CB Pat Surtain All Pro or Pro Bowler?

[cnuball21]

I am just joking with you. Minkah is probably the low end for Surtain. Very similar in college.

I know all good...

But I’d disagree with you again lol...Minkah was a chess piece in college best suited for S. A linear athlete that didn’t have smooth hips to be a + CB in the NFL.

I think Surtain is a quality CB prospect and will have a good career...I just don’t see an alpha dog with + athleticism that will be able to follow #1 WRs around.

Great pick in the 20s, but not at 10 for me.

 

[baltcowboy]

I know all good...

But I’d disagree with you again lol...Minkah was a chess piece in college best suited for S. A linear athlete that didn’t have smooth hips to be a + CB in the NFL.

I think Surtain is a quality CB prospect and will have a good career...I just don’t see an alpha dog with + athleticism that will be able to follow #1 WRs around.

Great pick in the 20s, but not at 10 for me.

Speaking of the 20s there are lots of prospects we could use in that range. Man I hope a quarterback is there at 10 so we can trade down eat up the bounty. I don’t think Farley, Surtain, Horne are that far ahead of say Stokes, Newsome and the other second round corners..

 

[cnuball21]

Speaking of the 20s there are lots of prospects we could use in that range. Man I hope a quarterback is there at 10 so we can trade down eat up the bounty. I don’t think Farley, Surtain, Horne are that far ahead of say Stokes, Newsome and the other second round corners..

Now that I can agree on! I love Stokes and Newsome and think they’ll get drafted in the first. I honestly wouldn’t be surprised if one of them is taken ahead of Horn.

Epic if one falls to our 2nd pick, but I’d even consider using one of our comps to move up for either.

 

[tyke1doe]

I mean if you want to the play the hindsight game we could do it for every draft and talk about who should've been taken when and where. As prospects, I'd argue:

You mentioned the Humphrey draft first.

- Lattimore is better than any CB in this class
- Fournette is better than any RB in this class
- Adams / Hooker both better than any S in this class
- Garrett better than any pass rusher in this class

So you criticize me for playing the hindsight game, and you're playing the foresight game.

Maybe I should've prefaced it saying that class was better at the top for what we need. I'd say this class is better for OT's at the top.

It's all a guessing game. But my point is that Surtain has football in his DNA. I think he's a sure bet. But we'll see.

 

[cnuball21]

You mentioned the Humphrey draft first.



So you criticize me for playing the hindsight game, and you're playing the foresight game.



It's all a guessing game. But my point is that Surtain has football in his DNA. I think he's a sure bet. But we'll see.

Well yea, I've been talking about the players as prospects the whole time. All prospects are "foresight" that's the whole point.

 

[Typhus]

Cowboys have to (unfortunately) go with the "safest" (hate to use that word, but I can't seem to think of another one) choice. Every draft pick needs to at least be a solid performer, as much as possible. They can't afford somebody who needs "coaching" or "seasoning" or is a "project" player. They need to minimize downsides.

To me Surtain is the "safest" pick, no major shortcomings. And that's not saying he's not a top prospect, he is, just that if the Cowboys have a choice between him and Farley, et al, it's got to be Surtain....

Surtain is a potential shut down corner in this league, I have no problem with that pic at 10.
He was tested early by teams, yet was able to punish opponents for doing so.

 

[LACowboysFan1]

Surtain is a potential shut down corner in this league, I have no problem with that pic at 10.
He was tested early by teams, yet was able to punish opponents for doing so.

Agreed, anyway with Awuzie leaving Cowboys are in a tight spot for corner, and considering Diggs just got here last year, and showed he's already pretty good, having two young and CHEAP corners for several years is a great thing....

 

[tyke1doe]

Well yea, I've been talking about the players as prospects the whole time. All prospects are "foresight" that's the whole point.

But it's still a guessing game. So trying to bring "accuracy" to an issue that can't be measured at this time undermines your point and this conversation.
So back to the original point which prompted your response, Surtain has a similar pedigree to Humphrey's. That isn't in dispute as we know both have fathers who were professional football players.
Comparing Surtain and Humphrey as where they should and will go in the draft is mere speculation.
Facts vs. speculation. Hmmm?!?!?

 

[beware_d-ware]

It just hit me today that Pat Surtain kind of reminds me of D-Law. Lawrence isn't a high end athlete, but plays with teaching-tape level technique every snap and hustles more than any other Cowboy on the field. He makes buckets of plays and beats some really good tackles despite average size and burst.

DE and CB are both 1v1 high-octane athlete positions and there's not much room for little engines that could. But Surtain's technique is at a DLaw-esque level where he could probably coach DBs and the WRs too, and his hustle on and off the field can't be overlooked. I'm just so confident that even if he tests out as a league average athlete, he's going to be a stud.

Humphrey vs Surtain and Lattimore vs Surtain are all fair questions, as those guys were top-shelf athletes with very strong games themselves. I don't think Surtain comes out ahead in those comparisons. But we are looking at Farley vs Surtain this year, and thee question there is do you want a top-shelf NFL athlete with an average to decent game and some injury issues, or do you want an average NFL athlete with a clinician's game. I think Farley's being graded fairly and he'd measure out as a top 15 pick in any draft you put him in, but I feel so good about Surtain being successful.

 

[PUSHfold]

Always read the rule and posted warnings when you go somewhere. It may be to your own benefit. Taking orders has nothing to do with being grown men. Grown men better than the both of us take orders every day. Being a wisenheimer around here can get you trouble. That is as civil a warning as you deserve.

Jesus, you really are a Karen...take some dude Xanax and chill. Are you even actually a moderator? If you're not then what in the world are you doing acting like one? Did you apply recently? Trying to show them you can do a job?

 

[Rockport]

Whst are your thoughts on his ? Is he too slow to be a all pro corner? Is he just athletic enough to be a borderline pro bowler? Speed matters unless you’re a scheme corner line Sherman or Norman.

Dunno. Does he have a burning desire to win? Does he have a burning desire to get better? How’s he in the locker room? These are the kinds of things that separate the JAG’s and the All Pros.

 

[JoeKing]

Jesus, you really are a Karen...take some dude Xanax and chill. Are you even actually a moderator? If you're not then what in the world are you doing acting like one? Did you apply recently? Trying to show them you can do a job?

I never claimed to be a moderator, If I was I'd just delete the thread as @Reality has warned will happen to threads not posted in the right place. I'm trying to prevent that by reminding you people. I'm not even asking for a thank you. I sure as hell don/t need your BS. By the way, if you don't like Karen's then don't be one yourself. LOL

 

[cnuball21]

But it's still a guessing game. So trying to bring "accuracy" to an issue that can't be measured at this time undermines your point and this conversation.
So back to the original point which prompted your response, Surtain has a similar pedigree to Humphrey's. That isn't in dispute as we know both have fathers who were professional football players.
Comparing Surtain and Humphrey as where they should and will go in the draft is mere speculation.
Facts vs. speculation. Hmmm?!?!?

But it's still a guessing game. So trying to bring "accuracy" to an issue that can't be measured at this time undermines your point and this conversation.
So back to the original point which prompted your response, Surtain has a similar pedigree to Humphrey's. That isn't in dispute as we know both have fathers who were professional football players.
Comparing Surtain and Humphrey as where they should and will go in the draft is mere speculation.
Facts vs. speculation. Hmmm?!?!?

At this point I'm not even sure where we are in this argument.

Sure, both have Dad's that play NFL football and that is a comparison and they both played at Alabama. In that way they are similar, as prospects coming out not so much. Humphrey was a much better athlete compared to Surtain while Surtain is more of a technician as a CB. What I was saying, is that if Surtain had Humphrey's athleticism he'd be a blue chip prospect but he doesn't.

As prospects (without looking at Humphrey's NFL play) I'd take Humphrey 10 times out of 10 over Surtain.

 

[tyke1doe]

At this point I'm not even sure where we are in this argument.

Sure, both have Dad's that play NFL football and that is a comparison and they both played at Alabama. In that way they are similar, as prospects coming out not so much. Humphrey was a much better athlete compared to Surtain while Surtain is more of a technician as a CB. What I was saying, is that if Surtain had Humphrey's athleticism he'd be a blue chip prospect but he doesn't.

As prospects (without looking at Humphrey's NFL play) I'd take Humphrey 10 times out of 10 over Surtain.

I was only comparing their pedigree. Sigh.

 

[cnuball21]

I was only comparing their pedigree. Sigh.

Then you are 100% correct. They both went to Alabama and have Dads that play pro ball.

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

I never claimed to be a moderator, If I was I'd just delete the thread as @Reality has warned will happen to threads not posted in the right place. I'm trying to prevent that by reminding you people. I'm not even asking for a thank you. I sure as hell don/t need your BS. By the way, if you don't like Karen's then don't be one yourself. LOL

Thanks for the heads up Karen.

Our neighborhood is safe once again...

 

[tyke1doe]

Then you are 100% correct. They both went to Alabama and have Dads that play pro ball.

I know Marlon and his family. He is a superb athlete.

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

I never claimed to be a moderator, If I was I'd just delete the thread as @Reality has warned will happen to threads not posted in the right place. I'm trying to prevent that by reminding you people. I'm not even asking for a thank you. I sure as hell don/t need your BS. By the way, if you don't like Karen's then don't be one yourself. LOL

Not true.

Post #23 in the “Dak is the hero we need” thread back in August 17, 2020, you said “I AM A MODERATOR.”

I didn’t believe when I read it the first time but you sure did say it.

 

[cnuball21]

I know Marlon and his family. He is a superb athlete.

I agree again! He is the kind of athlete you want at CB in the top 10.

 

[JoeKing]

Not true.

Post #23 in the “Dak is the hero we need” thread back in August 17, 2020, you said “I AM A MODERATOR.”

I didn’t believe when I read it the first time but you sure did say it.

That wasn't me, LIAR. That had to be someone else because i've never claimed to be one. What the hell is wrong with you? Trying to get me in trouble with a LIE.