Cowboys Have Re-signed Anthony Spencer

[MichaelWinicki]

You and I tend to agree more than disagree and in this situation I think I am just looking at it a little different than you are.

I agree that we need WDE more than SDE in the draft, but if you're talking about a second round player, I like Crichton an awful lot. I don't like Ealy or Tuitt at all, period. Ford and Attaochu I like a lot as well. Either of them would be more than fine with me and maybe would be the smarter move for Dallas, like you say. I am certainly not above having my mind changed.

I didn't list Ford because I think he will be gone in round 1 and since in the example I used Donald as our first, I ruled him out. Attaochu would be good for us in the second and I would be more than happy with Donald and Attaochu in my example with Spencer playing on the strongside.

You also made a good point in a later post than the one I quoted, when you said that although Spencer is the size of a weakside end, that he is stout against the run and his speed/quickness might be lessened because of the microfracture surgery. The Spencer of two years ago, I would play on the weakside... the Spencer we have now might be best at strongside.

So, while I do like Crichton an awful lot and think that he might be the BPA at our pick (and we shouldn't skip a SDE just because we have more people there)... I also like Attaochu a lot and think it would be a good move getting him on the weakside, which I agree is a bigger need.

So, your point is well taken.

I'm inclined to think that they'll leave Spencer on strong-side... He's that good vs the run that I think he needs to stay there if he's capable of contributing. And if healthy he's probably going to give more pass rush from that spot than Crawford, Bass or anyone else on the roster, except for maybe Selvie... But he's better vs the run than Selvie.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

My dream before the draft was Donald and Ford. This was when they were both 2nd round prospects and there was an actual possibility of trading back and getting both of them. I wouldn't mind Crichton but not if it means we don't address WDE at all. I have a feeling our plan is:
1) Hope Donald makes it past Atlanta, NY, Chi.. if not, then
2) Hope Barr makes it to us.. if not, then
3) see if any of the top 3 OTs fall, or maybe Martin, and if not
4) trade back and try to get an extra 2nd or 3rd

I don't see the Cowboys being interested in Ford. More of a 3-4 OLB.

 

[hutch1254]

Not sure if serious.

Edit: Must've forgot to turn on my sarcasm detector this morning.

Sarcasm needs its own font.

 

[Beast_from_East]

Not sure what shape his knee is in, but its good to have resigned him on a 1 year show me deal.

 

[JoeyBoy718]

I don't see the Cowboys being interested in Ford. More of a 3-4 OLB.

I can see that. Though I might say the same about Barr. I doubt guys like Lawrence and Attachou fall to 47. What position do you see Murphy from Stanford playing?

 

[JoeyBoy718]

I'm inclined to think that they'll leave Spencer on strong-side... He's that good vs the run that I think he needs to stay there if he's capable of contributing. And if healthy he's probably going to give more pass rush from that spot than Crawford, Bass or anyone else on the roster, except for maybe Selvie... But he's better vs the run than Selvie.

Yeah, I could see Selvie splitting time at WDE with whoever we draft. I think he's more suited for there anyway.

 

[Kaiser]

I'm inclined to think that they'll leave Spencer on strong-side... He's that good vs the run that I think he needs to stay there if he's capable of contributing. And if healthy he's probably going to give more pass rush from that spot than Crawford, Bass or anyone else on the roster, except for maybe Selvie... But he's better vs the run than Selvie.

I think they leave him on the strong side also, at the moment I think its him and Crawford at SDE with Spencer probably missing a few games early, then being a backup and hopefully starting by the end of the season.

Anything better than that is a bonus and we still draft 3 DL in the draft. The most important part of this move may be the flexibility of Spencer to play strong or weak side, and Crawford to play any of the four DL spots. That flexibility (and having Spencer signed before the draft rather than afterward) greatly increases the number of players that fit into our draft plans.

 

[Kaiser]

Yeah, I could see Selvie splitting time at WDE with whoever we draft. I think he's more suited for there anyway.

That's always been my thought on Selvie. I think was OK as a SDE starter but would be terrific as a WDE backup.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I can see that. Though I might say the same about Barr. I doubt guys like Lawrence and Attachou fall to 47. What position do you see Murphy from Stanford playing?

To me the difference between Barr, Murphy and Ford is the extra 3" of height Barr and Murphy have over Ford. They can carry a little more weight if needed in order to hold up better as a 4-3 DE, even on the weakside.

I'm not saying Ford can't do it, but I haven't seen or heard anything connecting Ford to the Cowboys as of yet.

Even if Lawrence and Attachou don't fall to 47, you still have Kareem Martin, Ealy and maybe even Marcus Smith who could be there.

If they don't get a DE there, they could get Jeffcoat in the 3rd round or maybe Will Clarke.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I think they leave him on the strong side also, at the moment I think its him and Crawford at SDE with Spencer probably missing a few games early, then being a backup and hopefully starting by the end of the season.

Anything better than that is a bonus and we still draft 3 DL in the draft. The most important part of this move may be the flexibility of Spencer to play strong or weak side, and Crawford to play any of the four DL spots. That flexibility (and having Spencer signed before the draft rather than afterward) greatly increases the number of players that fit into our draft plans.

Yeah, I agree with that. Even with Spencer they're going to need to draft at least 3 defensive lineman.

Yep if Spencer is healthy and could contribute say 400 snaps that would be a real bonus.

The flip side is that if a mostly healthy Spencer were able to contribute only say 400 snaps, his stats wouldn't be gaudy which would maybe get the Cowboys another discounted contract in 2015.

 

[AsthmaField]

My dream before the draft was Donald and Ford. This was when they were both 2nd round prospects and there was an actual possibility of trading back and getting both of them. I wouldn't mind Crichton but not if it means we don't address WDE at all. I have a feeling our plan is:
1) Hope Donald makes it past Atlanta, NY, Chi.. if not, then
2) Hope Barr makes it to us.. if not, then
3) see if any of the top 3 OTs fall, or maybe Martin, and if not
4) trade back and try to get an extra 2nd or 3rd

I think that is a pretty close approximation of what they have in mind.

However, I would add one thing to that list: I honestly think they really might have in their mind to move up a little if they have a chance to get Donald. There are a few reasons I think that:

1. I think they learned a harsh lesson in 2009 when Max Unger was dropping down to them as they sat there waiting and he went a couple picks ahead of them. There was also another guy that year who they liked a lot and got taken just before their pick. The following year when Dez was sliding down to Dallas' pick, they knew that Baltimore was probably going to take him if they didn't do something, so they made a move up a few spots to clinch getting Bryant. In the next round, they did the same thing with Sean Lee, moving up a little to insure they got him. The Cowboys liked both players a lot and didn't hesitate to make a move up to make sure they got them. IMO, I think the team likes Donald at least as much as they did Bryant and Lee... maybe more.

2. Fit. If there is a better fit for any player going to any team, I don't know who it could be. If you look at Donald from the angle of physical traits he is exactly what Dallas is looking for in a 3T DT. He is what Marinelli would draw up for that position.

3. Intangibles. Dallas/Garrett has been putting a huge emphasis on character and work ethic and Donald gets straight A's in both of those. Garrett wants players who love football? Check. Who go all out on every play? Check. Someone who plays smart? Check. Someone who plays with heart? Double check.

4. Importance of position. In Rod Marinelli's defense, there is no more important position than the 3-tech DT spot. IMO, that is the position that makes it all go. Take Warren Sapp away from those early 2000's Tampa defenses and I don't think they even get close to a super bowl. He was that important. I think they would have been ok if they lost Simeon Rice. I think they would have been ok if they lost Derrick Brooks. If they lost John Lynch, they would have been ok. They could have dealt with the loss of any one defender except for Warren Sapp. His relentless inside pressure set up the whole defense. Nothing is more bothersome to a QB than pressure right up the middle of the line. The QB can't step into his throws. He can't step up to let the OT push the DE past him. The DT is right in the line of sight for the QB. It just kills the run game when a DT shoots into the backfield. The DE's are way more effective when the DT is penetrating inside. The DB's are way better when there is great inside pressure. What Sapp provided to that defense was incredibly important and Rod Marinelli knows and understands just how important that 3T spot is in his scheme. If Donald was just a good 3T, maybe Marinelli doesn't push to move up and get him... but Donald is a great 3T. I think Marinelli has told the decision makers how important Donald could be and will push hard for them to move up to secure Donald's services.

5. It is getting cheaper and cheaper to move up in drafts. These days the cost just isn't that high unless you're talking about going up for a QB. In this particular draft there are so many teams that are wanting to move down that it will be even less costly than it has been recently. Just a couple of years ago, it only cost Dallas a 2nd round pick to move up 8 spots from 14th to 6th overall. Dallas should be able to move like maybe 5 spots from 16th to around 11th overall for no more than a 3rd round pick. Possibly even less.

I know that most people on this forum don't want to move up to get Donald, but I don't think the team agrees with that. I think they have no trouble using an extra pick or two to secure such a perfect player at such a vital position. There are many ways to do it, and they might even use picks from next year's draft or current players.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I think that is a pretty close approximation of what they have in mind.

However, I would add one thing to that list: I honestly think they really might have in their mind to move up a little if they have a chance to get Donald. There are a few reasons I think that:

1. I think they learned a harsh lesson in 2009 when Max Unger was dropping down to them as they sat there waiting and he went a couple picks ahead of them. There was also another guy that year who they liked a lot and got taken just before their pick. The following year when Dez was sliding down to Dallas' pick, they knew that Baltimore was probably going to take him if they didn't do something, so they made a move up a few spots to clinch getting Bryant. In the next round, they did the same thing with Sean Lee, moving up a little to insure they got him. The Cowboys liked both players a lot and didn't hesitate to make a move up to make sure they got them. IMO, I think the team likes Donald at least as much as they did Bryant and Lee... maybe more.

2. Fit. If there is a better fit for any player going to any team, I don't know who it could be. If you look at Donald from the angle of physical traits he is exactly what Dallas is looking for in a 3T DT. He is what Marinelli would draw up for that position.

3. Intangibles. Dallas/Garrett has been putting a huge emphasis on character and work ethic and Donald gets straight A's in both of those. Garrett wants players who love football? Check. Who go all out on every play? Check. Someone who plays smart? Check. Someone who plays with heart? Double check.

4. Importance of position. In Rod Marinelli's defense, there is no more important position than the 3-tech DT spot. IMO, that is the position that makes it all go. Take Warren Sapp away from those early 2000's Tampa defenses and I don't think they even get close to a super bowl. He was that important. I think they would have been ok if they lost Simeon Rice. I think they would have been ok if they lost Derrick Brooks. If they lost John Lynch, they would have been ok. They could have dealt with the loss of any one defender except for Warren Sapp. His relentless inside pressure set up the whole defense. Nothing is more bothersome to a QB than pressure right up the middle of the line. The QB can't step into his throws. He can't step up to let the OT push the DE past him. The DT is right in the line of sight for the QB. It just kills the run game when a DT shoots into the backfield. The DE's are way more effective when the DT is penetrating inside. The DB's are way better when there is great inside pressure. What Sapp provided to that defense was incredibly important and Rod Marinelli knows and understands just how important that 3T spot is in his scheme. If Donald was just a good 3T, maybe Marinelli doesn't push to move up and get him... but Donald is a great 3T. I think Marinelli has told the decision makers how important Donald could be and will push hard for them to move up to secure Donald's services.

5. It is getting cheaper and cheaper to move up in drafts. These days the cost just isn't that high unless you're talking about going up for a QB. In this particular draft there are so many teams that are wanting to move down that it will be even less costly than it has been recently. Just a couple of years ago, it only cost Dallas a 2nd round pick to move up 8 spots from 14th to 6th overall. Dallas should be able to move like maybe 5 spots from 16th to around 11th overall for no more than a 3rd round pick. Possibly even less.

I know that most people on this forum don't want to move up to get Donald, but I don't think the team agrees with that. I think they have no trouble using an extra pick or two to secure such a perfect player at such a vital position. There are many ways to do it, and they might even use picks from next year's draft or current players.

I'm not convinced that the team is going to have to move up. I'm not sure either the Giants or the Bears are going to draft him.

 

[CF74]

Sounds incentive based:
Woy announced via Twitter that the 30-year-old Spencer reached a one-year deal with the team and can earn as much as $3.5 million in 2014.

http://cowboysblog.***BANNED-URL***...s-re-sign-free-agent-de-anthony-spencer.html/

 

[speedkilz88]

To me the difference between Barr, Murphy and Ford is the extra 3" of height Barr and Murphy have over Ford. They can carry a little more weight if needed in order to hold up better as a 4-3 DE, even on the weakside.

I'm not saying Ford can't do it, but I haven't seen or heard anything connecting Ford to the Cowboys as of yet.

Even if Lawrence and Attachou don't fall to 47, you still have Kareem Martin, Ealy and maybe even Marcus Smith who could be there.

If they don't get a DE there, they could get Jeffcoat in the 3rd round or maybe Will Clarke.

Not a Ford fan in the first either because of his size but BTB is claiming that it leaked today that he did have an official visit.

Also, with news surfacing today that Dee Ford had also been in Dallas for a pre-draft visit, 15 of the 28 players invited for official pre-draft visits are defensive linemen, so the Cowboys are almost certain to pick one or more defensive linemen in the draft in less than two week's time. Though they may not pick as many of those linemen as some fans anticipate.

http://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2014...s-re-sign-de-anthony-spencer-to-one-year-deal

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Not a Ford fan in the first either because of his size but BTB is claiming that it leaked today that he did have an official visit.

http://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2014...s-re-sign-de-anthony-spencer-to-one-year-deal

Ah, OK, then maybe I need to stand corrected. I still think he's a little short.

 

[JoeyBoy718]

I think that is a pretty close approximation of what they have in mind.

However, I would add one thing to that list: I honestly think they really might have in their mind to move up a little if they have a chance to get Donald. There are a few reasons I think that:

1. I think they learned a harsh lesson in 2009 when Max Unger was dropping down to them as they sat there waiting and he went a couple picks ahead of them. There was also another guy that year who they liked a lot and got taken just before their pick. The following year when Dez was sliding down to Dallas' pick, they knew that Baltimore was probably going to take him if they didn't do something, so they made a move up a few spots to clinch getting Bryant. In the next round, they did the same thing with Sean Lee, moving up a little to insure they got him. The Cowboys liked both players a lot and didn't hesitate to make a move up to make sure they got them. IMO, I think the team likes Donald at least as much as they did Bryant and Lee... maybe more.

2. Fit. If there is a better fit for any player going to any team, I don't know who it could be. If you look at Donald from the angle of physical traits he is exactly what Dallas is looking for in a 3T DT. He is what Marinelli would draw up for that position.

3. Intangibles. Dallas/Garrett has been putting a huge emphasis on character and work ethic and Donald gets straight A's in both of those. Garrett wants players who love football? Check. Who go all out on every play? Check. Someone who plays smart? Check. Someone who plays with heart? Double check.

4. Importance of position. In Rod Marinelli's defense, there is no more important position than the 3-tech DT spot. IMO, that is the position that makes it all go. Take Warren Sapp away from those early 2000's Tampa defenses and I don't think they even get close to a super bowl. He was that important. I think they would have been ok if they lost Simeon Rice. I think they would have been ok if they lost Derrick Brooks. If they lost John Lynch, they would have been ok. They could have dealt with the loss of any one defender except for Warren Sapp. His relentless inside pressure set up the whole defense. Nothing is more bothersome to a QB than pressure right up the middle of the line. The QB can't step into his throws. He can't step up to let the OT push the DE past him. The DT is right in the line of sight for the QB. It just kills the run game when a DT shoots into the backfield. The DE's are way more effective when the DT is penetrating inside. The DB's are way better when there is great inside pressure. What Sapp provided to that defense was incredibly important and Rod Marinelli knows and understands just how important that 3T spot is in his scheme. If Donald was just a good 3T, maybe Marinelli doesn't push to move up and get him... but Donald is a great 3T. I think Marinelli has told the decision makers how important Donald could be and will push hard for them to move up to secure Donald's services.

5. It is getting cheaper and cheaper to move up in drafts. These days the cost just isn't that high unless you're talking about going up for a QB. In this particular draft there are so many teams that are wanting to move down that it will be even less costly than it has been recently. Just a couple of years ago, it only cost Dallas a 2nd round pick to move up 8 spots from 14th to 6th overall. Dallas should be able to move like maybe 5 spots from 16th to around 11th overall for no more than a 3rd round pick. Possibly even less.

I know that most people on this forum don't want to move up to get Donald, but I don't think the team agrees with that. I think they have no trouble using an extra pick or two to secure such a perfect player at such a vital position. There are many ways to do it, and they might even use picks from next year's draft or current players.

I'd definitely move up for Donald and nobody else, but I don't think it would take only a 3rd (or maybe less). And hasn't Atlanta (who picks at #5) been considering him? If it took a 2nd to move from 14 to 6 in a much weaker draft, what would it take to move from 16 to 4? Even moving to 10 or 11 would cost a lot. I'm guessing a 3rd and maybe a 4th/5th.

 

[Kaiser]

Sounds incentive based:
Woy announced via Twitter that the 30-year-old Spencer reached a one-year deal with the team and can earn as much as $3.5 million in 2014.

http://cowboysblog.***BANNED-URL***...s-re-sign-free-agent-de-anthony-spencer.html/

\

I like it. This is probably something close to what Waters signed for last year, 1.5MM guaranteed and another 2MM in bonuses (Waters was 1.5 and 1.5)

 

[Beast_from_East]

I'd definitely move up for Donald and nobody else, but I don't think it would take only a 3rd (or maybe less). And hasn't Atlanta (who picks at #5) been considering him? If it took a 2nd to move from 14 to 6 in a much weaker draft, what would it take to move from 16 to 4? Even moving to 10 or 11 would cost a lot. I'm guessing a 3rd and maybe a 4th/5th.

Yea, I don't like the idea of giving picks up with this many holes on the team.

I think we should just stay pat and draft the best guy at 16. If somebody offers a trade back, we should consider that as well. However, we should get more value than we did last year. I don't care about this "new chart", the consensus in the media (even on the Draft Show on DC.com) was that we got raped last year by the 49ers.

 

[AsthmaField]

To me the difference between Barr, Murphy and Ford is the extra 3" of height Barr and Murphy have over Ford. They can carry a little more weight if needed in order to hold up better as a 4-3 DE, even on the weakside.

I'm not saying Ford can't do it, but I haven't seen or heard anything connecting Ford to the Cowboys as of yet.

Even if Lawrence and Attachou don't fall to 47, you still have Kareem Martin, Ealy and maybe even Marcus Smith who could be there.

If they don't get a DE there, they could get Jeffcoat in the 3rd round or maybe Will Clarke.

I like Ford and while I do think his best position might be 34 OLB, I think in Marinelli's scheme he would be ok playing WDE. Last year, Ware didn't have that many run responsibilities in this scheme. I worry some about Ford's lack of length but he is a fantastic athlete and Marinelli can always work with those.

Still, I think there are better first round picks than Ford and he would only be ideal for us if he somehow slid to #47.

As far as the Cowboys showing interest... I know that they interviewed Ford at the Senior Bowl.

 

[jobberone]

I don't see the Cowboys being interested in Ford. More of a 3-4 OLB.

That's probably going to be his story but I think this guy is versatile. I don't see him as the safest pick. I think he can play some rush end, Sam and play in nickel and dime packages as well as be a ST demon. His best position is probably WOLB though as you suggested.