Johnny Manziel and RGIII mega thread **merged**

[BrAinPaiNt]

Both are about the same to me. They are incapable of running effective plays in structured offenses. Manziel's other drama aside, they are not that different on the field, except that Manziel is healthier.

People that want Griffin did not watch him look just awful in the preseason when he was the starter for Washington. He was so bad, they had no choice but to go to Cousins and demoted him, immediately I may add, all the way down to third string.

Yes...they could thrive in what I call Play ground football types of scenarios where you just throw it up and hope someone comes down with it. Or where one side of the field is open on any given set of plays while the other is not by design...or we just play run option football.

To RGIII's credit, or I guess one could argue discredit...he did want to become a pocket passer vs a running QB.

 

[slick325]

Bob Griffin...

 

[RS12]

Serious question? Jerry Jr is over at the factory printing JFB jerseys as I post.

 

[Killerinstinct]

Maybe the two of them should be brought in for a competition and the winner get's to hold the clipboard.

Which competition?

See which one can drink a whole bottle of Whiskey.

 

[Alexander]

I haven't seen/paid much attention to him since his first year and the read option - what does he seem to struggle with? Is it reads or just general accuracy. Or does he still not trust the knee?

I'm no QB maestro by far but even seeing our backups this year you could at least generally see the issues with them.

He struggles with reading defenses, footwork, pocket presence, pretty much everything. And he has one good knee and his mechanics are way off. He rarely sets his feet, varies his throwing motion.

He did not have a playbook at Baylor and most of the plays were scripted throws that we set up for him. Other than that, he played streetball.

Under Shanahan, they designed the read option for his skills, it shortened the field and all but eliminated anything other than the simplest reads. They geared that offense around his deep arm and mobility and allowed it to run off of him making plays with his legs. Once that was gone with his knee, it was all over with. Griffin let Shanahan down with poor study habits as well.

He was absolutely incapable of playing in Gruden's system which expected him function in the pocket and to read and go through normal progressions first.

 

[Alexander]

Yes...they could thrive in what I call Play ground football types of scenarios where you just throw it up and hope someone comes down with it. Or where one side of the field is open on any given set of plays while the other is not by design...or we just play run option football.

To RGIII's credit, or I guess one could argue discredit...he did want to become a pocket passer vs a running QB.

Did not want to and probably could not. I read that Shanahan stated he was a five year project to begin with and that they designed that offense around him to get by until he could learn how to become an NFL pocket passer. Steve Young took a long while before he got it. Indications are that Griffin did not put in the work, with either coach, to ensure he could be successful.

 

[JW82]

tough choice ... brittle body or brittle brain..no thanks on both. But I would never question our leadership and i am certain they will make the best choice!

 

[Stash]

Yeah, yeah, I know many of us want neither, and hope we solve our quarterback problem through the draft.
But assuming both are available and the Cowboys aren't going to draft a quarterback in 2016, who would you want the Cowboys to sign:

Manziel or RGIII.

Me? I'm going RGIII. Why?

1. He's more talented than Manziel.
2. He doesn't have a problem with alcohol.
3. He has lead a NFL team to the playoffs.
4. He hasn't made a bunch of noise from the sidelines and appears to be more humble about his situation.
5. He'll make the most of his second change compared to Manziel who I think will be the same wherever he goes.

You're up ...

I'd take Manziel if I had to choose one.

1) His game has improved from his rookie year to his second while Griffin has gotten progressively worse
2) Cost. I think RGIII will cost more in terms of salary than Manziel would. A whole LOT more! And I think Manziel can be had for a bag of chips, if anything at all.
3) While both struggle wth certain aspects of the game, I think Manziel's are less severe and possibly correctable. I think Griffin is simply incapable of doing what the pro quarterback position requires
4) Manziel would (or should) be on the shortest of leashes and be cut with just one screwup. What it would take to sign Griffin would guarantee he stuck around, no matter how bad he looks.

But regardless, I would not for a second allow any decisions with either player to affect my draft plans.

 

[Rack]

I thought Manziel looked solid when he played this year. His OL played horribly all year long (Mack was pretty bad this year and their rookie looked lost half the time). I would choose Manziel for his upside and the fact that RG3 has had too many injury issues.

I think Manziel can be a good player in the NFL if he gets his head out of his backside. Will it happen? Only time will tell. I can tell you I don't like Goff or Lynch at #4 so I'd rather take a chance on Manziel or draft a qb later to develop.

 

[JohnsKey19]

I need to know more about Manziel's off-field issues before i even consider him. Is he dealing with alcoholism or not? If so, he needs help before resuming his NFL career.

 

[Alexander]

But I would never question our leadership and i am certain they will make the best choice!

So if it is

Brittle body

or

Brittle brain

All the same

 

[erod]

Manziel failed to show up for his concussion protocol, went to Vegas instead, got hammered while recovering from said concussion, wore a blonde wig and a fake mustache, didn't have the cash to pay the night club and asked for it to be comped, then had to take out a credit card to pay against his wishes.

He's the Affluenza Quarterback. NFL's Ethan Couch. Spoiled rotten rich kid who does what he wants, listens to nobody, parties like a rock star, and has no remorse for anything he ever does.

And there are still Aggies that want him here. Unbelievable.

If Jerry brings this malignancy here, I'd have to reconsider my fandom for this organization. Beyond all his many personal flaws, the dude can't even play football at this level.

Stupid.

 

[robjay04]

RGIII will not be an option considered for the team.

Why?

Because the guy is going to be a free agent and he has been a successful QB (even briefly). I guarantee you that he will want the same contract that Nick Foles signed...a 2 year deal paying him north of 10 million annually with a starting position immediately. He is not going to sign with Dallas with a backup QB contract to sit on our bench behind Romo...not a chance that will happen.

Manziel by trade is more likely because he will come with a reasonable contract with 2-3 years left.

 

[Killerinstinct]

Jerry will go with Manziel. He practically said as much in this interview.

“Let’s just put it like this: We all would be aware that to bet on [Kellen] Moore for our backup quarterback has elements of risk to it,” Jones said on 105.3 The Fan. “I’m not so sure that that’s any riskier than anything you would do with a decision in the future. On the other hand, what would enhance me taking risk is a big bigger upside. If that upside is there, that ol’ risk-reward situation, then yeah. This is as far as we’re going to go here now with this, because I don’t want to get involved in any type of tampering situation. We’d take some risk.”

Read more here: http://www.star-telegram.com/sports...orner-blog/article53090935.html#storylink=cpy

 

[JW82]

Jerry will go with Manziel. He practically said as much in this interview.

“Let’s just put it like this: We all would be aware that to bet on [Kellen] Moore for our backup quarterback has elements of risk to it,” Jones said on 105.3 The Fan. “I’m not so sure that that’s any riskier than anything you would do with a decision in the future. On the other hand, what would enhance me taking risk is a big bigger upside. If that upside is there, that ol’ risk-reward situation, then yeah. This is as far as we’re going to go here now with this, because I don’t want to get involved in any type of tampering situation. We’d take some risk.”

Read more here: http://www.star-telegram.com/sports...orner-blog/article53090935.html#storylink=cpy

Yup. He wants to prove he was right regardless of the mountain of evidence that shows the kid is a total loser. If Jerry believes this then so do I!

 

[Bleu Star]

Yeah, yeah, I know many of us want neither, and hope we solve our quarterback problem through the draft.
But assuming both are available and the Cowboys aren't going to draft a quarterback in 2016, who would you want the Cowboys to sign:

Manziel or RGIII.

Me? I'm going RGIII. Why?

1. He's more talented than Manziel.
2. He doesn't have a problem with alcohol.
3. He has lead a NFL team to the playoffs.
4. He hasn't made a bunch of noise from the sidelines and appears to be more humble about his situation.
5. He'll make the most of his second change compared to Manziel who I think will be the same wherever he goes.

You're up ...

Easily RG3..

But...

HURLLLLLL

 

[movaughn88]

Griffin let Shanahan down with poor study habits as well.

He was absolutely incapable of playing in Gruden's system which expected him function in the pocket and to read and go through normal progressions first.

Got it, thanks. The one thing I heard is what you highlighted above with studying the playbook. That seems to be a problem with JFF as well if you believe the talk.

If you don't have a film nut who wants to understand how to pre-snap read a defense (in particular that team's shifts etc) in addition to progressions during the play, then I think that player's chances of being a top 10 QB are essentially zero. I don't think that is a kind of work-ethic personality trait that just "flips on" like a lightbulb as a QB gets older.

That said, I think both of these guys are wastes of time and resources. We need someone to be more patient and prepare and wait their turn, even if it comes in game 3 next year (hopefully not again). Gun to my head, I'd pick RG3. Johnny at QB1 is the one player who would cause me to severely curtail my fandom of this team.

 

[tyke1doe]

I'd take Manziel if I had to choose one.

1) His game has improved from his rookie year to his second while Griffin has gotten progressively worse
2) Cost. I think RGIII will cost more in terms of salary than Manziel would. A whole LOT more! And I think Manziel can be had for a bag of chips, if anything at all.
3) While both struggle wth certain aspects of the game, I think Manziel's are less severe and possibly correctable. I think Griffin is simply incapable of doing what the pro quarterback position requires
4) Manziel would (or should) be on the shortest of leashes and be cut with just one screwup. What it would take to sign Griffin would guarantee he stuck around, no matter how bad he looks.

But regardless, I would not for a second allow any decisions with either player to affect my draft plans.

Point of clarification, if both are cut, do teams pick up their current contracts or are they free to renegotiate?

And I don't know if I'd say Manziel's game has progressed compared to RGIII's. Manziel was awful his first year. Any progress is good, but I just don't know if I would call taking one step when you couldn't take any progress of the sort that gives me total confidence.
RGIII was injured his second year was he not?

 

[Alexander]

He's the Affluenza Quarterback. NFL's Ethan Couch.

You better give Staubacher some royalties.

 

[tyke1doe]

Easily RG3..

But...

HURLLLLLL