ESPNews: Jason Garrett Top Candidate

[iceberg]

So he as altered the way he does things huh? You mean like learning from his mistakes with the salery cap and how he handles coaches?

Like that?

Yet you say he is just like he was under Campo again .....



You are chasing you're tail buddy.

hasn't our side of the discussion been that jones has learned and altered things? hasn't his stance been jones is only responsible for the bad, not the good, that has been done under his ownership?

see spot spin. spin spot spin.

people let emotions guide facts far too often.

 

[Dave_in-NC]

It was a long time ago and I'm much older now but I do remember that the riff between Jones and Jimmy was about ego. As I recall they both had pretty good ones.

The problem with this argument is that after Jimmy's ego left Joneses ego failed. I guess when two big egos are involved it's better than Joneses ego all by its self.

 

[VA Cowboy]

So he as altered the way he does things huh? You mean like learning from his mistakes with the salery cap and how he handles coaches?

Like that?

Yet you say he is just like he was under Campo again .....



You are chasing you're tail buddy.

Did he hire assistant coaches when Gailey and Campo were here?

Did he just hire an assistant now despite us not having a HC?

How is that not the same?

C'mon, try to keep up. It's not brain surgery... Is that similar to what he did then? A simple yes or no will suffice.

 

[iceberg]

It was a long time ago and I'm much older now but I do remember that the riff between Jones and Jimmy was about ego. As I recall they both had pretty good ones.

The problem with this argument is that after Jimmy's ego left Joneses ego failed. I guess when two big egos are involved it's better than Joneses ego all by its self.

well i think they made a great team for a little while. as success grew, so did desire to be noted for that vs. what we all wish would have happened, group acceptance of the success. i think johnson was a huge part of our success, but so was jones, so were the assistants at the time - we formed a good team not only on the field but on the sidelines.

ego blew it up. if only 1 person had an ego then it can't cause this type of harm, so i put both to blame but a slight nod/edge to jones for being the first to lip off about it.

in the end texas stadium just wasn't big enough for the both of them. one person owned the team, one helped build it - ownership usually always wins.

most of us fully recognize jones failures and shortcomings. but we don't simply dwell ONLY on those and do whatever it takes to minimize any recognition he may get for his success yet, they're there all the way to point out failures.

how much jones has learned in the last decade is about to become clear. i'll wait and see before i worry too much about it and see if my own feelings that smart people will in the end do smart things rings true.

 

[VA Cowboy]

you said jimmy was responsible for the early wins. not jones.
you said parcells had to clean up a mess caused by jones - to a degree, quite true. but again, allows leeway for your guys and none for people *not* your guys.

so - in essence you credit johnson for the winning years and parcells for cleaning up the jones bad dark years, but no credit to jones for ANY good this franchise has accomplished.

Did Jimmy and Bill have more control over personnel than Barry/Chan/Campo?

It's as easy as that...yes or no?

 

[Dave_in-NC]

hasn't our side of the discussion been that jones has learned and altered things? hasn't his stance been jones is only responsible for the bad, not the good, that has been done under his ownership?

see spot spin. spin spot spin.

people let emotions guide facts far too often.

We have to be fifty fifty at the very least in the "Jones altered" category.
That is a fact of the first years he was owner, then he went stupid. Then he reverted for the last four years.

So are we sure he isn't going back to stupid? I don't think we can say he will remain altered until the next season or two. I see sure signs of stupid on the horizon.

 

[mwmilsted]

ESPN News now says that Garrett has been hired as the Boys' OC.

 

[zrinkill]

The problem with this argument is that after Jimmy's ego left Joneses ego failed. I guess when two big egos are involved it's better than Joneses ego all by its self.

Uhhh Jerry won a Superbowl

Jimmy Left his Miami job a failure

Who's ego failed?

 

[iceberg]

Did he hire assistant coaches when Gailey and Campo were here?

Did he just hire an assistant now despite us not having a HC?

How is that not the same?

C'mon, try to keep up. It's not brain surgery... Is that similar to what he did then? A simple yes or no will suffice.

sure it is. on the surface and in what we know now. but what else does he have planned? what other conversations has he had you simply don't know about cause you're not in his pocket 24x7. you're taking 1 event, equating it to another bad event, and saying the outcome will be the same and dismissing the 10 years in between.

maybe jones is that stupid. or, maybe he's not and people just hate him enough to always paint him that way cause it makes THEM feel better.

 

[iceberg]

Did Jimmy and Bill have more control over personnel than Barry/Chan/Campo?

It's as easy as that...yes or no?

before we keep spinning on this playground toy - what is your end point? so far it seems to keep changing and i'm tired of chasing it around.

do you give jones any credit for success while johnson was here?

 

[zrinkill]

C'mon, try to keep up. It's not brain surgery... Is that similar to what he did then? A simple yes or no will suffice.

Its similiar to what he did each time he got a coach ....

He gave Zimmer an extension right before Parcells was hired .... how is that not the same?

 

[VA Cowboy]

Uhhh Jerry won a Superbowl

Jimmy Left his Miami job a failure

Who's ego failed?

Jerry did a great job taking winning a SB with the mess Jimmy left behind.

Yeah, Jerry really showed 'em.

 

[Da Hammer]

i'm still not warming up to the idea of having Garrett as our HC. Maybe in 3 years but right now i think he's too unexperienced. Yes i know some have had success without much experience but most of them fail. As for OC i love him there

 

[iceberg]

We have to be fifty fifty at the very least in the "Jones altered" category.
That is a fact of the first years he was owner, then he went stupid. Then he reverted for the last four years.

So are we sure he isn't going back to stupid? I don't think we can say he will remain altered until the next season or two. I see sure signs of stupid on the horizon.

hey - i saw signs of "we'll never win with parcells" on the horizon years ago, so i understand where you're coming from, nc.

i just wanna give jones some time (parcells had a year and a half before i hated him) before i condem his actions of today. i want to see his entire plan and not draw instant analogies to past failure as if that's the ONLY way we can go now.

 

[zrinkill]

Jerry did a great job taking winning a SB with the mess Jimmy left behind.

Yeah, Jerry really showed 'em.

But if only Jimmy was the Mastermind behind the 90's superteam ..... why could he not replicate that in Miami?

If Jerry had nothing to do with it ..... why did Jimmy fail alone?

Remember this is not Brain Surgery ....

 

[VA Cowboy]

Its similiar to what he did each time he got a coach ....

He gave Zimmer an extension right before Parcells was hired .... how is that not the same?

You claim I'm cherrypicking when all I've said is that Jimmy and BP were the primary decision-makers when they were here while the same can't be said for Barry/Chan/Campo.

I'm still waiting for you to answer: Did Jimmy and BP have more control than Barry/Chan/Campo???

 

[iceberg]

You claim I'm cherrypicking when all I've said is that Jimmy and BP were the primary decision-makers when they were here while the same can't be said for Barry/Chan/Campo.

I'm still waiting for you to answer: Did Jimmy and BP have more control than Barry/Chan/Campo???

does jones get any credit for the good years from you?

we can do this all day - but since you're not even trying to see what we're saying, i'm out. got things to do now.

 

[BulletBob]

You Jerry kool-aid drinkers are trip. You want to credit him for the Super Bowls that were won when Jimmy ran things and then downplay the horrible downfall after he took over the reigns.

Unlike you, who want to credit Jerry for all of the downturns in the team's history, and downplay his effect on the team when things were good.

Hello, pot? It's the kettle calling ...

Hey guys, wanna see the goal posts move again?

VA, answer me this question ... when Switzer was coach, was Jerry or Barry primarily responsible for the Super Bowl Win?

 

[iceberg]

Unlike you, who want to credit Jerry for all of the downturns in the team's history, and downplay his effect on the team when things were good.

Hello, pot? It's the kettle calling ...

Hey guys, wanna see the goal posts move again?

VA, answer me this question ... when Switzer was coach, was Jerry or Barry primarily responsible for the Super Bowl Win?

silly question - the answer is still jimmy. : )

 

[VA Cowboy]

But if only Jimmy was the Mastermind behind the 90's superteam ..... why could he not replicate that in Miami?

If Jerry had nothing to do with it ..... why did Jimmy fail alone?

Remember this is not Brain Surgery ....

So you're saying Jerry was the missing piece and Jimmy wouldn't have failed if Jerry had gone to Miami with him???