Penn State Sex Abuse Scandal (Indictment Post #144, "Pimping" Allegations Post #442)

[peplaw06]

Yikes, that ain't good. McQueary looks worse and worse the more this story goes on. I hope he doesn't screw up the case against Sandusky since he is looking more and more like an unreliable witness. I would not be able to work with, for or near a guy after seeing him molest a child and I know I am not alone in that attitude.

With McQueary still being on the staff, I'm sure there will be lots of instances shown like this. Sandusky had run of the PSU facilities right?

 

[WV Cowboy]

Let me tell you something about integrity junior. Integrity doesn't come from some internet board. Integrity doesn't come by joining the crowd of sheep. But integrity comes when you do the thing that you know is right in the face of growing opposition, regardless of the consequences.

That my friend is integrity.

You mean like reporting a known child predator, even though it might bring down the mighty Penn State Football Kingdom?

The guilty are gone. They have been removed, yet you want more and more blood.

Do you believe that?
That nobody else knew anything all of those years.

I don't.

 

[Stautner]

Yikes, that ain't good. McQueary looks worse and worse the more this story goes on. I hope he doesn't screw up the case against Sandusky since he is looking more and more like an unreliable witness. I would not be able to work with, for or near a guy after seeing him molest a child and I know I am not alone in that attitude.

I am assuming some of the victims will be testifying, because regardless of how credible (or incredible) McQueary may seem, at least a victim or two will be needed to send Sandusky up the river. Last I knew the victim McQueary saw hadn't been identified, so that leaves his account as his word against Sandusky, and the prosecution will want something more solid than that to take to trial.

 

[JBond]

what would that accomplish? the school itself allowed his behavior, should they pay for everyone who attends Penn State to transfer to the school of their choice and just close down acedemically as well?

Nothing that happens will undo what transpired, nor will it in any way make it right. The only thing I would expect the University to do, is fire everyone involved. Closing down the football program accomplishes nothing.

The program is part of the problem. It was the reason for the cover up. Make the money and shut up about nailing little boys in the bathroom. That is how they operated and they should be punished. They allowed the program to become a recruiting tool for a pedophile. The program covered so they could continue to make the money.

 

[Stautner]

The program is part of the problem. It was the reason for the cover up. Make the money and shut up about nailing little boys in the bathroom. That is how they operated and they should be punished. They allowed the program to become a recruiting tool for a pedophile. The program covered so they could continue to make the money.

The higher ups interested in the money are not the same as the program that is made up of maybe as many as 150-200 people who had nothing to do with, or any knowledge of Sandusky's actions.

If players and coaches spread throughout the entire program are receiving gifts and perks in order to have a successful team and make money for the school, and that is covered up (as with SMU), then every vein that runs through the program is infected, and that's when the death penalty is appropriate. If a small handful of people, most of whose responsibilities weren't solely related to the football program, screw up, they are the problem, and the veins running throughout the program are not infected. In that case the death penalty makes no sense.

If it's just the money you are worried about, have the University give excess profits to childrens advocy groups for 3 years - that would keep the University from making a ton of money off football, and would actually do some good rather than pull the rug out from under a ton of people who don't deserve it, which doesn't have a positive effect on anyone or anything.

 

[JBond]

The higher ups interested in the money are not the same as the program that is made up of maybe as many as 150-200 people who had nothing to do with, or any knowledge of Sandusky's actions.

If players and coaches spread throughout the entire program are receiving gifts and perks in order to have a successful team and make money for the school, and that is covered up (as with SMU), then every vein that runs through the program is infected, and that's when the death penalty is appropriate. If a small handful of people, most of whose responsibilities weren't solely related to the football program, screw up, they are the problem, and the veins running throughout the program are not infected. In that case the death penalty makes no sense.

If it's just the money you are worried about, have the University give excess profits to childrens advocy groups for 3 years - that would keep the University from making a ton of money off football, and would actually do some good rather than pull the rug out from under a ton of people who don't deserve it, which doesn't have a positive effect on anyone or anything.

At this point we have no idea how deeply the evil has infected Penn State. We do not know it is limited to a handful of people. The pimping ring info has not come out yet. Boosters? Board members? We don't know yet. What was made public was the leaders of Penn State allowed a predator to rape children. The knowingly allowed him to use the university and the football program to rape children. Until Penn State figures out it is not more important than the children it allowed to be raped, no punishment is harsh enough. Penn State and the atmosphere that placed money and "The Program" above everything else is the problem. They have proven to be too irresponsible to have a program for the time being.

The secretary at Enron did not deserve to lose her job, but she did. It happens when your leaders are despicable humans, but people move on and find new jobs and recover.

I have mentioned several times the kids deserve some money. I like your idea regarding that.

 

[Stautner]

At this point we have no idea how deeply the evil has infected Penn State. We do not know it is limited to a handful of people. The pimping ring info has not come out yet. Boosters? Board members? We don't know yet. What was made public was the leaders of Penn State allowed a predator to rape children. The knowingly allowed him to use the university and the football program to rape children. Until Penn State figures out it is not more important than the children it allowed to be raped, no punishment is harsh enough. Penn State and the atmosphere that placed money and "The Program" above everything else is the problem. They have proven to be too irresponsible to have a program for the time being.

The secretary at Enron did not deserve to lose her job, but she did. It happens when your leaders are despicable humans, but people move on and find new jobs and recover.

I have mentioned several times the kids deserve some money. I like your idea regarding that.

I'm missing your logic on some points.

First, I accept it's true we can't say for sure that the problem doesn't go deeper than the handful of people we know about, but you are advocating taking action as if we know it does. Wouldn't the prudent thing to do be to let the investigation play out rather than assume it is appropriate to respond as if every fiber of the football program is involved? Just as we don't know that it doesn't go deeper (Boosters, Board members etc), neither do we know it does. I've said this before, but if it is proven that there was a much bigger coverup that permeated throughout the entire program, then I will have a different point of view, but for now I can only react base on the known, and not on pure speculation without foundation of any kind.

Second, the university allowed Sandusky to use the facilities, and Sandusky raped at least one child in those facilites. That does not equate, as you suggest, to the university knowingly allowing him to use the facilities for the purpose of raping children.

Third, has there been any credible source for the idea of a "pimping ring", or do you advocate shutting down the football team based on rumor that seems pretty unlikely?

 

[WV Cowboy]

Second, the university allowed Sandusky to use the facilities, and Sandusky raped at least one child in those facilites. That does not equate, as you suggest, to the university knowingly allowing him to use the facilities for the purpose of raping children.

I can't believe there are still people that are defending Penn St.

Unbelieveblae

 

[Stautner]

I can't believe there are still people that are defending Penn St.

Unbelieveblae

Look what you quoted. Do you really believe that when Sandusky was given access to the facilities it was done for the express purpose of giving him a place to rape young boys. Is that really what you think the school and Paterno had in mind?

How do you think this happened?

SANDUSKY: Joe, my old buddy, I need a place to rape young boys. Is it okay if I have access to the athletic facilities so I can do that"?

PATERNO: It's okay with me, but let me check with the AD.

Next Day .....

PATERNO: Hey, I checked with the AD, and he checked with the President and the Board of Regents, and they all approved giving you access to the football facilities so you can rape young boys.

SANDUSKY: Thanks Joe, I knew I could count on you!.


I am not defending anyone against anything that is verifyable or that is reasonable to assume, but if in your mind it is defending Penn State to not believe every wild *** rumour or suggestion anyone can throw out there, then you aren't allowing rational thought into the picture.

 

[Cajuncowboy]

You mean like reporting a known child predator, even though it might bring down the mighty Penn State Football Kingdom?

Yes, like that.

Do you believe that?
That nobody else knew anything all of those years.

I don't.

Then don't.

 

[Cajuncowboy]

I can't believe there are still people that are defending Penn St.

Unbelieveblae

No one is defending those that had anything to do with the raping of young boys or those who helped cover it up.

It's unbelievable that people don't know the difference between the guilty and the not guilty.

 

[Cajuncowboy]

I'm missing your logic on some points.

First, I accept it's true we can't say for sure that the problem doesn't go deeper than the handful of people we know about, but you are advocating taking action as if we know it does. Wouldn't the prudent thing to do be to let the investigation play out rather than assume it is appropriate to respond as if every fiber of the football program is involved? Just as we don't know that it doesn't go deeper (Boosters, Board members etc), neither do we know it does. I've said this before, but if it is proven that there was a much bigger coverup that permeated throughout the entire program, then I will have a different point of view, but for now I can only react base on the known, and not on pure speculation without foundation of any kind.

Second, the university allowed Sandusky to use the facilities, and Sandusky raped at least one child in those facilites. That does not equate, as you suggest, to the university knowingly allowing him to use the facilities for the purpose of raping children.

Third, has there been any credible source for the idea of a "pimping ring", or do you advocate shutting down the football team based on rumor that seems pretty unlikely?

That's pretty much been the MO around here. Let's take all rumors, assume they are true and assume everyone who ever had anything to do with Penn State is guilty. It's stupid as hell, but that's the running thought process.

 

[Concord]

Not useful at all. I know you well from previous discussions. There is no need for what you are trying to do.

What am I trying to do?

It was funny and I giggled at it...and I wasn't the only one to think it was funny.

And I still think it's funny.

 

[Concord]

Doesn't matter to me. Notice I ignore it because I consider the source. And his sig.

Now you're just hurting my feelings.

Gonna get you this weekend though!

GO BUCKS!

 

[Cajuncowboy]

Now you're just hurting my feelings.

Gonna get you this weekend though!

GO BUCKS!

Can't wait to see what kind of class the Ohio State fans have hen those innocent players from Penn State hit the field to destroy the Buckeyes.

I am hoping for the best from the Buckeye fans.

 

[Concord]

Can't wait to see what kind of class the Ohio State fans have hen those innocent players from Penn State hit the field to destroy the Buckeyes.

I am hoping for the best from the Buckeye fans.

Oh there will be some people who will give them crap...but I think for the most part it will be fine.

Now if Paterno was still the Coach...then all bets would have been off.

No Tressel or Paterno...never in a millions years would anyone have seen that coming after last season.

 

[Cajuncowboy]

Oh there will be some people who will give them crap...but I think for the most part it will be fine.

Now if Paterno was still the Coach...then all bets would have been off.

No Tressel or Paterno...never in a millions years would anyone have seen that coming after last season.

Agreed. Very odd football season for the Big Ten.

 

[casmith07]

I think a lot of people are suffering from confirmation bias -- they already didn't like Penn State, and with this they're using it to rail against the entire university rather than the responsible parties.

 

[Cajuncowboy]

I think a lot of people are suffering from confirmation bias -- they already didn't like Penn State, and with this they're using it to rail against the entire university rather than the responsible parties.

+1
...

 

[Yakuza Rich]

I think a lot of people are suffering from confirmation bias -- they already didn't like Penn State, and with this they're using it to rail against the entire university rather than the responsible parties.

For me, it's bittersweet. I used to date a girl that was on an athletic scholarship at Penn State. Their football program was far from clean and things got covered up. One instance was pretty bad with a football player and she was in a dorm mostly filled with athletes. Everybody knew what this player did and how it was swept under the rug and that they hated the player for it.

I believe only a very, very select few universities on the D-1 level are truly clean or about as close to being perfectly clean. I always thought that PSU was good with not having booster violations, but from my experience, the way they handled players transgressions really bothered me. Mainly because they claimed this squeeky clean image and everybody bought it hook, line and sinker.

Still, I never ever thought they would cover up something this bad. Reading the Grand Jury report was depressing. Reading some of the mothers of the victims was mortifiying. Reading victims of other sexual molestation crimes has made me tear up on more than one occasion. I'd rather this entire thing never happen if it had to mean that PSU could still maintain the squeeky clean image and cover up player transgressions.





YR