Daniel Jeremiah Mock 1.0 - Wentz at 4

[Alexander]

I agree, gotta roll the dice sometimes.

The teams that are habitual losers are usually the ones swinging for the fences because they have the decision makers with the most to lose. Most are brand new, have very short two-four year windows and a restless fanbase clamoring for results and spark.

Most of them have real GMs and Head Coaches and staffs that know their jobs depend on winning and winning soon, so if they have no QB, they are going to go for it.

I just do not believe Dallas would necessarily feel the same way. There is 100% iron clad job security for our GM and very strong job security for practically any other executive who has a real say in personnel.

We are going to be driven more by other factors, but certainly not fear.

You know, like the GM thinking he looks smart taking this player. Or dumb for risking the top choice who might be outside of the popular court of opinion.

 

[RoboQB]

We should just wait another year, I guess. No Marino or Elway.

What is funny is people actually say this, but in the same breath swear up and down that picking this high in the draft has zero chance of happening again any time soon.

So next year. Or maybe the year after that.

There will be an Elway when we pick 32nd after winning the Super Bowl and Romo retires, riding off into the sunset.

It will work out that way. You'll see.

Maybe I'm being misunderstood.... here's my attempt to clarify... Jared Goff, Paxton Lynch and Carson Wentz do not remind me of the sure fire QB... hence the Elway or Marino comment...
I would prefer to spend a 3rd round pick on a QB prospect this year... Goff will be gone before our pick... Lynch and Wentz are not blue chip prospects.. someone will over-draft Lynch... Wentz may fall to the 2nd...
but hey, if you want Dallas to draft an Akili Smith just because "hey, we need a QB and he's next on the list" then that's fine with me... just as long as you're not the one filling out the draft card.

In 1989, the top of the draft looked like this:
Troy Aikman
Tony Mandrich
Barry Sanders
Deion Sanders
Derrick Thomas

But hey, Green Bay needed an offensive lineman that year, right!?!

 

[texbumthelife]

Talent wise? Probably better than Donald at his position.

Wentz has elite physical traits.

You've got to be kidding me. Are you saying Wentz is a more talented QB than Donald is a DT? Please tell me that's not the statement you're making. You're talking about a one in a generation talent in Donald who was a day one starter and immediate impact difference maker. If I took this out of context I apologize, but I have to clear that up because it's insanity.

 

[tyke1doe]

We should just wait another year, I guess. No Marino or Elway.

What is funny is people actually say this, but in the same breath swear up and down that picking this high in the draft has zero chance of happening again any time soon.

So next year. Or maybe the year after that.

There will be an Elway when we pick 32nd after winning the Super Bowl and Romo retires, riding off into the sunset.

It will work out that way. You'll see.

I can't remember an era that didn't have a big-time quarterback.

I agree with you. These things seem to work themselves out. And the star players always seem to emerge regardless. When Elway, Favre, Aikman, Montana, Young were on their last legs, here come Brees, Brady, Manning (both), Rothlisberger, Rodgers, Romo, etc. Now that Brady, Manning (Peyton), Romo and Brees are nearing the end of their careers, here come Cam, Russell Wilson, Luck, Winston, etc.

There will always be elite quarterbacks in this league, especially with the way the rules favor the passing game.

Find your guy, and you're set for a decade.

 

[CATCH17]

Maybe I'm being misunderstood.... here's my attempt to clarify... Jared Goff, Paxton Lynch and Carson Wentz do not remind me of the sure fire QB... hence the Elway or Marino comment...
I would prefer to spend a 3rd round pick on a QB prospect this year... Goff will be gone before our pick... Lynch and Wentz are not blue chip prospects.. someone will over-draft Lynch... Wentz may fall to the 2nd...
but hey, if you want Dallas to draft an Akili Smith just because "hey, we need a QB and he's next on the list" then that's fine with me... just as long as you're not the one filling out the draft card.

In 1989, the top of the draft looked like this:
Troy Aikman
Tony Mandrich
Barry Sanders
Deion Sanders
Derrick Thomas

But hey, Green Bay needed an offensive lineman that year, right!?!

I would rather not draft a QB this year than waste a 3rd on down.

Just get a vet that can improvise.


Imo, Wentz will be worth the pick and I don't think he is an Akili Smith type.

If you can't teach a guy with these tools to play in the NFL then you shouldn't be coaching.

I think with a stud OL and Romo helping to bring him along that we could hit big on this pick.

If this guy played at a big D1 school I doubt we'd ever have a chance at him at #4 and by the time the draft gets here he may go 2 to Cleveland.

 

[CATCH17]

You've got to be kidding me. Are you saying Wentz is a more talented QB than Donald is a DT? Please tell me that's not the statement you're making. You're talking about a one in a generation talent in Donald who was a day one starter and immediate impact difference maker. If I took this out of context I apologize, but I have to clear that up because it's insanity.

We see defensive tackles all the time with a great skill set.

Very rarely do you see a QB with all the traits that Wentz has.

The size, quick release, mobile, zip and accuracy on the toughest passes.

 

[RoboQB]

If you're looking for Elway or Marino then no point drafting a QB, let's draft kennan Reynolds and run the navy offense.

We drafted a guy from Navy once that turned out okay..... I'm just stating that the talent level at QB isn't high enough to warrant a 4th overall pick... I will revisit this after the combine and pro days.

 

[reddyuta]

We drafted a guy from Navy once that turned out okay..... I'm just stating that the talent level at QB isn't high enough to warrant a 4th overall pick... I will revisit this after the combine and pro days.

If our scouts feel the same then they should not draft a QB at 4, if they are wrong then Jerry should fire the entire scouting department stArting from Mcclay because we just passed on our next franchise QB.

 

[tyke1doe]

Maybe I'm being misunderstood.... here's my attempt to clarify... Jared Goff, Paxton Lynch and Carson Wentz do not remind me of the sure fire QB... hence the Elway or Marino comment...
I would prefer to spend a 3rd round pick on a QB prospect this year... Goff will be gone before our pick... Lynch and Wentz are not blue chip prospects.. someone will over-draft Lynch... Wentz may fall to the 2nd...
but hey, if you want Dallas to draft an Akili Smith just because "hey, we need a QB and he's next on the list" then that's fine with me... just as long as you're not the one filling out the draft card.

In 1989, the top of the draft looked like this:
Troy Aikman
Tony Mandrich
Barry Sanders
Deion Sanders
Derrick Thomas

But hey, Green Bay needed an offensive lineman that year, right!?!

Uh, no.

Mandrich was considered a once-in-life-time prospect.

Even Jimmy Johnson said he was tempted to take Mandrich.

But the quarterback is the most important person on the field because he touches the ball every offensive play. And Aikman was considered a franchise quarterback.

Had the Cowboys not selected Aikman, the Packers would have taken him.

 

[texbumthelife]

We see defensive tackles all the time with a great skill set.

Very rarely do you see a QB with all the traits that Wentz has.

The size, quick release, mobile, zip and accuracy on the toughest passes.

Talent wise, you see DT's like Aaron Donald all the time? I must be living under a rock...

 

[CATCH17]

Talent wise, you see DT's like Aaron Donald all the time? I must be living under a rock...

I think it's easy now to say we don't see DTs with Donald's talent all the time because of the success he has had in the NFL.


As good as Donald is the skills Wentz possesses are rare.

 

[texbumthelife]

I think it's easy now to say we don't see DTs with Donald's talent all the time because of the success he has had in the NFL.


As good as Donald is the skills Wentz possesses are rare.

You're dramatically overhyping this kid. He doesn't have a Favre, Elway or Aaron Rodgers type arm. He doesn't show a great ability to read a defense. His accuracy is spotty. His skills are not rare, for the QB position, in any way.

He has great athleticism, but so did Akili Smith. He's tall and has a good build, but so does Brandon Weeden. Ryan Leaf had incredible physical tools, maybe better than Wentz. Wentz is not some generational type of talent. He's got some good tape and a chance to be a good player. He is going to need a ton of work though.

For the record, there were numerous scouts and quite a few people on this forum, myself included, who thought Aaron Donald was a generational type talent before he was drafted.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

Maybe I'm being misunderstood.... here's my attempt to clarify... Jared Goff, Paxton Lynch and Carson Wentz do not remind me of the sure fire QB... hence the Elway or Marino comment...
I would prefer to spend a 3rd round pick on a QB prospect this year... Goff will be gone before our pick... Lynch and Wentz are not blue chip prospects.. someone will over-draft Lynch... Wentz may fall to the 2nd...
but hey, if you want Dallas to draft an Akili Smith just because "hey, we need a QB and he's next on the list" then that's fine with me... just as long as you're not the one filling out the draft card.

In 1989, the top of the draft looked like this:
Troy Aikman
Tony Mandrich
Barry Sanders
Deion Sanders
Derrick Thomas

But hey, Green Bay needed an offensive lineman that year, right!?!

My counter to this would be, I also don't see a Tony Mandrish (was a great prospect, even though he did not make it as a pro), Barry Sanders, Deion Sanders, or Derrick Thomas.

Laremy Tunsil is the best prospect if you want to make that case, but I would not consider him as an elite prospect. I think he's been very good at Ole Miss, has started a solid amount of games (25 I think) and looks the part. Maybe if he were 6-7 with 36 inch arms, he'd be in that category.

Joey Bosa is not Derrick Thomas, he just isn't. 52 career sacks (with a high of 27) vs 26 career sacks (high of 13.5).

Jalen Ramsey is not Deion Sanders, not even close here. He's a good cover guy, but there aren't many DBs who go top 5 that do not force turnovers.

Not sure who else everyone is hot for, but imo, this is not a draft with many elite prospects, even if you want a recent example, every non QB taken in 2011 has just about made an all pro team. That draft was stacked and we did not see fans clamoring for a QB, whether it be Locker or Gabbert. Most wanted either Tyron Smith, Patrick Peterson (if he fell) or JJ Watt (earlier in the process Cam Jordan was popular as well). This draft does not even compare to that one.

 

[StylisticS]

You talk about a new set of triplets. Eli, OBJ AND Elliott?

That's all their missing on offense. A good running game.

 

[Irvin88_4life]

You talk about a new set of triplets. Eli, OBJ AND Elliott?

Don't even want to think about it

 

[Irvin88_4life]

My counter to this would be, I also don't see a Tony Mandrish (was a great prospect, even though he did not make it as a pro), Barry Sanders, Deion Sanders, or Derrick Thomas.

Laremy Tunsil is the best prospect if you want to make that case, but I would not consider him as an elite prospect. I think he's been very good at Ole Miss, has started a solid amount of games (25 I think) and looks the part. Maybe if he were 6-7 with 36 inch arms, he'd be in that category.

Joey Bosa is not Derrick Thomas, he just isn't. 52 career sacks (with a high of 27) vs 26 career sacks (high of 13.5).

Jalen Ramsey is not Deion Sanders, not even close here. He's a good cover guy, but there aren't many DBs who go top 5 that do not force turnovers.

Not sure who else everyone is hot for, but imo, this is not a draft with many elite prospects, even if you want a recent example, every non QB taken in 2011 has just about made an all pro team. That draft was stacked and we did not see fans clamoring for a QB, whether it be Locker or Gabbert. Most wanted either Tyron Smith, Patrick Peterson (if he fell) or JJ Watt (earlier in the process Cam Jordan was popular as well). This draft does not even compare to that one.

I see Ramsey as a safety not a CB. Hargreaves is most likely the best corner

 

[RoboQB]

Uh, no.

Mandrich was considered a once-in-life-time prospect.

Even Jimmy Johnson said he was tempted to take Mandrich.

But the quarterback is the most important person on the field because he touches the ball every offensive play. And Aikman was considered a franchise quarterback.

Had the Cowboys not selected Aikman, the Packers would have taken him.

you're missing my point entirely... pertaining to this upcoming draft, I would not risk the 4th pick on a QB unless he rated very high like Aikman or Elway or Manning...
I'll try a different reference for you... Heath Shuler and Trent Dilfer were the top two QBs in their draft... one, a flat out bust... the other, a journeyman... they were top 5 picks...
neither were rated or graded out very high but their respective teams needed a QB and they were tops on the list....Do not draft a QB FIRST unless he can justify the pick by grading
out as such.

 

[tyke1doe]

Don't even want to think about it

That would be just lethal.

 

[RoboQB]

My counter to this would be, I also don't see a Tony Mandrish (was a great prospect, even though he did not make it as a pro), Barry Sanders, Deion Sanders, or Derrick Thomas.

Laremy Tunsil is the best prospect if you want to make that case, but I would not consider him as an elite prospect. I think he's been very good at Ole Miss, has started a solid amount of games (25 I think) and looks the part. Maybe if he were 6-7 with 36 inch arms, he'd be in that category.

Joey Bosa is not Derrick Thomas, he just isn't. 52 career sacks (with a high of 27) vs 26 career sacks (high of 13.5).

Jalen Ramsey is not Deion Sanders, not even close here. He's a good cover guy, but there aren't many DBs who go top 5 that do not force turnovers.

Not sure who else everyone is hot for, but imo, this is not a draft with many elite prospects, even if you want a recent example, every non QB taken in 2011 has just about made an all pro team. That draft was stacked and we did not see fans clamoring for a QB, whether it be Locker or Gabbert. Most wanted either Tyron Smith, Patrick Peterson (if he fell) or JJ Watt (earlier in the process Cam Jordan was popular as well). This draft does not even compare to that one.

If the QBs grade out or rate to justify a top 5 pick in the draft, and your guy is their, draft him... but don't pick one just for the sake of picking one.... I don't think these QBs rate high enough for a top 5 pick... and Goff will be gone
before we pick anyway... so, there goes the best of a weak group.

 

[tyke1doe]

you're missing my point entirely... pertaining to this upcoming draft, I would not risk the 4th pick on a QB unless he rated very high like Aikman or Elway or Manning...
I'll try a different reference for you... Heath Shuler and Trent Dilfer were the top two QBs in their draft... one, a flat out bust... the other, a journeyman... they were top 5 picks...
neither were rated or graded out very high but their respective teams needed a QB and they were tops on the list....Do not draft a QB FIRST unless he can justify the pick by grading
out as such.

Fair enough.

But weren't Shuler and Dilfer pushed into early service?

I think a lot of times these top quarterbacks flame out because they're not properly groomed and rushed into service too quickly.

That's probably why I favor picking one high now. If we were in a situation where Romo wasn't available, and we had to pick his replacement from this lot, then I'd more likely agree with you. I don't think Goff, Lynch or Wentz are ready to start out of the gate.

However, a year or two (max) learning behind a veteran ala Aaron Rodgers? Yeah, I'm okay with that.

I know we have a lot of holes, but I think we need to prepare for the future. Excluding coaching (and I don't want to argue that here), I think this team is building the right way, i.e., in the trenches. I think you build there and get your quarterback - which ever is easiest or most available.

I honestly believe aside from coaching, this team simply needs bellcow running back and maybe a defensive playmaker whether on the line, linebacker or secondary. I think those three elements (including the ready-to-take-over quarterback-for-Romo both as a backup and as a future prospect) are what this team needs to get back on track. Well, those elements (future-QB/backup QB, bell cow running back, one more defensive playmaker) and health.