Penn State Sex Abuse Scandal (Indictment Post #144, "Pimping" Allegations Post #442)

[Yakuza Rich]

While we're on that subject of knowing him and what not I find this interesting to some degree.

Barry Switzer said yesterday that there is no way that the people on that staff, who work so closely together for so long, didn't know.

Barry was saying that, and drawing that, from his own experience of coaching college football for a long period of time. He made it clear that in his opinion there is absolutely no way that people didn't know.

What are the people's thoughts on that?

I'm just curious about that so please don't take it as an indictment on Joe Pa. I'm not saying it effects anything in anyway at all. I'm just curious as to what people feel about an opinion like that of a coach with more than enough experience in the college coaching world to have some credibility on the subject.

I understand what Barry is saying.

It's extremely possible that in 1998, Paterno had no idea. As one poster posted here...he had a friend and colleague that was a sex addict and getting prostitutes and nobody knew about it. There was a case of a guy in Long Island robbing banks and his wife, plausibly, didn't know about it. Look at the people who had NO idea about the BTK killer.

However, once 1998 happened....and that was investigated by UNIVERSITY police...there's no way Paterno didn't know. These coaches have good connections with the DA, chief of police and chief of university police. I know for a fact that Jim Boeheim has good connections with each of these people and tons of people in the police force. And he is nowhere near the status of Joe Paterno.

It's like Cowherd said...TMZ didn't create rumors and innuendo. Rumors and innuendo (and their popularity) created TMZ.

It's very tight knit in athletic departments. For programs itself, it's even tighter.

Paterno has indicted himself. No way does he go right to the AD in 2002 without once asking or confronting Sandusky.

Everybody but the blind knows this.





YR

 

[TellerMorrow34]

I honestly believe this could happen anywhere. Any company, any university, any charity. Anywhere. The fact that it happened at Penn State is incidental for me. I would have the same reaction if it took place at Microsoft.

Penn State is where it happened, so all those involved up and down the chain both at the university, the charity and any other group or individual that had knowledge regarding Sandusky needs to pay a steep price. That includes Sandusky's lawyer that also happens to work for his charity.

I agree. Completely.

An excellent post.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

.

However, once 1998 happened....and that was investigated by UNIVERSITY police...there's no way Paterno didn't know. These coaches have good connections with the DA, chief of police and chief of university police. I know for a fact that Jim Boeheim has good connections with each of these people and tons of people in the police force. And he is nowhere near the status of Joe Paterno.

YR

And keep this in mind, Sandusky was Joe's #1 assistant and Joe was Sandusky's immediate supervisor. Someone had to tell Joe that, "Hey Joe, we've got a problem with Jerry, he could be going to jail for blah, blah, blah, so you need to be prepared."

Joe was Sandusky's supervisor and had to be told about the investigation, not too mention the potential turmoil it would have caused the entire program in 1998.

My gosh, keeping supervisors appraised of underling's legal problems is standard procedure.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Found this intersting from the article link posted above...


Then-Centre County District Attorney Ray Gricar set up a sting in the mother’s home. Sandusky had requested to meet with the mom, and Gricar had officers hide in another room and listen to their conversation.

One of those officers was Detective Ron Schreffler, the lead investigator in the case.

According to the presentment, Sandusky asked the mom for forgiveness.

“I understand. I was wrong. I wish I could get forgiveness from you. I know I won’t get it from you. I wish I were dead,” Sandusky said.

Gricar knew the results of the sting before he made his decision not to prosecute.

The Centre County Office of Children and Youth Services also was investigating that case.

Investigator Jerry Lauro said this week he didn’t feel there was enough evidence for abuse charges solely based on interviews with the boys.

“At that time, the information that we had wasn’t sufficient enough to substantiate a case,” Lauro said. “I don’t want [the mother)] to think we didn’t believe their kid back then. We did, but we didn’t have enough.”

Lauro said Schreffler never told him the details of Sandusky’s confession at the victim’s house.



So the police didn't tell child protective services about Sandusky's confession... Wow!

 

[joseephuss]

Found this intersting from the article link posted above...


Then-Centre County District Attorney Ray Gricar set up a sting in the mother’s home. Sandusky had requested to meet with the mom, and Gricar had officers hide in another room and listen to their conversation.

One of those officers was Detective Ron Schreffler, the lead investigator in the case.

According to the presentment, Sandusky asked the mom for forgiveness.

“I understand. I was wrong. I wish I could get forgiveness from you. I know I won’t get it from you. I wish I were dead,” Sandusky said.

Gricar knew the results of the sting before he made his decision not to prosecute.

The Centre County Office of Children and Youth Services also was investigating that case.

Investigator Jerry Lauro said this week he didn’t feel there was enough evidence for abuse charges solely based on interviews with the boys.

“At that time, the information that we had wasn’t sufficient enough to substantiate a case,” Lauro said. “I don’t want [the mother)] to think we didn’t believe their kid back then. We did, but we didn’t have enough.”

Lauro said Schreffler never told him the details of Sandusky’s confession at the victim’s house.



So the police didn't tell child protective services about Sandusky's confession... Wow!

The list of people who essentially turned a blind eye to Sandusky's actions is very long.

 

[JBond]

The list of people who essentially turned a blind eye to Sandusky's actions is very long.

Follow the money. Always follow the money.

 

[TellerMorrow34]

Follow the money. Always follow the money.

Sadly accurate statement.

 

[yimyammer]

Weird oddity related to this whole mess:

Gricar was the prosecutor who decided not to pursue charges, and that has caused a media firestorm of questions about whether the strange and unsolved mystery of Gricar's April 2005 disappearance had any connection to the allegations of child sex abuse against Sandusky.

Source: http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2011/11/gricar_detective_looking_for_1.html

I remember watching the episode of Disappeared on the ID channel discussing this guy (http://investigation.discovery.com/tv/disappeared/the-missing/ray-gricar.html) but it made no mention of Sandusky.

It may never be known why he disappeared or what happened to him, but its odd that he was tied to the Penn St investigation and his computer hard drives were destroyed.

just strikes me as odd given what we now know

 

[casmith07]

YR -- just wanted to follow-up on the Whistleblower Protection Act question/thought, the WPA of 1989 only protects Federal employees, and only when they report government agency failures, crimes, gross negligence, fraud waste & abuse, etc. through the approved channels, all of which are listed in the statute.

I'm unsure of why McQueary still has a job if they're cleaning house from the top down.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

YR -- just wanted to follow-up on the Whistleblower Protection Act question/thought, the WPA of 1989 only protects Federal employees, and only when they report government agency failures, crimes, gross negligence, fraud waste & abuse, etc. through the approved channels, all of which are listed in the statute.

I'm unsure of why McQueary still has a job if they're cleaning house from the top down.

Thanks, amigo.






YR

 

[bbgun]

 

[Yakuza Rich]

Weird oddity related to this whole mess:



Source: http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2011/11/gricar_detective_looking_for_1.html

I remember watching the episode of Disappeared on the ID channel discussing this guy (http://investigation.discovery.com/tv/disappeared/the-missing/ray-gricar.html) but it made no mention of Sandusky.

It may never be known why he disappeared or what happened to him, but its odd that he was tied to the Penn St investigation and his computer hard drives were destroyed.

just strikes me as odd given what we now know

I doubt that Gricar's disappearance had anything to do with it. It's still an avenue that should be looked at, but I doubt it. Mainly because it was well after the Sandusky incidents and it would just be a weird timeline. I think with Gricar, the case is really about the laptop and what was on it.







YR

 

[bbgun]

YR -- just wanted to follow-up on the Whistleblower Protection Act question/thought, the WPA of 1989 only protects Federal employees, and only when they report government agency failures, crimes, gross negligence, fraud waste & abuse, etc. through the approved channels, all of which are listed in the statute.

I'm unsure of why McQueary still has a job if they're cleaning house from the top down.

Anyone who knew about this but did not report it to the police should be gone. McQueary took the coward's way out (calling Daddy instead of the authorities in deference to his future job prospects).

 

[TNCowboy]

Anyone who knew about this but did not report it to the police should be gone. McQueary took the coward's way out (calling Daddy instead of the authorities in deference to his future job prospects).

A lawyer on ESPN this morning suggested that PSU is not firing McQueary as a means to hold onto him as a witness.

 

[bbgun]

A lawyer on ESPN this morning suggested that PSU is not firing McQueary as a means to hold onto him as a witness.

Fine, but they were prepared to let him coach this weekend, and that's outrageous.

 

[casmith07]

Thanks, amigo.

YR

No problem.

Anyone who knew about this but did not report it to the police should be gone. McQueary took the coward's way out (calling Daddy instead of the authorities in deference to his future job prospects).

I'm pretty upset about that. He definitely took the coward's way out, especially as a grown man.

 

[TNCowboy]

Fine, but they were prepared to let him coach this weekend, and that's outrageous.

I think they're probably uncertain as to what to do. It's uncharted water for all of them, I'm sure.

They probably thought they were going to hold onto him a while, so what's the difference? Only when they realized the public furor did they decide against it. I think they initially planned to let Paterno coach out the rest of the season before it began to sink in how bad this all was.

The one thing that I didn't get, and maybe someone else who saw it can clarify, but I'm not sure if Jack Ford (the attorney) was suggesting that PSU was holding onto McQueary to preserve the truth, or if it were in an effort to control what information McQueary lets out. As tight as the Happy Valley community was in protecting Paterno, it wouldn't shock me if the school officials thought that they could still control this thing, to a degree. But I think Ford was saying that they wanted to use McQueary to get to the unvarnished truth with as little filter as possible.

 

[casmith07]

A lawyer on ESPN this morning suggested that PSU is not firing McQueary as a means to hold onto him as a witness.

Absurd. The prosecution or the defense can subpoena witnesses relevant to their case.

Where'd that guy get his JD?

Edit: read your updated post. In theory that's a great idea, but in practice it's horrible.

 

[JBond]

No problem.



I'm pretty upset about that. He definitely took the coward's way out, especially as a grown man.

There is something weird/creepy/odd about McQuery. He is brave enough to step in between two football players wielding knives in a fight in the cafeteria, but is too chicken **** to stop an old man from anally raping a 10 year old boy in the shower. Something is not right with that guy.

I think I understand why the State Penn has chosen to keep him on. They don't want him doing the rounds of news/talk shows. I am sure there is a confidentiality agreement he has signed as a condition of employment.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

I think they're probably uncertain as to what to do. It's uncharted water for all of them, I'm sure.

They probably thought they were going to hold onto him a while, so what's the difference? Only when they realized the public furor did they decide against it. I think they initially planned to let Paterno coach out the rest of the season before it began to sink in how bad this all was.

The one thing that I didn't get, and maybe someone else who saw it can clarify, but I'm not sure if Jack Ford (the attorney) was suggesting that PSU was holding onto McQueary to preserve the truth, or if it were in an effort to control what information McQueary lets out. As tight as the Happy Valley community was in protecting Paterno, it wouldn't shock me if the school officials thought that they could still control this thing, to a degree. But I think Ford was saying that they wanted to use McQueary to get to the unvarnished truth with as little filter as possible.

I still feel like they are trying to circle the wagons and preserve themselves. Almost every man for himself, but with some people teaming up with others to escape as much of the blame and accountability they can.

I say this because I've yet to hear out of one of the people involved that they are going to actually work towards finding the truth out. It's been mostly 'say a prayer for the victims' and then start passing the blame, minimizing the guilt and talking about saving the rest of the season.

I think we have to remember that McQueary is more or less a 'man without a country' right now. Nobody outside of Happy Valley wants to be affiliated with him and there's quite a few people *in* Happy Valley angry at him for various different reasons. So, he could very well have a ton of dirt on him and the school's big wigs, which have done a poor job of telling the truth so far...could be trying to persuade him with ways to keep his mouth shut.

I think the only life preserve of McQueary is either the school promises him a liftime job for him keeping his mouth shut or Paterno comes out and places all of the blame on himself (even though that's not the case) and publicly absolves McQueary.

It wouldn't make it right...but as far as a life preserve for McQueary goes...that's all he's possibly got, IMO.










YR