Cole Beasley. wrong to let him go?

[JoeKing]

How can I be creating a straw man when I answered your question?

It is you that is creating the straw man, because it is you that has been trying to create some argument that Beasley is better in Buffalo than he was here, because of coaching, the same coaching that is here with Gallup.

You have an opinion, I'm not addressing it, you are entitled to that opinion. Please allow me the same courtesy.

 

[JoeKing]

Dak > Josh

 

[khiladi]

You have an opinion, I'm not addressing it, you are entitled to that opinion. Please allow me the same courtesy.

Please stop being condescending with phrases like “if you were keeping up” and “by telling me I’m creating straw man’s”, when I didn’t.

To summarize, you claimed that Beasley was hindered here by coaching, while he had 70 plus receptions, meaning the stat supports exactly what I stated.

Gallup is irrelevant to this point, even though Beasley caught more receptions than him in his best year. And the type of routes Beasley ran here are significantly more complicated than the ones Gallup ran here. Gallup’s routes aren’t diversified at all for any WR.

 

[JoeKing]

Please stop being condescending by telling me I’m creating straw man’s, when I didn’t.

When you are repeatedly arguing a point that no one is contradicting, it's a strawman argument? How many times did you repeat yourself that Cole had more receptions? I never disputed that. I even quoted the stats of Cole and Gallup including Cole's greater receptions. But you still kept repeating yourself, strawman.

 

[khiladi]

When you are repeatedly arguing a point that no one is contradicting, it's a strawman argument? How many times did you repeat yourself that Cole had more receptions? I never disputed that. I even quoted the stats of Cole and Gallup including Cole's greater receptions. But you still kept repeating yourself, strawman.

No, I am not repeating myself. You are trying to make excuses.

How is this repeating myself:

I added some information about grass and turf. Go look again at my post.

Also, like I said, in 2016, everybody was saying Dak made Beasley. Plenty of Dak-stans were also telling us Dak didn’t need Dez, who was causing Dak to force throws to him. What actually happened as Linehan is who made Beasley in the context of the scheme and defenders caught on. They started doubling Beasley and sitting on the routes and Dak couldn’t hit the broad side of a barn, because he no longer had the Beasley valve.

Beasley had a 75 rec, 833 yard season which was almost equivalent to this year. Beasley even caught 65 here in 2018, the year Dak stans were saying it was his fault. That is 1 less reception than Gallup’s best year. Gallup has NEVER had an equivalent season in terms of receptions to Beasley.

Again, Gallup is basically running go routes in this offense, thus the yardage.

Saying the coaches didn’t allow if is not true. The QB couldn’t adjust.

Nobody is disputing the TDs of Gallup. Everywhere that I brought up receptions is to illustrate the fact that the coaches got him the ball to the tune of 73 plus receptions and sixty plus even in 2018, when all the Dak-stans were saying it was Cole Beasley’s fault.

Everything is about absolving Dak. You don’t want to admit that the same coaching staff that gets Gallup his TDs and got Beasley 70 plus receptions has a limited QB in Dak.

Josh Allen is way better than Dak.

 

[JoeKing]

No, I am not repeating myself. You are trying to make excuses.

How is this repeating myself:

Oh, do you think that was the only post you made your point about the number of receptions Cole had? think again, strawman.

 

[khiladi]

Oh, do you think that was the only post you made your point about the number of receptions Cole had? think again, strawman.

No, my point was that your claim that Cole is better in Buffalo is better than Dallas, because of coaching. You know how many TDs Cole had this year, with his 82 REC? 4 TDs.. It’s definitely not as much as how 2016 season when he had 75 REC, which was 5 TDs. You know how many TDs Beasley had in 2017 when he had 36 RECs? 4 TDs..

By your logic that you are using about Gallup, which is completely irrelevant to my point and is the real straw man, Beasley is actually better in Dallas than he was at Buffalo, because he has a higher TD:REC ratio..

But then again, what is that going to say for your at argument that Cole has better coaching in Buffalo than Dallas?

 

[khiladi]

Like I said from the very beginning:

Well Dak supporters said he made Cole and when Dak sucked in 2017 and 2018, Cole was one of their scapegoats.

Beasley’s best year here statistically in 2016 was because of Linehan. Defenses realized this and began scheming for Him and it’s not surprise Dak was throwing four pick 6s in like 4 games, before Linehan took the ball away from Dak and started feeding Zeke like 24 times a game.

https://thelandryhat.com/2017/10/04/dallas-cowboys-wheres-cole-beasley/

One reason behind Beasley’s diminishing output could be defenses making a concerted effort to take away the short passing game– something quarterback Dak Prescott excels out. In forcing Prescott out of his comfort zone, and make deeper throws, a lot of the short options that were available last season aren’t necessarily there.

After the disaster that was 2017, they then got rid of Dez. They then expanded Cole’s route tree, after the Cowboys got rid of Dez to make it Dak-friendly and Dak followed it up by firing his agent and hiring Todd France. Most people were hyping this up, because of the 2016 year.

When asked earlier this offseason, Quarterback Dak Prescott stated that “Beasley is his No. 1 receiver” and it should come to no surprise. The two hit it off immediately in the Prescott’s rookie season in 2016, which just so happened to be Beasley’s most productive. Unfortunately, things didn’t go as well in 2017 when opposing defenses decided to take #11 out of the equation by bracketing him in coverage.

https://insidethestar.com/expanded-route-tree-will-make-cole-beasley-uncoverable-in-2018/

So much hype was about Beasley and the coaching around it to cater to Dak. But Dak started setting franchise records of futility and even threw his WRs under the bus. And Cole was attacked by fans, as if he asked Dallas to get rid of Dez.

https://www.nfl.com/news/cole-beasley-on-cowboys-wrs-we-re-just-getting-open-0ap3000000967380

Problem is, Dak wasn’t throwing to open WRs.
Even Linehan was saying that Dak needed to sling it in 2018. There was only so much an OC could do.

https://www.bloggingtheboys.com/201...prescott-needs-to-trust-his-arm-and-receivers

Then they got Cooper and Cooper had to yell at Dak a couple games into the season after Dak couldn’t realize all the single man coverage that he was not throwing against, while CBs were sitting on the routes.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...-philadelphia-eagles-dak-prescott/2262262002/

 

[JoeKing]

No, my point was that your claim that Cole is better in Buffalo is better than Dallas, because of coaching. You know how many TDs Cole had this year, with his 82 REC? 4 TDs.. It’s definitely not as much as how 2016 season when he had 75 REC, which was 5 TDs. You know how many TDs Beasley had in 2017 when he had 36 RECs? 4 TDs..

By your logic that you are using about Gallup, which is completely irrelevant to my point and is the real straw man, Beasley is actually better in Dallas than he was at Buffalo, because he has a higher TD:REC ratio..

But then again, what is that going to say for your at argument that Cole has better coaching in Buffalo than Dallas?

So Beas had better numbers in Dallas? So Dak is a better QB than Josh Allen. You admitted it!

 

[Ozone22]

It was time for a change for both parties. Beasley is happy in Buffalo and the Boy's are happy with Lamb. Hoping he makes it to the AFC Championship game.

 

[khiladi]

So Beas had better numbers in Dallas? So Dak is a better QB than Josh Allen. You admitted it!

Per your standards, the coaching is better in Dallas. Which would contradict your original assertion that Beasley is better in Buffalo than Dallas.

It’s pretty obvious the only reason you tried so hard in the beginning to claim Beasley was better in Buffalo than Dallas is because you were trying to argue Allen isn’t way better than Dak.

I’ve never agreed to your standards..

 

[JoeKing]

Per your standards, the coaching is better in Dallas.

lol, no no per your standards, Beas having better numbers in Dallas is due to better QB play.

 

[Proof]

I know we have discussed him and his behavior before he moved on.

But he has had a very good year with 967 yards and made Allen a top level QB in 2020 helping get them into the playoffs.

Allen has certainly liked him as a Go To Guy..

So my question is did we make a mistake in trading for Cooper and us giving Cooper the money. Add to that also having to pay the big price tag to Cooper when we resigned him and trading a #1 pick to acquire him.

I liked Beasley and thought he was a stealthy weapon who made big plays when he was with us. His play in Buffalo has been impressive with Allen.

And when you factor in drafting CeeDee this year it has forced us to invest another #1 pick in him to fix Cobbs departure in 2019.

Quite a domino effect leaving me thinking we should have re-signed him thus needing not to reinvest a #1 pick in CeeDee to repair the damage at slot.

So 2 1st Rd picks in 2018 and again in 2019 that maybe should have been used on defense might have left us way better off.

But then again in the old Garrett regime, no matter what we did under Marrinelli and his limitations with Richard we could not draft defense at all (ie Trystan Hill and Taco Charlton high pick failures.)

So my point is as insistent as we all are in supporting our positions on player decisions we have made decisions that left us looking a little lacking.

Can we avoid that going forward with McCarthy?

I certainly hope so because we can not keep replacing missed players with trades and #1 picks.

And we can not win with guys like Dalton Smith and Gerald McCoy and Ha Ha Clinton Dix who are past their prime bodies to patch the mistakes.

Thoughts?

I feel like every single point in this post is wrong lol

cole didn’t make Allen, the offense exploded with the addition of Diggs. (Who cost a first a fourth and a sixth as well as a hefty contract )


We weren’t forced to draft lamb, he fell in our laps and produced a nearly identical year as Coles (best) in his rookie season, with 4 different qbs at a fraction of the cost. Not to mention the similar production we got out of a plug and play Cobb.

ceedee is also an ascending talent who the team controls for 5 years. That’s huge. His floor is coles peak lol.

 

[khiladi]

lol, no no per your standards, Beas having better numbers in Dallas is due to better QB play.

Where are they my standards?

It’s pretty obvious the only reason you tried so hard in the beginning to claim Beasley was better in Buffalo than Dallas is because you were trying to argue Allen isn’t way better than Dak.

I’ve never agreed to your standards..

 

[JoeKing]

Where are they my standards?

It’s pretty obvious the only reason you tried so hard in the beginning to claim Beasley was better in Buffalo than Dallas is because you were trying to argue Allen isn’t way better than Dak.

I’ve never agreed to your standards..

We have a difference in opinion on that. So what.

 

[khiladi]

We have a difference in opinion on that. So what.

Again, you said Beasley is better in Buffalo than Dallas and the reason is coaching.

Now after all this arguing, you are saying Beasley was better in Dallas, because he had a better TD:REC ratio after I pointed out these stats to you, and you want to attribute it to Dak, not coaching. .

So just stop being disingenuous this whole time..

 

[Proof]

Beasley caught way more than Gallup, who was our number 2 WR.

Beasley is with a better QB, period...

Umm. Who cares if he caught “way more”. That’s what underneath guys do lol. Shorter passes are are always going to lead to a higher catch rate. And calling Gallup our “number 2” to emphasize that bogus point is odd since ceedee caught “way more” passes ... as the underneath guy. Not to mention the Gilbert’s and dinuccis of the world.

when he was the number 2 tho, (last year) he cracked a thousand yards, something coles never done, and matched coles career high in tds.

lastly coles fantastic yr this season is nearly identical to his 2016, with none other than Dak, in a ball control, run first offense lol.

what are you talking about bruh

 

[JoeKing]

Again, you said Beasley is better in Buffalo than Dallas and the reason is coaching.

Now after all this arguing, you are saying Beasley was better in Dallas, because he had a better TD:REC ratio after I pointed out these stats to you, and you want to attribute it to Dak, not coaching. .

So just stop being disingenuous this whole time..

The opposite is true.

 

[khiladi]

Umm. Who cares if he caught “way more”. That’s what underneath guys do lol. Shorter passes are are always going to lead to a higher catch rate. And calling Gallup our “number 2” to emphasize that bogus point is odd since ceedee caught “way more” passes ... as the underneath guy. Not to mention the Gilbert’s and dinuccis of the world.

when he was the number 2 tho, (last year) he cracked a thousand yards, something coles never done, and matched coles career high in tds.

lastly coles fantastic yr this season is nearly identical to his 2016, with none other than Dak, in a ball control, run first offense lol.

what are you talking about bruh

Read the whole thread, then ask what I’m talking about..

And to clarify:

1. Cobb was the slot receiver and had less targets than both Gallup and Cooper.

2. In 2016, Beasley had more targets than any of our WRs.

 

[khiladi]

The opposite is true.

This is your second post in this whole thread right after you asked me if Beasley caught more receptions than Gallup and I provided the data to substantiate what I said was true, while clearly acknowledging they were two different types of WRs:

That's apples and oranges. I'm talking about Beasley's time with the Cowboys compared to Gallup's time with the Cowboys. If you were keeping up, I've already stated Beasley got better after he left the Cowboys, which would not have happened if he stayed in Dallas... the coaching did not allow it.”

Like I said, stop being disingenuous. You said Beasley got better in Buffalo and the reason is coaching.