Kris Richard dilemma

[Idgit]

I am laughing at you.

Once again, you try to minimize criticisms of Garrett by making these bizarre comparisons and analogies. Like you did here, trying to couch criticisms of Garrett coming from people who are just being emotional and spontaneously ripping him for a play here or there......... when in fact, people criticize him because of the body of work built over 8 seasons.

Hope you had a good laugh, then.

This isn’t a Garrett thread, so you can stop trying to make it one. I pointed out the difference in fan standards as they apply to the performance of Richard’s secondary that gave up the game in HOU in OT and almost did the same v. DET. I dot. Understand why people are willing to overlook that because they like a guy.

 

[Idgit]

You want people to conform to your "standards" here. Garrett has been the head coach here for 8 years. 8 long years that has seen only one playoff win. When people criticize him now, it's because of the body of work built up over 8 years and the fact that along the way he's been inconsistent in his stewardship of the team. He's made clear mistakes over the years. He's made bad decisions over the years.

When we lose a game and there are issues, criticism of Garrett isn't just a spontaneous reaction to a bad play here or there. It's borne out of a track record of, frankly, mediocre to poor coaching and the results.

So to try to equate some sort of unfairness here because fans aren't killing Richard for a play that ended the Texans game is disingenuous and absurd. I'll put it another way. If Kris Richard had been the secondary coach/DC here for 8 years and the secondary breakdowns we saw late in that Texans game had been an issue we had seen time and time again over that 8 year period, yes, he'd probably be getting a crap ton of criticism as well.

No, not my standards. I’m sasking them to use the same standards. Those two aren’t the same things.

And you really need to look up what the word “disingenuous” means.

 

[Sydla]

Glad you find it funny.

I assume because you’ve switched to debating tenure instead of defending the play of Richard’s secondary that you’re conceding my earlier point. That’s good at least.

So, now you want a defensive coach in training to replace our offensive one? Interesting take.

Tenure has always been part of the debate. Garrett's criticism is largely born from the very fact that his tenure is long and has produced mediocre results. For you to suggest the debate hasn't been about his track record over his tenure is just you once again ignoring reality to support your boy.

And in fact, if you read the thread, I said the exact opposite of what I want as our head coach. I said I wanted an offensive minded coach.

 

[phildadon86]

Glad you find it funny.

I assume because you’ve switched to debating tenure instead of defending the play of Richard’s secondary that you’re conceding my earlier point. That’s good at least.

So, now you want a defensive coach in training to replace our offensive one? Interesting take.

Richard had this defense playing the best we have seen it up until Detroit. Garrett has had his scheme dismantled and destroyed for the last 10 games dating back to last year. His stubbornness to try making Dak into Aikman is yet another failure on his part, as well as allowing Linehan hire his boy Moore. Our offense is historically bad and you are sitting here calling out Kris Richard? lol. You're unbelievable

 

[Stash]

Why should standards be different? Either we measure them by their players’ performance or we don’t.

Which one is responsible for part of it and which one is responsible for all of it?

I really shouldn't have to explain these things to you.

 

[Stash]

It’s easier to pivot back to Garrett than to entertain the idea Richard might not be a cure-all for what ails the organization. Garrett bashing, right now, is an easy emotional lever to pull.

8 years.

 

[aria]

Available as we speak today? I don't think there are any available, no.

Not necessarily sitting on the couch but as an option when the season is over. Ben McAdoo has a ring and was a great OC for two years but he didn’t work out as HC. It was a rash decision and they paid for it dearly.

Remember everyone clammering for Chucky? I never liked him but the argument was “anyone’s better than JG” which may be true but that doesn’t mean it’s the best choice.

If JG got fired during the season I wouldn’t have a problem with KR being interim but I think they’d still need to look for a HC with more proven experience.

On the other hand it would probably take someone like KR to take the job because no proven HC/OC/DC would want to put up with Jerry and his circus. Taking the HC position for this team could destroy someone’s career thanks to being handcuffed by Stephen and Jerrah.

 

[Stash]

Glad you find it funny.

I assume because you’ve switched to debating tenure instead of defending the play of Richard’s secondary that you’re conceding my earlier point. That’s good at least.

So, now you want a defensive coach in training to replace our offensive one? Interesting take.

If you want to make this an offensive vs defensive debate, we can even do that. We'll pull up the data and rankings for those groups too.But spoiler warning, it won't go any better.

 

[Idgit]

Richard had this defense playing the best we have seen it up until Detroit. Garrett has had his game-plans and scheme and complete stubbornness of trying to make Dak into Troy Aikman for the last 10 games. Our offense is historically bad and you are sitting here calling out Kris Richard? lol. You're unbelievable

Again, I really like Richard for the job he does. My position on coaching can accommodate that because I believe players win and lose games. I’m asking how you guys reconcile your own position where your standards differ so wildly from coach to coach. And the answer seems to be that you don’t bother.

I did seem to have hit a nerve on the Richard thing, though.

 

[DHCBF66]

I think we have a Kris Richard dilemma.

He almost certainly needs to be the next head coach of this team. I would have liked a more experienced head coach, but it probably needs to be him. He has a connection with these defensive players and despite a few positions, they're playing decently well.

The dilemma is that I don't think you can hire a new head coach and then tell them Kris Richard is your defensive coordinator. You just can't do it (Jerry would do it, but it isn't the right move).

So either you elevate Richard or you lose a very talented coach, and maybe the latter is the better move.

Pete Carmichael Jr., Josh McDaniels, and Jim Harbaugh are all very high on my list.

When I think of the lack of experience Richard has, I remember he has a decade of coaching experience compared to the five years experience Garrett had before becoming the head coach. He's also had tremendous success whereas Garrett had not.

My biggest worry with Richard becoming head coach is if he doesn't clean house across the coaching staff.

I love how people are all over this Kris Richards thing. Fact is, the same guys he is coaching played very well last season as ROOKIES. He did not come in and wave a magic wand and make the defense better, the were ranked 8th overall last season. He did nothing more than inherit good players!

 

[Idgit]

If you want to make this an offensive vs defensive debate, we can even do that. We'll pull up the data and rankings for those groups too.But spoiler warning, it won't go any better.

It doesn’t need to go any better from where I’m sitting, stash.

If you’ve got a point to make, go ahead and make one. You don’t need my go-ahead.

 

[Cattle_Rancher]

I like some of the stuff Kris has done with the D but I haven’t seen anything that makes me just want to hand him the keys. Leave it as is he can interview for the job in the offseason.

 

[Sydla]

No, not my standards. I’m sasking them to use the same standards. Those two aren’t the same things.

And you really need to look up what the word “disingenuous” means.

Disingenous. To not be candid. Candid means to be truthful or straightforward or fair or frank.

You aren't being fair when you suggest that it's essentially unfair that people aren't judging Richard on one play but seemingly that's how people criticize Garrett. It's not fair or truthful when you try to boil criticisms of Garrett down to reactions to a bad play here or there when, in fact, criticisms of Garrett are largely born out of a totality of his resume and his 8 year run here.

 

[Galian Beast]

Maybe. Something must have been brewing, though. Usually one doesn't "quit" a job after just one incident but maybe Zeke does.

He didn't quit a job. He ran and played well the next game when he was used right.

He was never coming back to Ohio after the season. He said he was upset because that was a poor performance in one of his last opportunities to play.

 

[Sydla]

I love how people are all over this Kris Richards thing. Fact is, the same guys he is coaching played very well last season as ROOKIES. He did not come in and wave a magic wand and make the defense better, the were ranked 8th overall last season. He did nothing more than inherit good players!

Stop.

 

[Stash]

Not necessarily sitting on the couch but as an option when the season is over.

I'm talking about an option now, today. Sitting right in front of you. A proven coach with a Super Bowl ring. On your staff. Coaching up a first round draft pick better than anyone ever has.

A guy that, if you wanted to, you could make changes and get a several month look at to help you decide. And if you didn't like what you saw, you had the knowledge and freedom to hire anyone else you wanted. But at least you'd know.

Ben McAdoo has a ring and was a great OC for two years but he didn’t work out as HC. It was a rash decision and they paid for it dearly.

Fortunately for them, it didn't take them 8 years to find out.

Remember everyone clammering for Chucky? I never liked him but the argument was “anyone’s better than JG” which may be true but that doesn’t mean it’s the best choice.

If JG got fired during the season I wouldn’t have a problem with KR being interim but I think they’d still need to look for a HC with more proven experience.

On the other hand it would probably take someone like KR to take the job because no proven HC/OC/DC would want to put up with Jerry and his circus. Taking the HC position for this team could destroy someone’s career thanks to being handcuffed by Stephen and Jerrah.

That's my argument, make the move and see what you have with Richard. If you don't like what you see, clear the decks entirely and hope the next guy can actually coach.

 

[Brax]

I think we have a Kris Richard dilemma.

He almost certainly needs to be the next head coach of this team. I would have liked a more experienced head coach, but it probably needs to be him. He has a connection with these defensive players and despite a few positions, they're playing decently well.

The dilemma is that I don't think you can hire a new head coach and then tell them Kris Richard is your defensive coordinator. You just can't do it (Jerry would do it, but it isn't the right move).

So either you elevate Richard or you lose a very talented coach, and maybe the latter is the better move.

Pete Carmichael Jr., Josh McDaniels, and Jim Harbaugh are all very high on my list.

When I think of the lack of experience Richard has, I remember he has a decade of coaching experience compared to the five years experience Garrett had before becoming the head coach. He's also had tremendous success whereas Garrett had not.

My biggest worry with Richard becoming head coach is if he doesn't clean house across the coaching staff.

The next HC (if there is one under JJ) will have to be a yes man and take JJ's orders and I do not see KR being that type of person. Not sure why people want him for a HC at this point ( I know anything better that JG) I think the jury is out on KR at this point.

 

[Stash]

It doesn’t need to go any better from where I’m sitting, stash.

If you’ve got a point to make, go ahead and make one. You don’t need my go-ahead.

Is this where you're sitting?

 

[phildadon86]

Again, I really like Richard for the job he does. My position on coaching can accommodate that because I believe players win and lose games. I’m asking how you guys reconcile your own position where your standards differ so wildly from coach to coach. And the answer seems to be that you don’t bother.

I did seem to have hit a nerve on the Richard thing, though.

Your logic makes no sense. Lets judge both on their entire body of work just in Dallas. I think Richard wins. You're comparing a man who built one of the greatest defenses of our generation to Jason Garrett. I mean come on here man. You cannot be this deluded.

 

[JustChip]

Nobody minds the secondary giving up the backbreaking play in OT? Or was that one on the players, and not the coach?

Yep. It's tough to call that one. The KR scheme is aggressiveness - Brown played to knock the ball down rather than let Hopkins catch it and then limit the yardage by tackling, which is what RM would stress. Ultimately, that wasn't the reason for losing the game, it was the ineffective offense, but it scuttled JG's reason for punting.