Here's The Latest T.O. Update I've Received
- Thread starter CaptainAmerica
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JackMagist
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LOL sorry Rack...just responding in kindRack said:
Calicowboy
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Hey I have a brilliant idea, let's sign T.O! We'll sign him to an incentive laden contract. He'll be on his best behavior to prove his naysayers wrong and resume his role in the spotlight! He'll change his ways, he has to, he has no other option! ...
BRILLIANT!!
Disclaimer: Please read the above post with sarcasm. I hope nobody on here believes the 32yr old T.O will change to benefit anybody else, BUT T.O.
BRILLIANT!!
Disclaimer: Please read the above post with sarcasm. I hope nobody on here believes the 32yr old T.O will change to benefit anybody else, BUT T.O.
MONT17
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yeah the COWBOYS love trading for those guys who get KICKED off teams... I tell ya one thing if they gave Philly a cup of coffe for MeO I would have called in a POSTAL THREAT! Because my brother in law is looks like NEWMAN!
I'm tried and I have MeO on the brain!
look this is the last thing before the sand man gets me... this is what I wanna dream about before the cheerleader Chad Johnson proposed to... I want NO TEAM to cave into MeO... I want him to think he is going to sit out mini camp and training camp before he signs and realize NO ONE wants him!
teams have got to be strong coaches and GMs...Fans we have to stand up to this guy because we will always have players HIJAKING this league with " well if the can cut me I can ask for more money".... I dont know about u guys but this guys next move is to walk out of a game or not show up for a game... I see it in him!!! unless you make his grandmother the asst. Wrs coach I say let him sit!!!!
I hope Jerry goes out and trades for Walker or signs a player like MOULDS resign Meyshawn.... whatever but put this guy in his place....
godnight and I hope noone has MeO nightmares...
I'm tried and I have MeO on the brain!
look this is the last thing before the sand man gets me... this is what I wanna dream about before the cheerleader Chad Johnson proposed to... I want NO TEAM to cave into MeO... I want him to think he is going to sit out mini camp and training camp before he signs and realize NO ONE wants him!
teams have got to be strong coaches and GMs...Fans we have to stand up to this guy because we will always have players HIJAKING this league with " well if the can cut me I can ask for more money".... I dont know about u guys but this guys next move is to walk out of a game or not show up for a game... I see it in him!!! unless you make his grandmother the asst. Wrs coach I say let him sit!!!!
I hope Jerry goes out and trades for Walker or signs a player like MOULDS resign Meyshawn.... whatever but put this guy in his place....
godnight and I hope noone has MeO nightmares...
Rogerthat12
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ackMagist]While I agree that the NFL is not an institution that is particularly conducive to ethical behavior I would contend that there are generally accepted norms that players (agents et al) are expected to operate within. I think it is safe to say that Owens has operated well outside of these norms (standards if you will) otherwise we would likely not be having this discussion.
[/B]First,the issue is that you cannot expect to ground a valid TO criticism on money matters in some type of general type of appeal to "ethics" which begs the question who's ethics? Something being "conducive" to an abstract notion of "ethics" is meaningless to this discussion on those terms. However, there are some general policies and standards in place, though not precise and established enough that can be understood as NFL community standards. However, this in no way should be understood as abstract notion of civic "ethical standards" as defined by those outside the league.
The problem is that there are not generally practiced "norms" (abstract) by which all players, owners and agents follow on a regular basis. There are some disciplinary measures provided for certain offenses but then there are gross offenses that are overlooked. You are correct in admitting the NFL is not "conducive" to some type of "ethical behavior" because the genesis of modern notions of the game do not reflect civil soceity as in 1950's culture. Perhaps they once did but instead the modern NFL has its own culture of owners, players and agents that reflect the materialism that many in our contemporary civil soceity covet at large.
Look at Karl Poston's offenses, Randy Moss' Agents activities and even Drew Rosenhaus in the TO matter. Look at Jevon Walker and Culpepper demanding to be cut or traded with the threat of not playing if they do get their way. Look at owners cutting players they are contractually committed to simply to circumvent the cap ramifications though not based on performance or worth. Look at older players cut for their age or because a better option comes forth even though they signed long deals. The committed to a contract notion should work both ways to a reasonable measure to avoid these issues but obviously does not.
The well oiled Captialistic machine seeks to entertain and celebrate success in play and financial gain It is within this culture of glory and cash that many players and owners find mutual success and tension (see the CBA negotiations). I already mentioned how teams can arbitrarily terminate an agreed upon "contract" that they also committed to but that rarely is raised as somehow problematic. Conversely, a player who excells and out performs a time-sensitive contract should not expect some type of reward? The incentives could be a way around this but the contract should be binding on BOTH parties if tension is to be eliminated.
In the case of TO, he was disciplined within the context of the NFL rules that are in place but many times those associated with or guilty of acts such as rape, lude sexual acts, suspicion of covering up murder, spousal abuse and repeated drug abuse are somehow given a slap on the wrist for such henious and detestable "civil" violations. Occassionally, the NFL addresses the matters but it is not with regularity on some of these matters. I do think TO went way too far and should of handled his dispute in a more appropriate manner to be sure but certainly there are much greater offenses that occur that do not receive the same attention that they should accordingly.
The NFL players, owners and organizations should determine not only general but specific "ethical" standards with regard to business operations, contract stipulations and owner/player relations to avoid the TO type episodes. The reason we are having this discussion is precisely because these matters need to be but have not been properly addressed substantially speaking and this leads to tensions often in contractual discussions.
I contend that it is necessary that even within the cutthroat world of professional sports there has to be standards of ethical behavior. And these standards must be adhered to in order to prevent the collapse of the entire institution. It is therefore incumbent upon the institution (both labor and management) to uphold a degree integrity by not allowing a single player (even a very talented one like Owens) to undermine those standards. They can do this by simply not offering him a contract and send a message to the rest of the players that they can push only so far.
I certainly agree with your point if you define "ethical behavior" in relationship to NFL community standards but you do realize your qualification of the context "cutthroat world" somewhat undermines your appeal to "ethical behavior" to a degree. It is a different world than our civil soceity to a large degree where many Billionares and Millionares abound with much ego and arrogance of players, agents, owners and coaches. There are some NFL community standards in place but I would venture to say they need to be further defined, implemented to ALL parties and furthermore actually practiced. These standards apply to not just a single player but to all players, agents, owners, coaches and officials without preference or difference.
We can only hope that the league (through the individual teams) will see it this way. We should hope this for the good of the future of the league.
I agree completely but must say "bold is not better"...lol.:laugh2::laugh1:
[/B]First,the issue is that you cannot expect to ground a valid TO criticism on money matters in some type of general type of appeal to "ethics" which begs the question who's ethics? Something being "conducive" to an abstract notion of "ethics" is meaningless to this discussion on those terms. However, there are some general policies and standards in place, though not precise and established enough that can be understood as NFL community standards. However, this in no way should be understood as abstract notion of civic "ethical standards" as defined by those outside the league.
The problem is that there are not generally practiced "norms" (abstract) by which all players, owners and agents follow on a regular basis. There are some disciplinary measures provided for certain offenses but then there are gross offenses that are overlooked. You are correct in admitting the NFL is not "conducive" to some type of "ethical behavior" because the genesis of modern notions of the game do not reflect civil soceity as in 1950's culture. Perhaps they once did but instead the modern NFL has its own culture of owners, players and agents that reflect the materialism that many in our contemporary civil soceity covet at large.
Look at Karl Poston's offenses, Randy Moss' Agents activities and even Drew Rosenhaus in the TO matter. Look at Jevon Walker and Culpepper demanding to be cut or traded with the threat of not playing if they do get their way. Look at owners cutting players they are contractually committed to simply to circumvent the cap ramifications though not based on performance or worth. Look at older players cut for their age or because a better option comes forth even though they signed long deals. The committed to a contract notion should work both ways to a reasonable measure to avoid these issues but obviously does not.
The well oiled Captialistic machine seeks to entertain and celebrate success in play and financial gain It is within this culture of glory and cash that many players and owners find mutual success and tension (see the CBA negotiations). I already mentioned how teams can arbitrarily terminate an agreed upon "contract" that they also committed to but that rarely is raised as somehow problematic. Conversely, a player who excells and out performs a time-sensitive contract should not expect some type of reward? The incentives could be a way around this but the contract should be binding on BOTH parties if tension is to be eliminated.
In the case of TO, he was disciplined within the context of the NFL rules that are in place but many times those associated with or guilty of acts such as rape, lude sexual acts, suspicion of covering up murder, spousal abuse and repeated drug abuse are somehow given a slap on the wrist for such henious and detestable "civil" violations. Occassionally, the NFL addresses the matters but it is not with regularity on some of these matters. I do think TO went way too far and should of handled his dispute in a more appropriate manner to be sure but certainly there are much greater offenses that occur that do not receive the same attention that they should accordingly.
The NFL players, owners and organizations should determine not only general but specific "ethical" standards with regard to business operations, contract stipulations and owner/player relations to avoid the TO type episodes. The reason we are having this discussion is precisely because these matters need to be but have not been properly addressed substantially speaking and this leads to tensions often in contractual discussions.
I contend that it is necessary that even within the cutthroat world of professional sports there has to be standards of ethical behavior. And these standards must be adhered to in order to prevent the collapse of the entire institution. It is therefore incumbent upon the institution (both labor and management) to uphold a degree integrity by not allowing a single player (even a very talented one like Owens) to undermine those standards. They can do this by simply not offering him a contract and send a message to the rest of the players that they can push only so far.
I certainly agree with your point if you define "ethical behavior" in relationship to NFL community standards but you do realize your qualification of the context "cutthroat world" somewhat undermines your appeal to "ethical behavior" to a degree. It is a different world than our civil soceity to a large degree where many Billionares and Millionares abound with much ego and arrogance of players, agents, owners and coaches. There are some NFL community standards in place but I would venture to say they need to be further defined, implemented to ALL parties and furthermore actually practiced. These standards apply to not just a single player but to all players, agents, owners, coaches and officials without preference or difference.
We can only hope that the league (through the individual teams) will see it this way. We should hope this for the good of the future of the league.
I agree completely but must say "bold is not better"...lol.:laugh2::laugh1:
Rogerthat12
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Rack said:
Who cares Rack..you are tolerated just as many others I am sure bold type does not hurt your feelings. I mean like your signature and general attitude do not irritate many of us.
Rack
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ROYDESTROY said:
Yes, I'm sure my sig annoys many people here.
And my feelings have nothing to do with it. It's my f'in eyes that do get "hurt" though.
How about this, why don't you do the entire forum a favor and quit f'in bolding every one of your f'in posts.
Zaxor
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Rack said:Yes, I'm sure my sig annoys many people here.
And my feelings have nothing to do with it. It's my f'in eyes that do get "hurt" though.
How about this, why don't you do the entire forum a favor and quit f'in bolding every one of your f'in posts.
I would like that too...its okay to emphasis a word or two...but it is too much man...I really have enjoyed your posts in the past but to be honest I haven"t read a one since you went to bold...some of our eyes are not what they once were
Woods
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I've got to think that JJ/BP would be (at least a bit) upset if they thought they had a deal with TO and now he's wants more money.
The big positive, IMO, is that JJ/BP can focus on re-signing Key, trading for Walker, etc., etc. and hopefully move on.
I don't think we would have paid for Givens, Randel El contract anyways whether we were after TO or not. . . . so it's not like we've lost players we would have signed over this past week.
The big positive, IMO, is that JJ/BP can focus on re-signing Key, trading for Walker, etc., etc. and hopefully move on.
I don't think we would have paid for Givens, Randel El contract anyways whether we were after TO or not. . . . so it's not like we've lost players we would have signed over this past week.
SultanOfSix
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Is this news shocking? TO's problem has always been about the money and not being paid what he's worth. He's a top three receiver in the NFL. He expects to be paid like one. How would you feel if people who performed at a lesser level than you got paid more than you? You wouldn't be happy about it. All these overinflated valued contracts in the current free agency market has caused this issue.
Hoov
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SultanOfSix said:
True about him getting paid less than players he outperformed. The main issue is how he handled it, it just shows everyone the lengths that he will go to if he feels pressed. Wonder if things would have gone differently had the eagles made some adjustment or met him halfway.
zenzen
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The irony is, it's his very 'knuckleheadness' that makes him such a talented player.JackMagist said:
A lot of the most successful athletes in the world reach that status because they have an unhealthy psychological pathology. They are driven by an intensity of fear much greater than your average (psychologically and skill-wise) player. And this intensity, when brought to training, practice or competition, allows them to push past normal barriers with fear as their motivator.
Having a player like this on your team is a double-edged sword. You get their skill, but also their pathology.
Sometimes it works out (Chicago Bulls), sometimes it doesn't (Philadelphia Eagles).
The real issue is that these individuals need help. The American sporting arena and culture only feeds, strenthens and supports the fear.
Jarv
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dmq said:Yeah, lets sign TO to a contract that is less than what he thinks he deserves. That'll never blow up in our face.
My thoughts exactly. We can low ball him then pay for it later...Probably when we really need him.
Sometimes the best thing to do is walk away from a deal.