I do not see any difference between that play and the Dez play in 2014 *merged*

[MarcusRock]

Because if they can't see any act occurring other than someone simply falling to the ground, one has to question their competence.


You have to go by the 2014 rule that was actually in place at the time. If you can count that there were two hands on the ball at the time it was controlled, and 1 hand on the ball afterward, you can see that an act common to the game of football just happened there. If you can count steps, you can see that another act common to the game has occurred.

The standard in 2014 was "perform any act" common to the game, and obviously Blandino should have had to address these acts, although he actually only addressed one -- the reach.

So you're saying that Steratore, Pereira, and Blandino all missed football moves even though they're hired to do nothing but interpret the rules? Gotcha.

Again, when going to the ground applies, number of steps do not matter. Where in the rules, old or new, does switching hands equal a football move? Tucking the ball is in the new rules but Dez didn't do that either. He took one hand off the ball and left it out where it came loose.

 

[robertfchew]

Ertz had possession crossing the goal line. To me that was an easy touchdown. Dez's was more complicated to me. He fumbled the ball before ever reaching the goal line. Looking at the Dez not touchdown you can either call it incomplete, or a completion or fumbled at the 1 foot line. It could have went either way.

If dez fumbled then ertz fumbled. Dez had established possession no matter how they spin the rule. The ball popped up and was caught it was identical. You cannot justify this

 

[robertfchew]

There was not sufficient evidence to overturn the call on the field on either play. I don't know if Dez caught it or not, but it was too close to overturn the call on the field. The play last night looked like a clear TD to me. He caught the ball, was clearly a runner with possession and broke the plane.

Its subjective and he did not maintain so therefore its not a score.

 

[MarcusRock]

The problem with you and others is you are trying so hard to deny the flat out incompetence of the refs. You are so afraid to see their botched and inconsistent calls because youre afraid you might realize that its fixed and go through the same pain when you realized wrestling was fake. They can't force one team to win but its obvious they steer the games and story line

And by the way, let me say on record that if the NFL is fixed I don't care so it won't cause me any pain. Just don't tell me the ending before it happens, lol. I don't bet on games so it won't affect me. Just give me a good show and I'm good. I have more important things to worry about. Everything in its place.

 

[TwoDeep3]

Using the gear at the bottom right of the video, you can select speed and slow this down to half speed and still understand the audio. (Edit: you will need to look up the video and not just click on this and allow it to take you to YouTube to slow down the video.)

Dez grabbed the ball.
As Dez came down his right ankle hit the defenders leg.
Regardless of the fact if Dez was lunging at the goal line, or Dez was falling forward, he was still a receiver. That means he has to establish control to the very end. At this point the ground can cause an incompletion.
Dez comes down with his arm cradling the ball between the hand and the bend of the arm opposite of the elbow.
From this video angle you can see the ball hit the ground.
The ball pops up, which means the ground caused the incompletion.
This has been argued over and over, and those who think this was a catch are wrong.

As to the Eagle play with Ertz, he caught the pass and was not touched until his third step, which constitutes making a football move. He then was a runner, and the ground cannot cause the fumble.

These two plays were similar in that the ball moved when it hit the ground in the endzone. The difference is Dez was still a receiver and Ertz was a runner.

 

[cheftjpeck]

So is self-righteous posturing.

Amen

 

[LACowboysFan1]

"The problem with you and others is you are trying so hard to deny the flat out incompetence of the refs"

Incompetence is defined as "inability to do something successfully; ineptitude" To be an NFL ref requires years of lower-echelon experience, and testing at the NFL level. No way somebody can become an NFL ref if they are actually inept, they would be weeded out long before getting to an NFL game.

And the rule is obviously very complicated, else we wouldn't have all this discussion and differences of opinion. It's called INTERPRETATION, and "reasonable people can disagree".

AND have you ever referred an NFL game? College game? High school? And if you did, did you grade out 100% on every game? No ref has EVER done that, if so please give us their name and official grading.

So the refs aren't perfect, they are HUMAN. If you want perfectly refereed games, forget it, it AIN'T HAPPENING.

 

[robertfchew]

So you're saying that Steratore, Pereira, and Blandino all missed football moves even though they're hired to do nothing but interpret the rules? Gotcha.

Again, when going to the ground applies, number of steps do not matter. Where in the rules, old or new, does switching hands equal a football move? Tucking the ball is in the new rules but Dez didn't do that either. He took one hand off the ball and left it out where it came loose.

it does not define football move because that is self explanatory. Had dez caught it then fell back uncontrolled and lost it then fine. Catching the ball, taking steps no matter how off balance, switching hands on purpose, and reaching for the end zone clearly establish possession and football moves. You Cannot debate this. The NFL determine that 100% firm holding of the ball without movement must be maintained in order for it to be a catch. but they went against their own rules twice last night. Also what you guys are trying to argue makes ertz a catch means there is no such thing as a defenseless receiver if the dude has 2 feet on the ground regardless of time of possession. You want it to be both ways but it can't. Nfl screwed this up so badly

 

[KJJ]

He isn't personally neither of us know the man outside of tv. After everything that happened this year and both of those non catches called td's after review you think goodell didn't have a say in that? An absolute joke of a suspension, 6 games without a single holding call, and 2 touchdowns that went completely against the rule that screwed the cowboys and is still talked about to this day. None of this is suspicious at all?

If you think there’s some conspiracy against the Cowboys then stop watching the game. This conspiracy theory some of you have is ridiculous.

 

[MarcusRock]

Using the gear at the bottom right of the video, you can select speed and slow this down to half speed and still understand the audio. (Edit: you will need to look up the video and not just click on this and allow it to take you to YouTube to slow down the video.)

Dez grabbed the ball.
As Dez came down his right ankle hit the defenders leg.
Regardless of the fact if Dez was lunging at the goal line, or Dez was falling forward, he was still a receiver. That means he has to establish control to the very end. At this point the ground can cause an incompletion.
Dez comes down with his arm cradling the ball between the hand and the bend of the arm opposite of the elbow.
From this video angle you can see the ball hit the ground.
The ball pops up, which means the ground caused the incompletion.
This has been argued over and over, and those who think this was a catch are wrong.

As to the Eagle play with Ertz, he caught the pass and was not touched until his third step, which constitutes making a football move. He then was a runner, and the ground cannot cause the fumble.

These two plays were similar in that the ball moved when it hit the ground in the endzone. The difference is Dez was still a receiver and Ertz was a runner.

Basically, the difference is Dez skied high to make his catch and each of his steps brought him lower and lower to the ground before he hit the ground whereas Ertz was already on the ground and running when he caught his ball. When you watch the Dez play at regular speed, you see why the official probably called it complete, because the reverse angle is where you see the ball hit the ground, not where the official was standing. Plus, it happened so fast at regular speed, that who could tell except by replay. So I don't blame the field official. I didn't think it was a catch but making Green Bay challenge to be sure was the right call so you could be sure of what happened. The system worked. People just don't want to accept the result.

 

[robertfchew]

"The problem with you and others is you are trying so hard to deny the flat out incompetence of the refs"

Incompetence is defined as "inability to do something successfully; ineptitude" To be an NFL ref requires years of lower-echelon experience, and testing at the NFL level. No way somebody can become an NFL ref if they are actually inept, they would be weeded out long before getting to an NFL game.

And the rule is obviously very complicated, else we wouldn't have all this discussion and differences of opinion. It's called INTERPRETATION, and "reasonable people can disagree".

AND have you ever referred an NFL game? College game? High school? And if you did, did you grade out 100% on every game? No ref has EVER done that, if so please give us their name and official grading.

So the refs aren't perfect, they are HUMAN. If you want perfectly refereed games, forget it, it AIN'T HAPPENING.

HAHAHA so now cause someone has done something for a few years they are incapable of mistakes.

Have you ever reffed a game? Why let some clown overturn a ruling on the field since we should give refs the benefit of the doubt that they make the right call 100% of the time and because its hard. Certain rules cannot be judged differently by different crews. If its too hard then they need to quit.

 

[robertfchew]

If you think there’s some conspiracy against the Cowboys then stop watching the game. This conspiracy theory some of you have is ridiculous.

It's not a conspiracy. Its just like wrestling they have a set storyline and they are sticking to it. Explain the suspension then letting another player off? Explain 6 games no holding? explain the catch thats not a catch but its a catch twice in the super bowl. It obvious there is a bias and you refuse to believe it despite every other major sport being caught fixing games. You think goodell isn't human and holds no grudge with jerry? You think the nfl is so special it is immune to corruption?

 

[CATCH17]

Dez tried to do too much. He’s a playmaker and it’s in his nature to try and score. He had one hand on the top half of the ball, reached for the endzone and slammed it on the turf causing the ball to come loose and pop up. Those who say the ball didn’t touch the ground are being ridiculous. At least half the ball was compressed against the ground.

The positioning of Dez’s hand on the football made it impossible for the ball not to touch the ground. I can’t even believe some are stupid enough to argue that. I’ve posted pics of the ball touching the ground for three years and some are still in denial over it.

IMO it hit the ground. I won't even argue that part of it. But if the ball slammed the ground and there was a goal line there it would be called a catch so the same should happen without the goal line.

 

[robertfchew]

Basically, the difference is Dez skied high to make his catch and each of his steps brought him lower and lower to the ground before he hit the ground whereas Ertz was already on the ground and running when he caught his ball. When you watch the Dez play at regular speed, you see why the official probably called it complete, because the reverse angle is where you see the ball hit the ground, not where the official was standing. Plus, it happened so fast at regular speed, that who could tell except by replay. So I don't blame the field official. I didn't think it was a catch but making Green Bay challenge to be sure was the right call so you could be sure of what happened. The system worked. People just don't want to accept the result.

you're making things up now. dez caught then reached and when he hit the ground he was on his right shoulder with the ball and his body facing the official. The dude was feet away are you telling me someone who has done something for years and years and years and has been vetted at every level can't tell what happened? None of you people can keep you stories straight. You want the dez botched call to be validated so badly you're making up things in your head. talk about conspiracies.

 

[MarcusRock]

IMO it hit the ground. I won't even argue that part of it. But if the ball slammed the ground and there was a goal line there it would be called a catch so the same should happen without the goal line.

No, it wouldn't have been called a catch. The goal line only matters if the receiver has established himself as a runner already from outside the end zone like in the Ertz play. You only need to break the plane then. If you're going to the ground, you have to survive the ground no matter where you are because you haven't completed the catch process yet and now have the added requirement of the ball "surviving the ground" as they say. If you look at Jeffrey's TD catch last night, he falls to the ground as he makes his catch so the officials couldn't call that anything until they saw that he controlled the ball all the way through hitting the ground and rolling over, etc. Gronk's TD catch was the same thing.

 

[CPanther95]

You can complete the process after you hit the ground, as long as you maintain control of the ball. That's the point of Item 1 -- to apply to diving catches when there's no time to complete the catch process before you go down.

Your interpretation of the clause is silly.

If it only applied to diving catches where there was no time to complete the catch process before hitting the ground...it wouldn't say that it applies when the act of catching the pass occurs while going to the ground.

The clause was interpreted since 2010 in a way that justified the ridiculous Calvin Johnson ruling. Your interpretation would mean that the "Calvin Johnson Rule" doesnt apply to the play it was named after.

 

[robertfchew]

Now there is a truth bomb if ever I saw one. People claim they want a fair game called until a call goes against us and then it's CONSPIRACY!!!

explain 6 games with a holding call? Explain one player being suspended for something proven false but another player gets arrested for the same accusation and is off the hook. You keep saying conspiracy as if that somehow invalidates it. Its a grudge from the commish towards an owner and he is letting it affect the game. You think all these replays are unbiased? Why on earth would it go to some league office without any accountability. The refs are being absolved of their mistakes now by some un identifiable "league office" Thats not sketchy at all to you?

 

[MarcusRock]

explain 6 games with a holding call? Explain one player being suspended for something proven false but another player gets arrested for the same accusation and is off the hook. You keep saying conspiracy as if that somehow invalidates it. Its a grudge from the commish towards an owner and he is letting it affect the game. You think all these replays are unbiased? Why on earth would it go to some league office without any accountability. The refs are being absolved of their mistakes now by some un identifiable "league office" Thats not sketchy at all to you?

I just want to know what brand your Doomsday bunker is. And do you have canned peaches stored in it? I love peaches.

 

[robertfchew]

And by the way, let me say on record that if the NFL is fixed I don't care so it won't cause me any pain. Just don't tell me the ending before it happens, lol. I don't bet on games so it won't affect me. Just give me a good show and I'm good. I have more important things to worry about. Everything in its place.

I don't bet either I have no money invested at all. I would just prefer a game without league interference. I want the best to win regardless the nfl survived decades without a league office and sure the refs botched calls back then but why ever leave it open to speculation that its fixed by having some annonymous all seeing football god determine the outcomes.You prefer a good show. Go watch a broadway play if thats all you want. thats the difference between us.

 

[robertfchew]

I just want to know what brand your Doomsday bunker is. And do you have canned peaches stored in it? I love peaches.

you can't refute my points so you just make jokes about bunkers. Glad to know I've destroyed your entire argument.