NBA 2016 Offseason: Draft, Trades & Free Agency

[RonSpringsdaman20]

leo barbosa to suns....


next year... the warriors may be 4 all league performers, 4 36 and upers....and 4 d leaguers... lol...
they are gonna be capped out..

 

[jterrell]

leo barbosa to suns....


next year... the warriors may be 4 all league performers, 4 36 and upers....and 4 d leaguers... lol...
they are gonna be capped out..

this CBA is so ridiculously crooked that it allows teams over the cap to add more and more good players.
MLE, bi-annual exception or whatever they call that now and refusal of most teams to pay mid-range deals means ring chasing is easier than ever.

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

this CBA is so ridiculously crooked that it allows teams over the cap to add more and more good players.
MLE, bi-annual exception or whatever they call that now and refusal of most teams to pay mid-range deals means ring chasing is easier than ever.

cba is gonna be redone next year anyway... by December the threat of strike and lockout will loom.

 

[jterrell]

cba is gonna be redone next year anyway... by December the threat of strike and lockout will loom.

yea, i hate that stuff but this cba needs adjusted mightily.
not sure how to best handle it but it does need to create a real NBA middle class for both players and teams.

maybe NFL like franchise tag designation. 1 year deal for 125% of highest paid payer at your position. can tag same player only twice.
also teams exceeding cap by taxpayer level lose all exceptions and can only sign minimum deals for players with 5 years or less worth of service.

kd may well look like a genius if he ends up last superstar to move.

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

No offense man but you are simply wrong. They track this stuff. Curry averages 4.2 dribbles every touch and his average touch is also 4+seconds.
He is in a high flying offense that generally gets up shots in less than 3 seconds so his numbers are higher by percentage because when they do not get quick shot it is generally him holding the ball and creating off the dribble.

Is he a hold it and pound ball into the floor guy? Not really but by GSW standards he is by far the closest thing they have.
GSW average dribbles per touch is actually the lowest in the league at 1.9. Curry is easily the highest they have.

He isn't running through 15 mins of dribbling drills before every game for fun. He dribbles and attacks a lot. He is very ball dominant within that offense.
Coming off screens is a secondary part of his game.

Interestingly enough the worst case of this in the league is Russell Westbrook. He is definitely a ball hog.
Wonder how much that had to do with KD leaving to become part of a faster offense with more shots per game?

Harrison Barnes is obviously a VERY poor man's KD. Will be fun to watch him grow in Dallas IMHO.

So what really is the point of calling him "ball dominant" in the context of the fast paced offense GSW runs? The context is what defines the relevance of the term.

It's like describing a guy leading his team in batting at just .225, as the team's "best" hitter.

BTW, if you could provide the link to that data you're referencing I'd like to look at it myself.

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

It's a losing battle JT. I tried for days and couldn't get those things across.

LOL......

Sorry, when it's clear you don't have a clue of what you're talking about, it's tough for me (or anyone) to accept those things you're trying to get across.

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

So what really is the point of calling him "ball dominant" in the context of the fast paced offense GSW runs? The context is what defines the relevance of the term.

It's like describing a guy leading his team in batting at just .225, as the team's "best" hitter.

BTW, if you could provide the link to that data you're referencing I'd like to look at it myself.

agree.

 

[jterrell]

So what really is the point of calling him "ball dominant" in the context of the fast paced offense GSW runs? The context is what defines the relevance of the term.

It's like describing a guy leading his team in batting at just .225, as the team's "best" hitter.

BTW, if you could provide the link to that data you're referencing I'd like to look at it myself.

He's still regardless of offense a ball dominant player. Within the offense he is BAY FAR the most ball dominant player.
And since Harrison Barnes was in that offense the context is what matters. Barnes wasn't getting many touches and he definitely wasn't holding the ball or taking dribbles.
You seem like a pretty sharp guy so surely get what I am saying here and would agree going form a 4th or 5th option at times in GS is a far cry from being the 2nd or 3rd option in Dallas.

http://stats.nba.com/tracking/#!/pl...16&SeasonType=Regular Season&PlayerPosition=G
Wouldn't pull for me just now. It's a massive database obviously.

 

[jterrell]

agree.

The most unfortunate thing is when people agree with obviously faulty assessments.
This is common sense, factual data and pretty much ever other kind of logical.

Not sure why it is confusing, or open to debate.

Curry is one of if not the best ball handler in basketball.
He is shooting or dribbling an inordinate number of possessions.
Even on his catch and shoot 3's he generally starts the possession or it was fast break.

Worse I provided the data....

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

The most unfortunate thing is when people agree with obviously faulty assessments.
This is common sense, factual data and pretty much ever other kind of logical.

Not sure why it is confusing, or open to debate.

Curry is one of if not the best ball handler in basketball.
He is shooting or dribbling an inordinate number of possessions.
Even on his catch and shoot 3's he generally starts the possession or it was fast break.

Worse I provided the data....

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Sorry, when it's clear you don't have a clue of what you're talking about, it's tough for me (or anyone) to accept those things you're trying to get across.

See what I mean JT?

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

Mo Buckets to the Clips for the Vets minimum...

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

See what I mean JT?

Don't try to lump yourself in with JT. He at least has some data he's utilizing to make a conclusion (I disagree with) and is informed.

You, meanwhile, shouldn't even be on this thread trying to talk basketball, lol.

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

He's still regardless of offense a ball dominant player. Within the offense he is BAY FAR the most ball dominant player.
And since Harrison Barnes was in that offense the context is what matters. Barnes wasn't getting many touches and he definitely wasn't holding the ball or taking dribbles.
You seem like a pretty sharp guy so surely get what I am saying here and would agree going form a 4th or 5th option at times in GS is a far cry from being the 2nd or 3rd option in Dallas.

http://stats.nba.com/tracking/#!/player/possessions/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Regular Season&PlayerPosition=G
Wouldn't pull for me just now. It's a massive database obviously.

And context is what renders your application of the term "ball dominant" meaningless.

I was able to access the database and after looking for myself, I quickly realized you simply aren't painting the whole picture.

Only one team in the entire NBA dribbled less per touch than the Warriors, meaning, the ball wasn't touching the court much as it's being passed around (a notion supported by the fact they led the entire league in team assists).

You mention Curry's average number of dribbles-per-touch, as if it's an inordinate number, yet you fail to provide the context that he's ranked 93rd IN THE LEAGUE in that category, lol. He's also ranked 97th in the league in average time-per-touch.

Of course he's going to lead his team in those categories. Why? Because someone has to. As the PG, he's going to have his fair share of touches taking the ball up the court and dribbling. Even then, his numbers comparatively with the rest of the league aren't even in the same stratosphere. And if you look at Shaun Livingston's numbers, the backup PG, you'll see they were very close and not this huge delta you were making it seem.

In regard to Barnes. Yeah, Barnes wasn't dribbling much because he's evolved into a spot-up shooter. While his dribbling has improved since his college days, he's still not comfortable trying to create his own shot or take guys off the dribble. He's best in transition and as a spot-up shooter which limits his offensive potential.

 

[Biggems]

And context is what renders your application of the term "ball dominant" meaningless.

I was able to access the database and after looking for myself, I quickly realized you simply aren't painting the whole picture.

Only one team in the entire NBA dribbled less per touch than the Warriors, meaning, the ball wasn't touching the court much as it's being passed around (a notion supported by the fact they led the entire league in team assists).

You mention Curry's average number of dribbles-per-touch, as if it's an inordinate number, yet you fail to provide the context that he's ranked 93rd IN THE LEAGUE in that category, lol. He's also ranked 97th in the league in average time-per-touch.

Of course he's going to lead his team in those categories. Why? Because someone has to. As the PG, he's going to have his fair share of touches taking the ball up the court and dribbling. Even then, his numbers comparatively with the rest of the league aren't even in the same stratosphere. And if you look at Shaun Livingston's numbers, the backup PG, you'll see they were very close and not this huge delta you were making it seem.

In regard to Barnes. Yeah, Barnes wasn't dribbling much because he's evolved into a spot-up shooter. While his dribbling has improved since his college days, he's still not comfortable trying to create his own shot or take guys off the dribble. He's best in transition and as a spot-up shooter which limits his offensive potential.

Outstanding post. JT is once again proven wrong. My Spurs have been proving him wrong for years, and you can feel his angst and disdain for their greatness, which will continue on for at least the next 5 years.

Curry isn't a ball hog, but he does take a lot of poor, ill-advised shots, that fortunately for him go in at a decent percentage. Still, his shot selection would not have been tolerated in the 80s, 90s, and early 00s. The game hase definitely changed quite a bit.

GO SPURS GO

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Don't try to lump yourself in with JT. He at least has some data he's utilizing to make a conclusion (I disagree with) and is informed.

You, meanwhile, shouldn't even be on this thread trying to talk basketball, lol.

And it goes on. You, my friend, have no business trying to tell anybody, what they should or should not do. You take care of you and let everybody else take care of themselves.

He was trying to tell you exactly the same thing I was earlier. You did to him, what you did to me. You refuse to face the simple truth of the matter. It's fine with me if you don't want to entertain that idea but don't try and sell yourself as an authority of any kind. You don't understand your own team and that's the simple truth of it.

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

And it goes on. You, my friend, have no business trying to tell anybody, what they should or should not do. You take care of you and let everybody else take care of themselves.

He was trying to tell you exactly the same thing I was earlier. You did to him, what you did to me. You refuse to face the simple truth of the matter. It's fine with me if you don't want to entertain that idea but don't try and sell yourself as an authority of any kind. You don't understand your own team and that's the simple truth of it.

You have no clue of what you're talking about, so like a parasite you're trying to latch onto JT's argument which has zero relevance to what you were claiming.

Cute. But a cheap tactic nonetheless.

And BTW, if you bother reading the thread, once JT provided the link to the stats, it's been made clear his use of the statistics was completely off the mark.

You're out of your depth.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

You have no clue of what you're talking about, so like a parasite you're trying to latch onto JT's argument which has zero relevance to what you were claiming.

Cute. But a cheap tactic nonetheless.

And BTW, if you bother reading the thread, once JT provided the link to the stats, it's been made clear his use of the statistics was completely off the mark.

You're out of your depth.

Your story, you tell it.

 

[darthseinfeld]

Celtics reportedly on the verge of a big trade. Rumors are it's either Blake Griffin, Demarcus Cousins or Russell Westbrook.

The most fleshed out rumor ive seen has Griffin going to Boston, Crowder to Sac, and Gay to LAC, with other assets involved. Im assuming the Celtics would be sending picks ( including at least 1 Brooklyn pick) to LA