Twitter: Competition Committee says Dez caught it **merged**

[BlindFaith]

What act does not matter, the rules say any act common to the game turns a receiver into a runner.

Not if they are trying to become a runner while falling.

Read the going to the ground rule again and educate us on what it means.

 

[BlindFaith]

They are trying to rationalize the magical lunge theory.

The magical lunge that is clearly defined in three case plays? That one?

 

[blindzebra]

Except if they are trying to become a runner while falling.

Read the going to the ground rule again.

It says a player going to the ground in the process of making a catch, that means a receiver. Every one of those case plays describe a player going from a receiver to a runner, care to guess where that transition is shown in the rules?

 

[blindzebra]

Not if they are trying to become a runner while falling.

Read the going to the ground rule again and educate us on what it means.

Repeating it won't make it suddenly become true.

The case plays describe a receiver becoming a runner, where is that in the rule book?

 

[blindzebra]

The magical lunge that is clearly defined in three case plays? That one?

No what is clearly established in those case plays were a receiver becoming a runner. You find that transition in 8.1.3. a) and b) you are a receiver, any act common to the game completes c) and you are a runner.

 

[OmerV]

So you think if there was one single possible "exception" to the (I'm going to assume you meant "Going to the Ground") rule, that they would put it down in a case play and not in the actual rules? And they wouldn't actually say, hey, this is an exception that contradicts everything else we told you? No, case plays are meant to provide *support* of the rules and their concepts and provide better understanding of those rules and concepts. They are not designed to show exceptions to the rules.

We are talking about the case play where a foot was down and the player got hit and knocked to the ground - don't backpeddle now. No smoke screens - tell me what "football move" was in the case play that you said was all about "football moves"

If it's not an exception, how could it be a catch without the "football move", which is required for it to be a catch?

 

[OmerV]

What act does not matter, the rules say any act common to the game turns a receiver into a runner.

Any move? In the case play the receiver gets one foot down and he gets knocked to the ground by a defender, so what is the act common to the game - one foot touching, or getting tackled? Do you really think either of those things satisfies the rule?

 

[BlindFaith]

It says a player going to the ground in the process of making a catch, that means a receiver. Every one of those case plays describe a player going from a receiver to a runner, care to guess where that transition is shown in the rules?

What is this receiver stuff you're trying to bring up. A player is a player until they are a runner.

The case plays use the exact same language as the going to the ground rule.

Explain - Player goes to the ground in the act of catching a pass.

I thought you at least knew what that rule meant.

 

[blindzebra]

Not if they are trying to become a runner while falling.

Read the going to the ground rule again and educate us on what it means.

Item 1: Player Going to the Ground.
If a player goes to the ground in the act of catching a pass (with or without contact by an opponent), he must maintain control of the ball throughout the process of contacting the ground, whether in the field of play or the end zone. If he loses control of the ball, and the ball touches the ground before he regains control, the pass is incomplete. If he regains control prior to the ball touching the ground, the pass is complete.

What rule gives us the act of catching a pass?

RULE 8 FORWARD PASS, BACKWARD PASS, FUMBLE
SECTION 1 FORWARD PASS

Article 3 Completed or Intercepted Pass
A player who makes a catch may advance the ball. A forward pass is complete (by the offense) or intercepted (by the defense) if a player, who is inbounds:
a) secures control of the ball in his hands or arms prior to the ball touching the ground; and
b) touches the ground inbounds with both feet or with any part of his body other than his hands; and
c) maintains control of the ball long enough, after (a) and (b) have been fulfilled, to enable him to perform any act common to the game (i.e., maintaining control long enough to pitch it, pass it, advance with it, or avoid or ward off an opponent, etc.).

Note 1: It is not necessary that he commit such an act, provided that he maintains control of the ball long enough to do so.
Note 2: If a player has control of the ball, a slight movement of the ball will not be considered a loss of possession. He must lose control of the ball in order to rule that there has been a loss of possession. If the player loses the ball while simultaneously touching both feet or any part of his body to the ground, it is not a catch.

Item 1 is talking about a receiver going to the ground.
a) secures control of the ball in his hands or arms prior to the ball touching the ground; and
b) touches the ground inbounds with both feet or with any part of his body other than his hands
A player at this point is still a receiver and must meet the Item 1 requirements.
When a player does this:
c) maintains control of the ball long enough, after (a) and (b) have been fulfilled, to enable him to perform any act common to the game (i.e., maintaining control long enough to pitch it, pass it, advance with it, or avoid or ward off an opponent, etc.).
They become a runner and Item 1 no longer applies to that player.

And that is EXACTLY what those case plays illustrate.

 

[BlindFaith]

Repeating it won't make it suddenly become true.

The case plays describe a receiver becoming a runner, where is that in the rule book?

Again, what is this receiver bit you are trying to spin? Please explain.

 

[blindzebra]

What is this receiver stuff you're trying to bring up. A player is a player until they are a runner.

The case plays use the exact same language as the going to the ground rule.

Explain - Player goes to the ground in the act of catching a pass.

I thought you at least knew what that rule meant.

Seriously? WOW is all that can be said.

 

[blindzebra]

Again, what is this receiver bit you are trying to spin? Please explain.

There is no spinning going on from me, you on the other hand...

 

[BlindFaith]

Item 1: Player Going to the Ground.
If a player goes to the ground in the act of catching a pass (with or without contact by an opponent), he must maintain control of the ball throughout the process of contacting the ground, whether in the field of play or the end zone. If he loses control of the ball, and the ball touches the ground before he regains control, the pass is incomplete. If he regains control prior to the ball touching the ground, the pass is complete.

What rule gives us the act of catching a pass?

RULE 8 FORWARD PASS, BACKWARD PASS, FUMBLE
SECTION 1 FORWARD PASS

Article 3 Completed or Intercepted Pass
A player who makes a catch may advance the ball. A forward pass is complete (by the offense) or intercepted (by the defense) if a player, who is inbounds:
a) secures control of the ball in his hands or arms prior to the ball touching the ground; and
b) touches the ground inbounds with both feet or with any part of his body other than his hands; and
c) maintains control of the ball long enough, after (a) and (b) have been fulfilled, to enable him to perform any act common to the game (i.e., maintaining control long enough to pitch it, pass it, advance with it, or avoid or ward off an opponent, etc.).

Note 1: It is not necessary that he commit such an act, provided that he maintains control of the ball long enough to do so.
Note 2: If a player has control of the ball, a slight movement of the ball will not be considered a loss of possession. He must lose control of the ball in order to rule that there has been a loss of possession. If the player loses the ball while simultaneously touching both feet or any part of his body to the ground, it is not a catch.

Item 1 is talking about a receiver going to the ground.
a) secures control of the ball in his hands or arms prior to the ball touching the ground; and
b) touches the ground inbounds with both feet or with any part of his body other than his hands
A player at this point is still a receiver and must meet the Item 1 requirements.
When a player does this:
c) maintains control of the ball long enough, after (a) and (b) have been fulfilled, to enable him to perform any act common to the game (i.e., maintaining control long enough to pitch it, pass it, advance with it, or avoid or ward off an opponent, etc.).
They become a runner and Item 1 no longer applies to that player.

And that is EXACTLY what those case plays illustrate.

Lol. You really don't know what that rule is.

It says - IN THE act of catching a pass.

That means if they have not completed the act of catching a pass before they begin going to the ground.

This is exactly why you didn't answer my questions. You instead are spinning out incoherent blather to shoehorn your opinion.

 

[blindzebra]

Any move? In the case play the receiver gets one foot down and he gets knocked to the ground by a defender, so what is the act common to the game - one foot touching, or getting tackled? Do you really think either of those things satisfies the rule?

What are you even talking about?

 

[BlindFaith]

Seriously? WOW is all that can be said.

That's what I thought. Can you point out in the rules where it clarifies the term receiver?

 

[Kevinicus]

We are talking about the case play where a foot was down and the player got hit and knocked to the ground - don't backpeddle now. No smoke screens - tell me what "football move" was in the case play that you said was all about "football moves"

If it's not an exception, how could it be a catch without the "football move", which is required for it to be a catch?

Which case play number?

 

[blindzebra]

Lol. You really don't know what that rule is.

It says - IN THE act of catching a pass.

That means if they have not completed the act of catching a pass before they begin going to the ground.

This is exactly why you didn't answer my questions. You instead are spinning out incoherent blather to shoehorn your opinion.

Sure that is what it means. Not gonna fall for the insult bait either.
You do realize what you just wrote completely contradicts your entire theory, since in none of the case plays does the player complete the process before going to the ground.

 

[rkell87]

Any move? In the case play the receiver gets one foot down and he gets knocked to the ground by a defender, so what is the act common to the game - one foot touching, or getting tackled? Do you really think either of those things satisfies the rule?

Catching and having the ball ripped away by a defender and re establishing control is an act common to the game. Landing with your back to the sideline and turning up field to run is an act common to the game. Now this one is really going to tickle your titties, tripping is both an act common to the game AND something a runner does but not something one does while falling; isn't that fun! After tripping the lunge happens but that's irrelevant to the catch at this point.

Don't fall victim to sunk cost and anchoring, you're on the wrong side of this thing man; like the axis powers in world war 2 or the confederate states in the civil war. Think about what you are fighting for man.

 

[BlindFaith]

Item 1 is talking about a receiver going to the ground.
a) secures control of the ball in his hands or arms prior to the ball touching the ground; and
b) touches the ground inbounds with both feet or with any part of his body other than his hands
A player at this point is still a receiver and must meet the Item 1 requirements.
When a player does this:
c) maintains control of the ball long enough, after (a) and (b) have been fulfilled, to enable him to perform any act common to the game (i.e., maintaining control long enough to pitch it, pass it, advance with it, or avoid or ward off an opponent, etc.).
They become a runner and Item 1 no longer applies to that player.

And that is EXACTLY what those case plays illustrate.

So let me get this straight. You think that the first two parts of the catch process are conditions of becoming a "receiver". Some term mentioned no where in the rule book.

And then they become a runner by completing the final step.

So when a player goes to the ground, to you, the catch process is completed after the first two acts?

Even though the rule clearly states that in order to complete a catch you have to complete all three acts.

Is this what you mean?

 

[OmerV]

What are you even talking about?

You are the one that jumped into my discussion with Kevin about the case play. That's what we were talking about.

He said the case play where the player comes down with one foot then gets hit and knocked to the ground was all about the football move, and I asked what football move was mentioned in the case play? He's trying to argue that the case play covers any situation where there is a "football move" when there isn't even a football move mentioned in that case play.