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[stilltheguru88]

That's a myth. The Patriots didn't often dip into the high priced free agent pool because they often were near the top of their cap anyway. But they did take on Randy Moss and his huge contract (and Brady had to restructure his deal to fit Moss under the cap) in a trade. So the notion that they stayed away from high priced players until Revis isn't exactly accurate.

Constantly changing your philosophies is what this franchise seems to have done and what do they have to show for it? 20+ years of ineptitude.

If the Cowboys take Elliott at 4, I think it really calls into question if the front office really has an idea on how to build this roster other than just throwing darts at a board.

They also traded for Moss who was a headache. More straying from philosophy. also drafted a drug guy in hernandez, more straying. You can pretend the pats stay consistent all you want, just know it's bs.

 

[stilltheguru88]

Well no duh that Wentz or any QB for that matter is not for 2016.

That's the whole point.

So you don't want to trade up for a qb, correct?

 

[stilltheguru88]

Big picture...

Also, I think Wentz gives us a way better chance to win than most guys because he can extend plays and run.

Our run game + the element of his running would do a hell of a lot better than the 1-11 garbage we trotted out there last season.

Dak and Brissett and cardale can do the same. Only they did it against top competition. if you want Wentz you're saying you don't want the best product in 2016. No other way around it. And that's fine, just admit it though

 

[conner01]

WHAAAAAAAAT!!!!! Aint (and yes i sd Aint) no rb in the 2nd round even compares to Elliott my man lolololololol Not 1

I disagree
I like Elliott but let's don't get carried away with his talent. He would not have been the top back last year or next year. His biggest asset is he can be a 3 down player. i think if most any team could get one of 3 or 4 of this years rb's and another pick too, they would pass on Elliott. He's a good player, and I would consider him after a trade down but not at 4. A trade down gets you him and another player

 

[CATCH17]

Dak and Brissett and cardale can do the same. Only they did it against top competition. if you want Wentz you're saying you don't want the best product in 2016. No other way around it. And that's fine, just admit it though

lol.. Big deal.

They can't make some of the throws Wentz makes against air.

 

[Sydla]

So you don't want to trade up for a qb, correct?

I am actually torn on this. I think they need a QB like Wentz or Goff. It's time this organization stops being reactionary and is proactive. They likely will never pick this high again for a few years because at worst, this team is probably a 6-10, 7-9 team but more likely in that 8-8 to 10-6 range.

So taking all that into consideration, I think taking Wentz or Goff would be very wise. But I do admit that the price in moving up would have me gag a bit.

 

[Sydla]

Wait, did someone compare Prescott, Brissett and Cardale Jones to Wentz?

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

Personally I would like to have the QB of our Future with the 4th pick. However unless the stars align and we get lucky it probably is not going to happen.

So that leaves me with some other names at 4

Bosa and Buckner are the only two DEs that most rate in the top 10 ( and most on here don't want either because they don't think they should be rated that high to begin with).

Ramsey could be sitting there but there is a contingent on this forum that thinks he is a wasted pick because he does not get INTs...don't seem to consider maybe he does not get them is because other teams game plan around him and don't throw his way. Even if that is not the case...some feel he is a better S than CB and the team wants to play him at CB.

The only LBs that might be considered at this spot are both injury concerns...one very serious the other you are not sure about because of various reports. Either way seems it would be too much of a gamble on an injured player at 4.

At one time Treadwell was a consideration but after his 40 times most people don't even know if he will be the first WR taken let alone being top 5 worthy anymore.

Tunsil seems to be another name that everyone had locked in place to be the first overall pick to the Titans but after the trade he might be available. Now does anyone really believe that Jerry and Crew are going to draft Tunsil after they have three first round guys on the roster and 4 if you count Collins when it comes time to pay? I doubt anyone really believes they will draft Tunsil.

Trade down...might be the best situation, however you have to have partners willing to trade down.

Zeke - People may hate it but provides the most immediate impact of any player listed. He is a rare RB in that he is very good at pass blocking which is normally a weakness of a RB coming out. Some say you don't draft a player that is a one contract player. I say why is he automatically a one contract player? Was Emmitt a one contract player? Is Adrian Peterson a one contract player? Was Doug Martin a one contract player for the bucs? Some say that why not pay murray instead of drafting a RB and paying him around the same money...Murray, all the way back to college, was a player that rarely played a full year and he just had a season where he did his best ever. Doubt he stays healthy again. Some say why not pay Lamar Milller...would have been ok with that but I think Zeke is the better player coming out and is younger. Some say they only want him to save the coaches ...well if the coaches keep their jobs because the player is doing well it is also because the team is doing well and I hate to break it to people but being a fan of the team you should want your team to do well.

I would like Zeke so I have no problem with them taking him IF that is who they take.
I would like him over some of the other choices. I would prefer the QB Wentz, Goff and even Lynch even though neither of them offer an immediate impact to this team. I am also not under some delusion that zeke is only a ONE CONTRACT player...somehow this has become an unofficial rule for some and I don't know why because it is stupid. Same as it has become an unofficial rule not to take a RB high in the draft. If we were drafting right now knowing what we know about Peterson...he would be a number one overall player in some drafts. If Zeke does as good as I think he can...nobody will complain about him being taken high in the draft in a few years.

You take who you think is the best player for your team and he would qualify for that spot.

Now if we take someone else...I will hope they do well and not automatically cry like a baby just because I don't think they are the best option for this team and have a bunch of pre made excuses of this or that.

I think we are in a position that whether we like any of those players I listed or not, they probably can help this team. They might not have the impact we would want but it is a gamble and to be one of those that are not going to be happy no matter what unless it is a QB...hey those are gambles too.

I just hope we get a good player and that they pan out for us....whether that be a QB, a RB, a DB or DE/DT...notice I did not put WR, LB or OT...cause I doubt that happens at four lol.

/old man rant off

 

[stilltheguru88]

1

Wait, did someone compare Prescott, Brissett and Cardale Jones to Wentz?

In terms of 2016 impact, yes.

 

[Sydla]

It's not an unofficial rule. It's just paying attention to the words Jones has used and the actions they have taken in the last two years. People can ignore it and try to spin it however they want but the Cowboys through words and actions have been pretty clear that given the assets they've spent on the OL, they feel they don't need to invest heavily in the RB position and do not want to tie up a lot of money in the RB position.

It's not some unwritten rule or some philosophy shared by all front offices in football. It's what the Cowboys have said and one for two years now. In taking Elliott, again argue all you want, they would be making a pretty clear statement that they think what they thought 2 years ago (and even this free agent period) was wrong and now they have a different philosophy.

 

[kazzd58]

Because the "formula" that worked in 2014 didn't involve a Top 5 drafted TB running behind this OL.

The "formula" would seem to be build the best OL you can and then you don't have to invest a high value pick in a TB to get high production. This OL turned a 3rd round TB who people weren't sure could be a lead back in Murray into the league's leading rusher. Then the following year, they took a bum in McFadden and turned him into a 1,000 yard rusher in like 12 games and did so without any shred of a passing game with Romo out and Bryant basically useless for most of the year.

The "formula" was invest a ton of assets into building a dominant OL so then you wouldn't have to spend a ton of assets on a TB, a position that the front office believes has a short shelf life. So in taking Elliott at 4, the front office has clearly thrown aside their philosophy and couple that with some of their missteps in free agency and you really wonder if they have a clue how to really build this team. If anything, taking Elliott at 4 smacks of pure panic because they feel their hands are tied.

Thats not the point im making..... Obviously Demarco developed into better than a third rd rb hey we hit in 3rd but Zeke s Elite Demarco wasnt Elite coming out of college look at Gurly u seen what he did to Seattle Arizona Rams green Bay those teams you you know those that got those defenses to where if Tony get hit enough he most likely not getting back up anytime soon

having someone like that behind this line and you dont think that can propel us to the Super Bowl this year while maximizing the time Romo has t we have a real shot with Zeke i dont believe in mcfaddon sorry or Morris long term, but Zeke he brings that dog that bite and with Dez dog, that can be lethal but because its #4 its seems to be a problem for "rb" right?? i thought we are hear to win?

btw in my opinion Zeke was and is better than Demarco coming out of college and i think will be better in the NFL as well my opinion

So hey maybe we win the super bowl instead of losing in the Divisional rounds since Romo is going to be our Qb for the next 2-3 years anyway ijs

 

[JohnnyHopkins]

My only big concern about valuing the coaches opinions over the scouts is that these are the same coaches that just last season thought Brandon Weeden at back-up QB and Joseph Randle at starting RB was a good idea.

Elliot would be a lot of fun to watch behind this o-line though. I can't deny that.

 

[Sydla]

1


In terms of 2016 impact, yes.

But the interesting thing about drafting players.............. you aren't doing it for one year. You are hoping you are drafting for 10.

 

[slick325]

Personally I would like to have the QB of our Future with the 4th pick. However unless the stars align and we get lucky it probably is not going to happen.

So that leaves me with some other names at 4

Bosa and Buckner are the only two DEs that most rate in the top 10 ( and most on here don't want either because they don't think they should be rated that high to begin with).

Ramsey could be sitting there but there is a contingent on this forum that thinks he is a wasted pick because he does not get INTs...don't seem to consider maybe he does not get them is because other teams game plan around him and don't throw his way. Even if that is not the case...some feel he is a better S than CB and the team wants to play him at CB.

The only LBs that might be considered at this spot are both injury concerns...one very serious the other you are not sure about because of various reports. Either way seems it would be too much of a gamble on an injured player at 4.

At one time Treadwell was a consideration but after his 40 times most people don't even know if he will be the first WR taken let alone being top 5 worthy anymore.

Tunsil seems to be another name that everyone had locked in place to be the first overall pick to the Titans but after the trade he might be available. Now does anyone really believe that Jerry and Crew are going to draft Tunsil after they have three first round guys on the roster and 4 if you count Collins when it comes time to pay? I doubt anyone really believes they will draft Tunsil.

Trade down...might be the best situation, however you have to have partners willing to trade down.

Zeke - People may hate it but provides the most immediate impact of any player listed. He is a rare RB in that he is very good at pass blocking which is normally a weakness of a RB coming out. Some say you don't draft a player that is a one contract player. I say why is he automatically a one contract player? Was Emmitt a one contract player? Is Adrian Peterson a one contract player? Was Doug Martin a one contract player for the bucs? Some say that why not pay murray instead of drafting a RB and paying him around the same money...Murray, all the way back to college, was a player that rarely played a full year and he just had a season where he did his best ever. Doubt he stays healthy again. Some say why not pay Lamar Milller...would have been ok with that but I think Zeke is the better player coming out and is younger. Some say they only want him to save the coaches ...well if the coaches keep their jobs because the player is doing well it is also because the team is doing well and I hate to break it to people but being a fan of the team you should want your team to do well.

I would like Zeke so I have no problem with them taking him IF that is who they take.
I would like him over some of the other choices. I would prefer the QB Wentz, Goff and even Lynch even though neither of them offer an immediate impact to this team. I am also not under some delusion that zeke is only a ONE CONTRACT player...somehow this has become an unofficial rule for some and I don't know why because it is stupid. Same as it has become an unofficial rule not to take a RB high in the draft. If we were drafting right now knowing what we know about Peterson...he would be a number one overall player in some drafts. If Zeke does as good as I think he can...nobody will complain about him being taken high in the draft in a few years.

You take who you think is the best player for your team and he would qualify for that spot.

Now if we take someone else...I will hope they do well and not automatically cry like a baby just because I don't think they are the best option for this team and have a bunch of pre made excuses of this or that.

I think we are in a position that whether we like any of those players I listed or not, they probably can help this team. They might not have the impact we would want but it is a gamble and to be one of those that are not going to be happy no matter what unless it is a QB...hey those are gambles too.

I just hope we get a good player and that they pan out for us....whether that be a QB, a RB, a DB or DE/DT...notice I did not put WR, LB or OT...cause I doubt that happens at four lol.

/old man rant off

Well thought out and well put BP. If I could offer more "likes" I would....

 

[Sydla]

Thats not the point im making..... Obviously Demarco developed into better than a third rd rb hey we hit in 3rd but Zeke s Elite Demarco wasnt Elite coming out of college look at Gurly u seen what he did to Seattle Arizona Rams green Bay those teams you you know those that got those defenses to where if Tony get hit enough he most likely not getting back up anytime soon

having someone like that behind this line and you dont think that can propel us to the Super Bowl this year while maximizing the time Romo has t we have a real shot with Zeke i dont believe in mcfaddon sorry or Morris long term, but Zeke he brings that dog that bite and with Dez dog, that can be lethal but because its #4 its seems to be a problem for "rb" right?? i thought we are hear to win?

btw in my opinion Zeke was and is better than Demarco coming out of college and i think will be better in the NFL as well my opinion

So hey maybe we win the super bowl instead of losing in the Divisional rounds since Romo is going to be our Qb for the next 2-3 years anyway ijs

Elliott is not taking this team to the SB in 2016. Because the defense isn't good enough to be a SB defense. People significantly overrate the effect Elliott (or any TB for that matter) would have on this team, a team that has some serious holes on defense. A good running game can only protect a defense for so long.

And you are proving my point. You are right, Murray wasn't as good as Elliott coming out of college. And yet with the investment in this OL, they turned Murray into the leading rusher in the league.

I don't think McFadden and Morris are our TBs for the next 3-4 years either. But I also know that with this OL, you can probably more easily plug and play TBs than any other position on the team.

 

[kazzd58]

I disagree
I like Elliott but let's don't get carried away with his talent. He would not have been the top back last year or next year. His biggest asset is he can be a 3 down player. i think if most any team could get one of 3 or 4 of this years rb's and another pick too, they would pass on Elliott. He's a good player, and I would consider him after a trade down but not at 4. A trade down gets you him and another player

what other rb can carry his team to a national championship with a 3rd string qb and show up in all the big games and be pretty much the reason they won 9 i know its team but ohio state does not win that ship with out Zeke i look at that type of pedigree what do you do when its time when we need a play just you with the ball wassup?

i'm taking zeke on my squad with the best oline tony carried this team a lonnnggg time give him some adiquate help... Zeke traits and what he brings is more than just looking at it as well its a rb at #4 well what type of back is he and how it helps your overall team but thats my opinion

 

[jday]

I don't care if it's Bosa, Ramsey, a QB, a trade down or even Tunsil at 4. Any of those options are better than taking a RB at 4.

You guy's seriously need put the book down that tell's you the secret formula to winning is never draft a running back high in the first. It really depends on the team and what the player in question means to the team. Would it be stupid for teams who already have a reliable running back or run a scheme more geared towards passing to pick a running back high? Maybe. Really depends on the situation and who else is available. But for the Cowboys this will have an immediate positive impact.

 

[jday]

I think it's coming down to EE or Ramsey. If Ramsey is there, I think we take him. If it's down to Bosa or EE, then I think we go EE.

I think it's silly for anyone to designate certain positions as "nondraftable" early in the draft (with the exception of kickers). If you feel a RB is one of the best players, you take him.

All that being said, I think I'm leaning to Bosa. I think there are too many folks selling him short. But I wouldn't be upset with Ramsey or Elliot.

I liked everything you said up until you said Bosa. So my like is more like 90% like. Fair?

 

[jday]

So in the past few days I've read we would be dumb to draft with our no4 pick:

A) Bosa- reach on a DE without the quick twitch to be an elite pass rusher. He's good but not a difference maker. We just took Greg Ellis at no4?!

B) Goff/Wentz - take a qb with a no4 pick who is not a generational talent and you already have a high priced qb on your roster. Theres not much of a drop off to Lynch. We are wasting away an opportunity to get an impact player to put you over the top. We were a catch away from the NFC championship game and we drafted a backup?!!

C) Ramsey - You don't win with a secondary, you win in the trenches. He's a S and not even the best CB in the draft. Did we not learn from the Claiborne debacle?!

D) Jack - Aleardy have Lee and Mclain. This guy has big time medical red flags. You can't risk that with the no4 pick. His knee is a ticking time bomb!!

E) Elliot - No way we can take rb at no4. You can take a stud rb later on in the draft. Do we know nothing about value? Even Emmitt Smith said not to take a rb at no4!!

F) Tunsil - We spent way to much resources in our OL. We won't be able to keep it together when they come up for new contracts. Law of diminishing returns. What good does a dominant OL do if we don't have a defense. We need sacks and TOs!!

It must be the final days before draft. The meltdown with whoever we pick is gona be epic. CAN'T WAIT!

I'm with you on that...but I still take Elliott at 4 if a short trade back doesn't materialize. If it does materialize, Elliott is still my target and I sweat bullets the whole time getting there.

 

[jday]

Honestly, I truly believe that if Elliott is picked it's basically because the front office feels they don't have any options or a choice.

And that's not what you really want your front office to be doing with a premium pick.................. basically taking a guy as a last resort because you feel you are boxed in.

Okay, so what your saying is that if a trade doesn't materialize, and they don't like anyone else on the board for the exception of Zeke, because it too soon to take a running back they should just let the clock expire and not pick anyone?