Love Eli Harold ...

[supercowboy8]

He's obviously not the same type of athlete as the higher rated pass rushers, but he has a way of getting it done.

I agree that's why I said 3rd round rotational guy

 

[locked&loaded]

What video you watching. The louisville highlight where he comes of standing up I. 2 point and doesn't even get a sack. Smith got the sack does that make him a 1st round talent too.

I said dupree is best on his feet it's the 3 point stance he has trouble with being a true 43 DE.

You said this, ' Show me where Dupree get a sack in the first 3 to 4 seconds with his hand in the dirt.'

He showed you this http://www.gfycat.com/BitterComplexKakapo#

Then he showed you this, hand in the ground, but not under 4 seconds http://www.gfycat.com/GraciousDimImperatorangel#

 

[supercowboy8]

You said this, ' Show me where Dupree get a sack in the first 3 to 4 seconds with his hand in the dirt.'

He showed you this http://www.gfycat.com/BitterComplexKakapo#

Then he showed you this, hand in the ground, but not under 4 seconds http://www.gfycat.com/GraciousDimImperatorangel#

Yep showed me 2. 1 vs vandy.

I'm done with dupree. I agree he is a 1st round talent but only as a 34 OLB and nickel pass rusher. I don't like him as a 43 Traditional DE and don't think he's worth a 1st for that.

You do. ok good for you.

 

[AzorAhai]

Dude you can put any sites you want. I'm saying what I see. Just agree to disagree. Doesn't matter if some think he is a 1st round pick or not. Players bust all the time. Mingo was a 1st round pick. Doesn't mean squat.

From what I see he is not a 1st round 43 DE. I think if your spending a 1st rou d pick on dupree it's a 34 OLB. I think he will go top 20 to some 34 team. Let's just wait and watch.

You keep talking about video evidence, yet there is video evidence above with his hand in the dirt getting to the QB for a hit or sack quickly. Isnt that what you asked for? Now you say show clips where he doesn't do well? You keep suggesting video evidence yet you've done nothing in this thread but puff your chest out saying how you're right and most everyone else is wrong and hes going to bust. Maybe he does go to a 3-4 team, how does that prove he can't play in a 4-3? Maybe he does bust, but he has the blue chip potential you look for in a high pick.If you don't like him so be it, but the fact you have to argue with everyone else to prove how "right" you are is dumb and I won't do it. I showed a few clips like you asked so take it or leave it.

 

[VACowboy]

I

harold doesn't have the pass rush movers or power to be a hand in the dirt DE. Looks like more of an athlete than a football player to me. I don't see anything special. Relies on his quickness and athletic ability to beat lower players in college that ha no chance to play in the NFL. His athletic ability and quickness will e matched in the nfl with even better speed and power. I say a big no thanks to Harold at 27.

Harold played every down 4-3 defensive end on a team with zero depth and no offense, a team that finished 2014-2015 18th in the country in rushing defense. I'm not a coach and I'm not a scout, but I saw every game of Eli's college career (about 70% of them in person) and I can tell you that he was never a liability against the run, not when he was starting as a freshman and not when he was getting chipped and doubled his junior year. He was fifth on the team in tackles and led in tackles for loss, though he got more attention than anybody on the Virginia D. He may be light, but he does not get pushed around.

I don't know how much difference stance really makes. Virginia ran a 4-3 with Harold lined up over an OT almost every snap, though he did stand up from that position on most passing downs.

I'm not advocating Harold's selection at #27. To be truthful, I was more impressed by Max Valles in 2014. But Valles played SLB, not defensive end, where he was protected by Harold and the rest of the DL. IMHO, though, saying Eli Harold isn't strong enough or not football player enough to play defensive end in the NFL, or only succeeded in college because he played against guys who won't be playing on Sundays is flat wrong.

 

[lostar2009]

Love him to do what? 248lbs to play what? I dont get everybodies love for these tweeners. You people do remember this team plays a 4-3 right? They dont need olbs, they need SDE. 270lbs and up

I wonder how much he can bulk up ?

 

[Tobal]

I


Harold played every down 4-3 defensive end on a team with zero depth and no offense, a team that finished 2014-2015 18th in the country in rushing defense. I'm not a coach and I'm not a scout, but I saw every game of Eli's college career (about 70% of them in person) and I can tell you that he was never a liability against the run, not when he was starting as a freshman and not when he was getting chipped and doubled his junior year. He was fifth on the team in tackles and led in tackles for loss, though he got more attention than anybody on the Virginia D. He may be light, but he does not get pushed around.

I don't know how much difference stance really makes. Virginia ran a 4-3 with Harold lined up over an OT almost every snap, though he did stand up from that position on most passing downs.

I'm not advocating Harold's selection at #27. To be truthful, I was more impressed by Max Valles in 2014. But Valles played SLB, not defensive end, where he was protected by Harold and the rest of the DL. IMHO, though, saying Eli Harold isn't strong enough or not football player enough to play defensive end in the NFL, or only succeeded in college because he played against guys who won't be playing on Sundays is flat wrong.

I was impressed with him when his hand was on the ground. I thought he closed quickly on the tackles and popped them much harder than I would have thought. I like that he's fine with contact many guys especially smaller guys want to avoid contact, but he looked to me like he enjoys it. I'm like you I'm not advocating taking him at 27. I don't think he's very refined and I never played DE, but it seems like his technique is lacking. I do however like the player, he had a great motor, no fear of contact and impressive physical abilities. I know nothing about his mental makeup though.

 

[VACowboy]

I was impressed with him when his hand was on the ground. I thought he closed quickly on the tackles and popped them much harder than I would have thought. I like that he's fine with contact many guys especially smaller guys want to avoid contact, but he looked to me like he enjoys it. I'm like you I'm not advocating taking him at 27. I don't think he's very refined and I never played DE, but it seems like his technique is lacking. I do however like the player, he had a great motor, no fear of contact and impressive physical abilities. I know nothing about his mental makeup though.

He started as a true frosh and instantly became the focal point of opposing OC's. He played almost every defensive snap during his three years at Virginia. I think he loves the game and appreciates that he gets to play it, at least that's what I've gotten from three years-worth of post-game interviews. He plays hard, snap to snap, and never takes a down off.

I don't mind him not being a refined pass rusher. (JPP wasn't, either.) Hand use, footwork and all other technique can be taught (he already has a pretty good hump move). What you can't teach is speed, athleticism and desire, and Eli has those three things in spades. He's light, not small. He's 6-4 and around 250 now. As a junior. I think he'll play at 260-265 for most of his career.

Like I said in another thread: I hate it when teams acquire talent around a scheme instead of acquiring the best players possible and tailoring schemes to fit the talent. If Eli Harold is at the top of my board at #27, I take him and find a big 1-tech to play beside him.

 

[supercowboy8]

I


Harold played every down 4-3 defensive end on a team with zero depth and no offense, a team that finished 2014-2015 18th in the country in rushing defense. I'm not a coach and I'm not a scout, but I saw every game of Eli's college career (about 70% of them in person) and I can tell you that he was never a liability against the run, not when he was starting as a freshman and not when he was getting chipped and doubled his junior year. He was fifth on the team in tackles and led in tackles for loss, though he got more attention than anybody on the Virginia D. He may be light, but he does not get pushed around.

I don't know how much difference stance really makes. Virginia ran a 4-3 with Harold lined up over an OT almost every snap, though he did stand up from that position on most passing downs.

I'm not advocating Harold's selection at #27. To be truthful, I was more impressed by Max Valles in 2014. But Valles played SLB, not defensive end, where he was protected by Harold and the rest of the DL. IMHO, though, saying Eli Harold isn't strong enough or not football player enough to play defensive end in the NFL, or only succeeded in college because he played against guys who won't be playing on Sundays is flat wrong.

Standing up and playing with a hand In the dirt makes a big Difference. Some guys don't have the hands or strength or power to play with hands in the dirt. Your most likely to engage with the OT. Standing up gives you alittle more quickness around the OT.
Harold played most standing up amd went or tried to go around. Hardly ever attacked inside. Just used quickness. I just think you need more than one way of getting to the QB. Harold only has 1 way.

 

[supercowboy8]

You keep talking about video evidence, yet there is video evidence above with his hand in the dirt getting to the QB for a hit or sack quickly. Isnt that what you asked for? Now you say show clips where he doesn't do well? You keep suggesting video evidence yet you've done nothing in this thread but puff your chest out saying how you're right and most everyone else is wrong and hes going to bust. Maybe he does go to a 3-4 team, how does that prove he can't play in a 4-3? Maybe he does bust, but he has the blue chip potential you look for in a high pick.If you don't like him so be it, but the fact you have to argue with everyone else to prove how "right" you are is dumb and I won't do it. I showed a few clips like you asked so take it or leave it.

No the one he was standing up vs louisville. The one vs florida was 4 point stance in a wide 9. The other 2 one being vandy with a no name non nfl OT. And that was his only play of that game. i was there in 2013.

He's a perfect 34 OLB and is to raw to be a 43 DE traditional 3 point stance that we use.

Doesn't matter and I'm do e talking about him. He will be picked top 20 to a 34 team. Look at marcus smith, who reminds me alot of dupree, and dee ford last year. Pass rushers don't last long especially with 34 teams.

Phili, browns, pitt, arizona, and the saints all could use a 34 OLB

 

[VACowboy]

I just think you need more than one way of getting to the QB. Harold only has 1 way.

If that's what you think, you didn't watch very much Virginia football. Did he rush the edge a lot? Yeah. But he also used that to bait tackles, get them off balance and rush inside. I don't think he needs to bring huge repertoire of moves with him to be a good pro. Those can and be taught.

 

[supercowboy8]

If that's what you think, you didn't watch very much Virginia football. Did he rush the edge a lot? Yeah. But he also used that to bait tackles, get them off balance and rush inside. I don't think he needs to bring huge repertoire of moves with him to be a good pro. Those can and be taught.

Im going to have start watching alot more as I just moved from nashville to Williamsburg.

But yes it does matter when your talking about a 1st round pick top 30 player.

His skills are prefect for the 34 but still very very raw for a 43 DE.

 

[Tobal]

He started as a true frosh and instantly became the focal point of opposing OC's. He played almost every defensive snap during his three years at Virginia. I think he loves the game and appreciates that he gets to play it, at least that's what I've gotten from three years-worth of post-game interviews. He plays hard, snap to snap, and never takes a down off.

I don't mind him not being a refined pass rusher. (JPP wasn't, either.) Hand use, footwork and all other technique can be taught (he already has a pretty good hump move). What you can't teach is speed, athleticism and desire, and Eli has those three things in spades. He's light, not small. He's 6-4 and around 250 now. As a junior. I think he'll play at 260-265 for most of his career.

Like I said in another thread: I hate it when teams acquire talent around a scheme instead of acquiring the best players possible and tailoring schemes to fit the talent. If Eli Harold is at the top of my board at #27, I take him and find a big 1-tech to play beside him.

Honestly knowing he's got the attitude to go with the motor makes me really think i'd like to get him at 27. I watched him against Miami and he got completely wash on a running play. Then suddenly he's back in the play stripping the ball.

I don't care for him standing up to be honest. I think he hesitates when he stands up and isn't decisive. When his hand is on the ground he dictates to the tackle.

He's more exciting to me than anything we currently have on this team as far as rushing the passer. He at least makes the QB move or be aware of him. When I said he wasn't refined I meant that as a compliment. I just like the thought of what Rod could do with him.

 

[Tobal]

Im going to have start watching alot more as I just moved from nashville to Williamsburg.

But yes it does matter when your talking about a 1st round pick top 30 player.

His skills are prefect for the 34 but still very very raw for a 43 DE.

I think his measurable s fit a 3-4, but I think his skills and style fit a 4-3

 

[supercowboy8]

I think his measurable s fit a 3-4, but I think his skills and style fit a 4-3

To each their own. I think he is full 34 only

 

[Tobal]

To each their own. I think he is full 34 only

I'm not saying this as an ***, but I really am asking what games you watched. I ask because I want to find them and see if I see what you see.

 

[supercowboy8]

I'm not saying this as an ***, but I really am asking what games you watched. I ask because I want to find them and see if I see what you see.

the UCLA game is the best example. Shows 90% of the time he is standing up and only can rush around the edge. Once a lineman gets hands on him or he gets stopped at the edge he is done.

The FSU game is terrible. Just shows he has no pass rush moves. He tries to go to the out side and yse quickness. Doesn't use his hands and plays with his hands to high. Can't disengage.

 

[AshyLarry06]

the UCLA game is the best example. Shows 90% of the time he is standing up and only can rush around the edge. Once a lineman gets hands on him or he gets stopped at the edge he is done.

The FSU game is terrible. Just shows he has no pass rush moves. He tries to go to the out side and yse quickness. Doesn't use his hands and plays with his hands to high. Can't disengage.

Yeah, clearly the kid will never amount to anything in the NFL as a 4-3 defense bc of the fact that he is far from fully refined as he enters the NFL draft. I mean seriously, do people ACTUALLY expect the kid to somehow miraculously IMPROVE his strength, technique, and overall skill and understanding of the DE position during his first couple of years in the NFL under the tutelage of Rod Marinelli?!?! Ha Ha! I pity the misguided souls who truly think that this absurd idea is even remotely plausible...

 

[supercowboy8]

Yeah, clearly the kid will never amount to anything in the NFL as a 4-3 defense bc of the fact that he is far from fully refined as he enters the NFL draft. I mean seriously, do people ACTUALLY expect the kid to somehow miraculously IMPROVE his strength, technique, and overall skill and understanding of the DE position during his first couple of years in the NFL under the tutelage of Rod Marinelli?!?! Ha Ha! I pity the misguided souls who truly think that this absurd idea is even remotely plausible...

I never said he couldn't improve but as a 1st round pick Jerry Stephen and Garrett all said 1st round picks must start day 1. I'm saying he isn't a 1st round pick. That's all I ever said.

 

[AshyLarry06]

I never said he couldn't improve but as a 1st round pick Jerry Stephen and Garrett all said 1st round picks must start day 1. I'm saying he isn't a 1st round pick. That's all I ever said.

Well you certainly are entitled to your own opinion so I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.