey
2014 Blake Bortles vs Justin Gilbert
2013 Dion Jordan vs Tavon Austin
2012 TRichardson vs Ryan Tannehill
2011 Marcell Dareus vs Jake Locker
2010 Gerald McCoy vs Ro McClain
2009 Tyson Jackson vs Eugene Monroe
2008 Matt Ryan vs Derrick Harvey
2007 Joe Thomas vs Jamaal Anderson
2006 Vince Young vs Donte Whitner

Basically neither list is that impressive. Those are 20 Top 8 picks and you have 3 starting QBs, a couple solid DTs and a bunch of busts.

 

[Ring6]

I will be rooting for Cleveland and Tennessee to win games. Its harmless!!

 

[Nightman]

I hear what you are saying, but I think you are giving too much emphasis on the carryover from year to year, particularly when you are just talking about the last 5 games of an already wasted season.

I would take the increased chance of getting better talent in the draft over a meaningless win streak at the end. Getting Tony and some new impact players in the draft will bring as much if not more hope and anticipation to the team at the start of next season than remembering what the team did 9 months prior. Some of these players will be gone and replaced by new ones anyway.

These guys are playing for their jobs and you want them to lay down for the idea of a possibly better team next year. I know I am surrounded by WAS and PHI fans and I want to beat them every game, every year.

I have enough faith we can get a star at 8 or 3. For people to say they would rather lose than back into the playoffs shows you how out of whack it has gotten.

 

[KJJ]

I hear what you are saying, but I think you are giving too much emphasis on the carryover from year to year, particularly when you are just talking about the last 5 games of an already wasted season.

I would take the increased chance of getting better talent in the draft over a meaningless win streak at the end. Getting Tony and some new impact players in the draft will bring as much if not more hope and anticipation to the team at the start of next season than remembering what the team did 9 months prior. Some of these players will be gone and replaced by new ones anyway.

With as bad as the division is it may only take 7-8 wins to win the East so the Cowboys winning their last 5 games could still get them in the playoffs. A 5 game winning streak would pin 2 losses on Washington who's currently in the drivers seat. I've seen a number of teams over the years finish bad seasons strong and have those strong finishes carry over to the next season.

I see too many teams picking high every year and end up bad every year. Some of the best players the Cowboys have drafted the past few years weren't top 10 picks. There's talent throughout the entire draft if you make the right pick.

 

[PA Cowboy Fan]

True, but finishing the season strong can at least give you something to feel good about entering the offseason. When you end a season you want to feel like you're at least heading in the right direction. To end up 8-8 with a backup QB after being 3-8 would make everyone feel a little better about the future. Anything is better than a losing season. Losing out and ending up 3-13 gives you little to no hope the following season but winning your last 5 games wth a backup QB gives you a lot of hope the following season.

I don't think that matters with the Cowboys. The team finished great last year even with the GB loss and look what happened. I was so up after last year for the first time in a long time.

 

[Nightman]

I will be rooting for Cleveland and Tennessee to win games. Its harmless!!

Finally someone using their brains.

 

[Nightman]

I don't think that matters with the Cowboys. The team finished great last year even with the GB loss and look what happened. I was so up after last year for the first time in a long time.

We also added 3 "Number 1" picks last year.

 

[wileedog]

With as bad as the division is it may only take 7-8 wins to win the East so the Cowboys winning their last 5 games could still get them in the playoffs. A 5 game winning streak would pin 2 losses on Washington who's currently in the drivers seat. I've seen a number of teams over the years finish bad seasons strong and have those strong finishes carry over to the next season.

This is not a playoff team. Period. Even if the miraculous happened this team would get curb-stomped by Seattle or GB in the wild card game. Carolina just went through us like a freight train.

I see too many teams picking high every year and end up bad every year.

Correlation is not causation. They are bad every year because no matter where they draft they do it poorly, and for many of those teams they have ownership/FO/coaching situations even worse that ours.

Again, a higher pick gives a larger talent pool to pick from. That point is not even debatable. Because other teams don't take advantage of that has nothing to do with what we would do with a higher pick.

Some of the best players the Cowboys have drafted the past few years weren't top 10 picks. There's talent throughout the entire draft if you make the right pick.

Of course. But there is typically more talent available at the top of the draft than there is at the bottom. I mean that is just logic.

I mean I like Byron Jones, but what would this team have looked like with Todd Gurley instead? Or Amari Cooper lined up across from Dez? There would definitely be a few more W's on the board, bad QBs or no.

 

[KJJ]

I don't think that matters with the Cowboys. The team finished great last year even with the GB loss and look what happened. I was so up after last year for the first time in a long time.

Finishing a bad season strong can matter but the past decade good seasons have led to high expectations and complacency for the Cowboys the following season. Even if the Cowboys win out the rest of the season it's still going to be a bad year. Winning the last 5 games won't lead to complacency and high expectations for 2016 but it would give the team and fans some hope for next season.

You always want to end a season feeling like you're heading in the right direction. Losing out leaves you with no hope and a high draft pick as your only consolation. When you're picking in the top 5 you're a lot more than one great player away and that's not a good feeling.

 

[tyke1doe]

The Browns have been doing this for years and it's led to nothing for them. Getting a high draft pick doesn't guarantee a better future. I just don't get it. We're all fans of the Dallas Cowboys, yet most people on this board will root for this team to lose and twice to our division rivals nonetheless. How can anyone here mentally and physically root for the freakin' Commanders to beat us?

Because we're looking at the forest and not the tree. The goal of all fans is not just winning, but being in a position to win it ALL!!!
And one of the components to winning it all is having the most talented players. You get those players HIGHER in the draft.
So will I take losing to the Commanders in a meaningless game with a Cowboys team that is less talented and without its starting quarterback vs. beating the Commanders at full strength with the most talented team with something on the line?
I'll take the latter for 2,000, Alex.
We're not going for an undefeated season. This game - really - isn't going to determine if we win the division (We're not beating Green Bay in Green Bay, and I doubt we beat the Bills in Buffalo.) So I see no reason to be frothing with anger because we lose to the Commanders. My anger emotion was extinguished when we lost to the Eagles then the Buccaneers.

As I've said previously, I don't want the Cowboys to just win; I want them to DOMINATE!!!

And if we draft players who help achieve that goal, even if it means a loss to the Commanders in a season that has become a shambles, then lose on!

 

[Nightman]

Because we're looking at the forest and not the tree. The goal of all fans is not just winning, but being in a position to win it ALL!!!
And one of the components to winning it all is having the most talented players. You get those players HIGHER in the draft.
So will I take losing to the Commanders in a meaningless game with a Cowboys team that is less talented and without its starting quarterback vs. beating the Commanders at full strength with the most talented team with something on the line?
I'll take the latter for 2,000, Alex.
We're not going for an undefeated season. This game - really - isn't going to determine if we win the division (We're not beating Green Bay in Green Bay, and I doubt we beat the Bills in Buffalo.) So I see no reason to be frothing with anger because we lose to the Commanders. My anger emotion was extinguished when we lost to the Eagles then the Buccaneers.

As I've said previously, I don't want the Cowboys to just win; I want them to DOMINATE!!!

And if we draft players who help achieve that goal, even if it means a loss to the Commanders in a season that has become a shambles, then lose on!

Everyone thought we were a Super Bowl team this year and we added 3 number one draft picks.

We don't need a top 3 pick to be a Super Bowl contender next year. We need to stay healthy and to find a stud RB,

 

[KJJ]

This is not a playoff team. Period. Even if the miraculous happened this team would get curb-stomped by Seattle or GB in the wild card game. Carolina just went through us like a freight train.


Correlation is not causation. They are bad every year because no matter where they draft they do it poorly, and for many of those teams they have ownership/FO/coaching situations even worse that ours.

Again, a higher pick gives a larger talent pool to pick from. That point is not even debatable. Because other teams don't take advantage of that has nothing to do with what we would do with a higher pick.


Of course. But there is typically more talent available at the top of the draft than there is at the bottom. I mean that is just logic.

I mean I like Byron Jones, but what would this team have looked like with Todd Gurley instead? Or Amari Cooper lined up across from Dez? There would definitely be a few more W's on the board, bad QBs or no.

Anything can happen in the playoffs it's all about peaking at the right time so any team that were to be ridding a 5 game winning streak entering the playoffs would be dangerous despite their regular season record. The Giants won the SB after being 7-7 and ending the regular season 9-7 in 2011. I'm certainly not saying the Cowboys could do that but you can't count anyone out in the playoffs especially a hot team riding a winning streak. As for getting stomped by Seattle they only beat the Cowboys by one point with our backup QB. They're not near the team they've been we competed with them a few week ago and we could compete with them again especially if we won 5 straight games to end the season.

A higher draft pick costs you more money and doesn't guarantee a good player. The team didn't need Gurley we had the top rusher in the league who fit our team. Jones will benefit us more than Gurley if he continues to progress and becomes a great player. Besides Gurley came late in the draft not the top 5 which shows you don't need a top 5 pick to come up with a great player. We need defense because that's the side of the ball that knocked us out of the playoffs last season and helped cost us a couple of OT games this season.

 

[wileedog]

Anything can happen in the playoffs it's all about peaking at the right time so any team that were to be ridding a 5 game winning streak entering the playoffs would be dangerous despite their regular season record. The Giants won the SB after being 7-7 and ending the regular season 9-7 in 2011. I'm certainly not saying the Cowboys could do that but you can't count anyone out in the playoffs especially a hot team riding a winning streak. As for getting stomped by Seattle they only beat the Cowboys by one point with our backup QB. They're not near the team they've been we competed with them a few week ago and we could compete with them again especially if we won 5 straight games to end the season.

I commend your optimism, but I've checked out on this team. If this sort of hope doesn't die in Washington its probably scheduled for execution in Lambeau the following week.

A higher draft pick costs you more money and doesn't guarantee a good player.

With the new rookie caps its not that big of a deal.

The team didn't need Gurley we had the top rusher in the league who fit our team.

Who, Randle? Murray was already gone when we would have drafted Gurley this year (assuming, obviously, we had the high pick)..

Jones will benefit us more than Gurley if he continues to progress and becomes a great player. Besides Gurley came late in the draft not the top 5. We need defense because that's the side of the ball that knocked us out of the playoffs last season and helped cost us a couple of OT games this season.

I think Gurley behind this line for the next 5 years would have made us forget all about Murray. The defensive would have been better because it would be spending a whole lot more time standing on the sidelines. And he would have taken a lot of pressure off of the backup QBs that Randle and McFadden couldn't.

 

[tyke1doe]

Spin it anyway you want to feel better about yourself but wanting to lose out is having a loser mentality.

But we're not playing. We're fans.
It would be having a loser mentality if we were players, but it's not if we're fans who see a greater purpose behind losing.

It's sort of like being a parent of a bad kid. You have tried to raise that kid right, you've tried to counsel him not to make wrong choices.

And finally he makes a bad choice, and you decide to let him face the consequences of his choice. Are you rooting for him to lose?

Not necessarily, if the goal is by losing/facing the consequences of his pathetic decisions he ultimately learns from his mistake and becomes a better person.

Sometimes, you have to let a person fall in order for that person to be restored. Sometimes, you have to let go and let your team lose if it means your team will be restored.

Fans here love the Cowboys; otherwise, we wouldn't be here. We want them to succeed. But they haven't been succeeding. Maybe it's better for them to fail and fall so their tomorrow can be better than their today.

It's all in how you look at it.

 

[tyke1doe]

Everyone thought we were a Super Bowl team this year and we added 3 number one draft picks.

We don't need a top 3 pick to be a Super Bowl contender next year. We need to stay healthy and to find a stud RB,

And you know this how?
You're making statements about the unknown. We won't know if we truly are a Super Bowl team until we're fully healthy. There's no way to know if we were healthy, we'd be a Super Bowl team.