Lebron James is no Michael Jordan

[Manwiththeplan]

I'd sure like someone to explain to me how losing in the quarterfinals is somehow more impressive than losing in the finals.

I'd love to hear the rationale behind this. It pops up every year and no one ever explains why it's relevant.

 

[DFWJC]

30 for 30 is on ESPN right now talking college hoops about 1983.
Crazy good. So many stayed until their senior year. It was nuts.

 

[jterrell]

What LeBron did this year was more impressive than any single year in Jordan's career and arguably one of the greatest accomplishments in NBA history. He took a team of complete nothings with zero experience in the playoffs to the playoffs then ran to the Finals even as he lost the only guys on the team with any real NBA talent. Jordan never faced that type of challenge until he was 40 and by then he couldn't do it. So he MAY have been able to but he never did. The Bulls had Horace Grant, Kukoc, Rodman, Pippen amongst others to help. It was a harder NBA then with less watered down versions but the best trams Jordan ran into during his prime were the Rockets and Jazz.

But Jordan as a whole was absolutely a better player. Simply FAR more efficient as a scorer.

And FWIW, Jordan picked his team when he went to Washington then again as an owner in Charlotte. He's seen absolutely zero success at either stop.
So his only success came via the team that picked him. He won zero NBA titles without Pippen and Phil, two first ballot NBA Hall of Famers.

Hating the game's best player is pretty pointless.
And the thought LeBron is more cocky than Jordan is completely and utterly foolish.
Jordan is still saying he can take current prime NBA players at age 51.

 

[viman96]

Jordon the better player and bigger ego. No question. He played in a era that was much tougher to get to the finals. The East back then was brutal. The West was no joke either.

LeBron is the best player today but not sure of his era. IMO Kobe, Shaq and Duncan are in that discussion.

LeBron has done more with less (Cavs). He has also lost with more (Heat).

 

[jterrell]

Jordon the better player and bigger ego. No question. He played in a era that was much tougher to get to the finals. The East back then was brutal. The West was no joke either.

LeBron is the best player today but not sure of his era. IMO Kobe, Shaq and Duncan are in that discussion.

LeBron has done more with less (Cavs). He has also lost with more (Heat).

The 90s were not the 80s. The 80s were truly tough. The 90s were tougher than now but no where near the 80s.

Shaq was arguably the most dominant force in the league but his work ethic was terrible and he had too many holes in his game to be considered the best.
He's also been done a good while. His era really isn't the same as Le'Bron's even if they crossed paths and were team mates.

LeBron is only 30. And he will draw more help to CLE. He told everyone he didn't expect to win a title this year and he knew the road would be very long and very hard to build a title winner.
But the reality is if not for a freak foul injury to Love he may well have not only won a title this year but done so easily.
GS struggled largely in rebounding. And the Cavs badly needed a spacing guy and 3 point shooter.
With Love and and Thompson the Cavs would have really presented the Warriors problems.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

Jordon the better player and bigger ego. No question. He played in a era that was much tougher to get to the finals. The East back then was brutal. The West was no joke either.

LeBron is the best player today but not sure of his era. IMO Kobe, Shaq and Duncan are in that discussion.

LeBron has done more with less (Cavs). He has also lost with more (Heat).

JMO, but Duncan, Shaq, Lebron, Kobe in that order

 

[JoeyBoy718]

I think Michael was the best player of all-time. Certainly most focused and driven to win.

In a lot of ways LeBron is simply a BETTER person than Jordan and that prevents him being a better player.
LeBron married his high school sweetheart. Carried his high school friends entourage style to business and personal success.
Is actively involved with his kids on a level that requires sacrifice and juggling. He actually has a life and is part of the people's life he most cares about in a meaningful way.

Arguing LeBron's finals losses as some negative is really stupid.
I mean in-comprehensively stupid.
I am a Mavs fan and beating LeBron was sublime.
Easy to enjoy beating the best.
And that one Finals was probably the only time LeBron has had more talent that he lost.

Jordan isn't getting kicked for how bad the Wizards were when we played for them right?
LeBron is taking Jordan-era Wizards talent to the NBA Finals.
LeBron was the best player in the Finals by a good margin.
But the top 10 players in this series were 7 or 8 players from GS and 2 from CLE.

LeBron left a Finals team and they went to the lottery.
He joined a lottery team and they went to the Finals.
Not even Jordan can make that claim.

I agree with you that LeBron seems to be a great human being. It's really impressive in this day and age where nothing can be hidden plus the fact that he's one of the top 5 scrutinized human beings on Earth, and he still has no skeletons we know of. Guy seems like a great person. Only time people can criticize him is when he loses games, even if he plays incredibly. A few times he made some bratty comments but even those were minuscule.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Oh I seem to remember a fella named Rodman helping out for a couple years.
Jordan lost a bunch of times. Never in the finals, but he lost a bunch of times. I'd sure like someone to explain to me how losing in the quarterfinals is somehow more impressive than losing in the finals.
You are entitled to your own opinions. You are not, however, entitled to your own facts. Jordan was 0-2 against Bird's Celtics and 1-3 against the Bad Boys in the playoffs, so you can drop the pretense that he dominated all comers.

It was only after those 2 teams declined that Jordan took over a talentless NBA. Who was Jordan's biggest nemesis of his championship runs? Patrick Ewing? Don't make me laugh.

Never said he dominated all comers bra. In fact, I pointed out how he had to get through the Celtics and the Pistons. He had the MORE difficult task every year. So how do you turn that into "you said he dominated all comers"? Try to stick with the conversation here. We are comparing finals records. Obviously that doesnt support your case, so you try to meander off into pre finals. which has no bearing what so ever on this conversation.

Ok so what is your point on this pre finals nonsense? That Lebron is the master of the pre finals? I wont even argue that point because its laughable. Ok, Lebron rules the pre finals over Jordan. LOL

Jordan 6-0 in the finals. With two threepeats.

Lebron 2-4 in the finals. Zero threepeats.

Winner Jordan by a LOOOOONG shot.

I'll take the guy that never loses in the finals over the guy that gets there and loses.

 

[CowboyRoy]

More often than not an adult who has seen both play and has no bias against either will say MJ > LBJ and you won't here me say other wise

Look, I think Lebron is awesome. Best in the game. And I remember hating Jordan too. Jordan basically ushered my Celtics into retirement. But Jordan was better. Only a young fan that never watched Jordan would try to claim that Lebron was better.

 

[YosemiteSam]

Basketball is a team game. Saying LeBron sucks because he has losses is illogical. It takes a team to win a team game. The Cavs weren't anywhere close to how good the Bulls were, yet they were still in the finals.

Now, the Miami Heat losing when they had LeBron, Wade, Bosh, and a host of players taking less to become champions. That *IS* embarrassing, but then I don't blame that on LeBron. I blame that on Wade who is the TO of basketball.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Not if those Laker teams where waiting for him. Maybe in 1989, where at that point Kareem was a role player and Magic missed half the series, but they certainly don't beat LA in any other year

So many great teams back then. All of which would trounce any and all teams in this day and age. Bird Celtics, Bad Boys, Jordans Bulls, Duncan/Robinson Spurs, Hakeem rockets, Magic Lakers. Lebron would have gotten knocked out in the first or second round every year. At thats not even mentioning Ewings Knicks. The Cavs were even great back then with Daugherty and Larry Nance, Ello.

Can you imagine the Warriors trying that small ball nonsense against the Knicks or the Celtics? LOL Laughable.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Basketball is a team game. Saying LeBron sucks because he has losses is illogical. It takes a team to win a team game. The Cavs weren't anywhere close to how good the Bulls were, yet they were still in the finals.

Now, the Miami Heat losing when they had LeBron, Wade, Bosh, and a host of players taking less to become champions. That *IS* embarrassing, but then I don't blame that on LeBron. I blame that on Wade who is the TO of basketball.

Who said Lebon sucks?

As far as Wade............He is about as great a #2 player you could hope for. By the way, do you know what Wades record is in the NBA Finals?

Lebron 2-4

Wade 4-2

Wade is a loyal, classy, star. Lebron..........not so much.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Early on? How long do you get to consider a guy's career as "early on"? In his first 6 years as a pro, he was 0-5 against the Celtics and Pistons in the playoffs. Those 6 years represent almost half his career as a Bull.

Once Jordan started winning, Bird's Celtics no longer existed and the Bad Boys were well into the back-9. So the individual who said "Jordan had to get through the likes of Birds Celtics and Isaiah Thomas and the Bad Boys" as if that was an annual occurrence is simply mistaken.

Wow, you cant really be that absent minded. The fact that Jordan was 0-5 against those two teams completely proves my point. Can you not see that?

The point is that those GREAT teams were in Jordans way early in his career. Had those teams NOT been there, or had they been soft teams like these Atlanta Hawks, or these Chicago Bulls, or these Bucks, then Jordan would have made it to the finals many more times. Are you grasping that?

You are sitting here bragging about Lebron making and losing in the finals, and its obvious why he has made so many. Easy path. A path Jordan DID NOT have.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

Wow, you cant really be that absent minded. The fact that Jordan was 0-5 against those two teams completely proves my point. Can you not see that?

The point is that those GREAT teams were in Jordans way early in his career. Had those teams NOT been there, or had they been soft teams like these Atlanta Hawks, or these Chicago Bulls, or these Bucks, then Jordan would have made it to the finals many more times. Are you grasping that?

You are sitting here bragging about Lebron making and losing in the finals, and its obvious why he has made so many. Easy path. A path Jordan DID NOT have.

Here's the thing.

When watching jordan on those threepeat runs. I felt I was watching a guy who couldn't lose.... Refused to lose.
When watching Kobe. I felt the same way. When he lost two titles. I was shocked. He still banked 5 of 7.

When watching LeBron. Losing is not so shocking. Not hard to fathom.

He ain't cut from same cloth.

 

[YosemiteSam]

Who said Lebon sucks?

As far as Wade............He is about as great a #2 player you could hope for. By the way, do you know what Wades record is in the NBA Finals?

Lebron 2-4

Wade 4-2

Wade is a loyal, classy, star. Lebron..........not so much.

The guy is the epitomizes the term primadonna. Especially when he fakes injuries. I can't stand the guy. You may consider Wade classy, but for me. Classy must include great character, and Wade is of poor character and therefore he does not fit the term classy to me. (A classy person would never fake injuries / sickness)

 

[YosemiteSam]

Here's the thing.

When watching jordan on those threepeat runs. I felt I was watching a guy who couldn't lose.... Refused to lose.
When watching Kobe. I felt the same way. When he lost two titles. I was shocked. He still banked 5 of 7.

When watching LeBron. Losing is not so shocking. Not hard to fathom.

He ain't cut from same cloth.

He lacks real leadership skills and character. If he had those, I think he could be better than Jordan. He is definitely more physically dominate than Jordan.

 

[Joe Realist]

LeBron - Atlanta Braves of 90's and 2000's

 

[CowboyRoy]

Here's the thing.

When watching jordan on those threepeat runs. I felt I was watching a guy who couldn't lose.... Refused to lose.
When watching Kobe. I felt the same way. When he lost two titles. I was shocked. He still banked 5 of 7.

When watching LeBron. Losing is not so shocking. Not hard to fathom.

He ain't cut from same cloth.

Bingo. Lebron cares more about himself then anything else.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

He lacks real leadership skills and character. If he had those, I think he could be better than Jordan. He is definitely more physically dominate than Jordan.

This.

 

[CowboyRoy]

The guy is the epitomizes the term primadonna. Especially when he fakes injuries. I can't stand the guy. You may consider Wade classy, but for me. Classy must include great character, and Wade is of poor character and therefore he does not fit the term classy to me. (A classy person would never fake injuries / sickness)

yah, Im not sure about that faking injury stuff. You are the first guy who has ever claimed that one. I live in SFlorida and never heard that before.

If I have a beef with Wade, its the fact that he is a dirty player and goes out of his way to hurt players. Ive seen it plenty of times.