Q. Carter - What was it?

[thewivil]

Save it man. We don't owe Quincy a damn thing and I, for one, am tired of people tying to tell me I do. He had his chance. A chance none of us will ever get. He failed. I don't care why.

QC was doing something he should not have been doing. If I were doing the same thing, I would be penalized. I have zero sypmpathy for that. It is every persons right to choose what they want to do. With those choices come consequences. Some good, some bad. You choose, you live with it. You want penance for this, then you speak to your Priest. Don't you presume to tell me how I should feel about consequences of QC actions.

You my friend, have crossed the line.

None of us owe Quincy anymore than we owe the next guy. Should Quincy have been punished for his actions? Yes, he should have. Should he have been released? Probably.

But if we find out that Quincy is indeed bi-polar, then I don't see why any of us should be so harsh on him. If all his problems stem from an addiction to drugs, then that's another matter entirely.

Should we give Quincy another chance? No, but to make fun of a guy who may have a mental illness and who might be addicted to hard drugs is not very classy.

Maybe I just think of Cowboys fans as a more classy group of individuals, but some of the harsh things some people say on this forum make me think otherwise.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Not really.

He has not crossed any line.

He just has not let go himself.

Any time you call someone's beliefs or convitions into question over a matter of drugs, even weed, you have crossed the line. I have friends that smoke weed. We all probably do. It would be wrong for me to try and tell them that they are wrong for smoking it. My personal decision is not to. There personal decision is there own. I drink beer. If something happens because of that, I live with it. It's nobodies fault but my own. Nobody is pooring it down my throat. Simple as that.

But yes, I do agree with you to an extent. This issue is still alive and well in the hearts and minds of the Cowboy fan base.

 

[Alexander]

.

But if we find out that Quincy is indeed bi-polar, then I don't see why any of us should be so harsh on him.

Alonzo Spellman and Demetrius Underwood never had legions of devoted fans wondering what happened to them. Nor did they single-handedly cause franchise wide upheaval when they suffered episodes.

The whole premise was brought up. Was it the drugs or mental illness? The drugs are the obvious culprit. The fact that he may or may not be bipolar is secondary to the issue.

Many drug users have mental issues. That does not preclude them from seeking and getting help. Nor does it excuse any of their actions.

And to be completely truthful there has been more concrete evidence to support drug use than this whole bipolar notion anyways. There has been very little to support a theory which leads me to believe it is an elaborate and perhaps pandering excuse.

Should we give Quincy another chance? No, but to make fun of a guy who may have a mental illness and who might be addicted to hard drugs is not very classy.

Maybe I just think of Cowboys fans as a more classy group of individuals, but some of the harsh things some people say on this forum make me think otherwise.

Fans have also snickered at times about the other bipolar players we have had over the years. Where was your bleeding heart and sense of class in terms of Spellman and Underwood, who both did much less damage to the franchise than Carter?

As for the hard drugs issue, I have no compassion. None. Sorry.

For some reason I doubt that your conviction was as strong from those two players as this one.

 

[thewivil]

Any time you call someone's beliefs or convitions into question over a matter of drugs, even weed, you have crossed the line. I have friends that smoke weed. We all probably do. It would be wrong for me to try and tell them that they are wrong for smoking it. My personal decision is not to. There personal decision is there own. I drink beer. If something happens because of that, I live with it. It's nobodies fault but my own. Nobody is pooring it down my throat. Simple as that.

But yes, I do agree with you to an extent. This issue is still alive and well in the hearts and minds of the Cowboy fan base.

My original post and everyone thereafter was based on the fact that I thought Quincy was diagnosed with being bi-polar.

I said if he's not, then it's another matter.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

None of us owe Quincy anymore than we owe the next guy. Should Quincy have been punished for his actions? Yes, he should have. Should he have been released? Probably.

But if we find out that Quincy is indeed bi-polar, then I don't see why any of us should be so harsh on him. If all his problems stem from an addiction to drugs, then that's another matter entirely.

Should we give Quincy another chance? No, but to make fun of a guy who may have a mental illness and who might be addicted to hard drugs is not very classy.

Maybe I just think of Cowboys fans as a more classy group of individuals, but some of the harsh things some people say on this forum make me think otherwise.

I think that some substance issue is established. Be it weed or whatever, he's using something. If I were bi-polar and using drugs, I likely would not have the job I do. Who's fault is that? When you choose to play in the NFL, you also choose to be in the public eye. You open yourself to the fan base. It's part of the territory, so to speak. If he were only bi-polar, a diagnosis that has not been confirmed, to my knowledge, then I think he would have much more compasion from the fan base. This is not the case. His performance was average, at best. His attitude twords other QBs was poor. He had every chance to over come these issues and elected to go a different route. He would have been the starting QB last year had he only kept it clean. There is really no question about this. What more does one player deserve?

Your view of the fan base is your own but consider, there is another side to this story. Some fans have felt as if QC would never be a starter and have lived with the failed experiment for 3 years. Some fans believed he could be the guy and really pulled for him only to have him, in so many words, betray there trust in him. Some just have moral issue with the fact that he is involved with illegal substance. What ever the case, there opinions are no more or less valid then yours. If you feel this is wrong, then you are certainly within your rights to voice your opinion. You are not within your rights to judge others opinions based on the facts as we know them today.

People don't like to be admonished when legally, there correct and morally, our society says that there acting as they should.

 

[thewivil]

Alonzo Spellman and Demetrius Underwood never had legions of devoted fans wondering what happened to them. Nor did they single-handedly cause franchise wide upheaval when they suffered episodes.

The whole premise was brought up. Was it the drugs or mental illness? The drugs are the obvious culprit. The fact that he may or may not be bipolar is secondary to the issue.

Many drug users have mental issues. That does not preclude them from seeking and getting help. Nor does it excuse any of their actions.

And to be completely truthful there has been more concrete evidence to support drug use than this whole bipolar notion anyways. There has been very little to support a theory which leads me to believe it is an elaborate and perhaps pandering excuse.



Fans have also snickered at times about the other bipolar players we have had over the years. Where was your bleeding heart and sense of class in terms of Spellman and Underwood, who both did much less damage to the franchise than Carter?

As for the hard drugs issue, I have no compassion. None. Sorry.

For some reason I doubt that your conviction was as strong from those two players as this one.

You're right, it wasn't because I wasn't a mature adult at the time. I know for a fact, though, if I were that I wouldn't have made fun of them.

I agree with you that if drugs were the only reason for his demise that we shouldn't try to give him another chance after he screwed up the second time. Now he has screwed up for a third time.

I'm not saying we should make excuses for Quincy or give him a softer punishment for his actions. All I'm saying is that before we start throwing stones, we should look at ourselves.

People don't like to be admonished when legally, there correct and morally, our society says that there acting as they should.

I'm sorry, but I didn't know our society promoted making fun of drug users and people who might have mental illnesses.

 

[BHendri5]

The people that are making those comments you speak of, are classless. Do not stoop to their level. Unfortunately the Cowboys just like all teams have some fans with no class. The eagles well, all their fans are classless.

 

[chinch]

Should we give Quincy another chance? No, but to make fun of a guy who may have a mental illness and who might be addicted to hard drugs is not very classy.

Maybe I just think of Cowboys fans as a more classy group of individuals, but some of the harsh things some people say on this forum make me think otherwise.

Amen.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

You're right, it wasn't because I wasn't a mature adult at the time. I know for a fact, though, if I were that I wouldn't have made fun of them.

I agree with you that if drugs were the only reason for his demise that we shouldn't try to give him another chance after he screwed up the second time. Now he has screwed up for a third time.

I'm not saying we should make excuses for Quincy or give him a softer punishment for his actions. All I'm saying is that before we start throwing stones, we should look at ourselves.



I'm sorry, but I didn't know our society promoted making fun of drug users and people who might have mental illnesses.

Interesting that you state, rather emphatically, that you assume it was a bi-polar disorder and we, conversly, emphasize that there is no proof of this medically but only some form of drug use and you still throw it out there. Our Society does not condon drug use. How can you not know this? I suspect you do know this but you choose to be argumentative. If he is bi-polar, then it's likely he is not and will never be suited to playing QB in the NFL. Blame nature. If he is bi-polar and using illegal drugs to compenstate, then it's likely he will never be suited to playing QB in the NFL. Blame nature or QC (multiple choice here. There is also an option C and that would be both). If he is not bi-polar then I think your pretty clear on which option is at fault. Either way, your making assumptions that are not supported by credible evidence, so far as I know. If you can provide supporting documentation that suggest QC is bi-polar and clean, then I agree with your assesment. I would still not imployee him as QB of the Dallas Cowboys but at least it could be understood why he has acted the way he has. If not, like I said before, your opinion is your own. State it as such and don't attempt to force the sacraments down my throat. I am not devout over the particular cross you choose to bear.

 

[k19]

QC the threads that refuse to go away.

Welcome to the internet

 

[WoodysGirl]

QC the threads that refuse to go away.

Welcome to the internet

Yo Vin, You know we've seen worse QC threads. I personally thought it was a good discussion up until it got slightly derailed. Besides, it's offseason, what else is there to discuss up until the next minicamp?

I mean, when a thread about the Quarterback School goes a 100 posts deep cuz people think golf is going to hurt Romo's development as a QB prospect, you know we're bored...lol

 

[Hoov]

I dont look at guys with drug problems as losers, or rip them. and dont know that quincy was bi-polar, but as to what was posted by portland fanatic - yes people with bi-polar often self medicate, and unless you have known someone with bi-polar on an intimate level as in family member or close friend, its hard to truly grasp the frustartions that this disorder brings. its a chemical imbalance that one has to live with and people naturally try to find releif when the meds or therapy are not working as they should.
as far as him being qb for an nfl team, if you cant get the job done, you need to find a job that is better suited to who you are and your abilities. nothing personal but if the disorder or drug use prevents you from performing a certain job, you have to find another job. thats all.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I dont look at guys with drug problems as losers, or rip them. and dont know that quincy was bi-polar, but as to what was posted by portland fanatic - yes people with bi-polar often self medicate, and unless you have known someone with bi-polar on an intimate level as in family member or close friend, its hard to truly grasp the frustartions that this disorder brings. its a chemical imbalance that one has to live with and people naturally try to find releif when the meds or therapy are not working as they should.
as far as him being qb for an nfl team, if you cant get the job done, you need to find a job that is better suited to who you are and your abilities. nothing personal but if the disorder or drug use prevents you from performing a certain job, you have to find another job. thats all.

And this is an excellent post IMO. Thank you for that Hoov.

 

[thewivil]

Interesting that you state, rather emphatically, that you assume it was a bi-polar disorder and we, conversly, emphasize that there is no proof of this medically but only some form of drug use and you still throw it out there. Our Society does not condon drug use. How can you not know this? I suspect you do know this but you choose to be argumentative. If he is bi-polar, then it's likely he is not and will never be suited to playing QB in the NFL. Blame nature. If he is bi-polar and using illegal drugs to compenstate, then it's likely he will nver be suited to playing QB in the NFL. Blame nature or QC (multiple choice here. There is also an option C and that would be both). If he is not bi-polar then I think your pretty clear on which option is at fault. Either way, your making assumptions that are not supported by credible evidence, so far as I know. If you can provide supporting documentation that suggest QC is bi-polar and clean, then I agree with your assesment. I would still not imployee him as QB of the Dallas Cowboys but at least it could be understood why he has acted the way he has. If not, like I said before, your opinion is your own. State it as such and don't attempt to force the sacraments down my throught. I am not devout over the particular cross you choose to bear.

Work with me here. I never said our society promotes drug. Never have I said that or have I alluded to it. I said our society does not promote berating drug users or people with mental illnesses. I'm not trying to be difficult. I'm just trying to make my point.

I'm basing my claims about Quincy from what I have read and heard from ESPN.

Quincy Carter's absence from the Jets at the end of the season indicates a setback in his drug rehab and previously undisclosed diagnosis of bipolar disorder, sources told ESPN's Chris Mortensen.

He has entered a treatment center to deal with both afflictions, the sources said. Carter previously entered treatment programs in January of 2003 in the Boston area and again in the summer of 2004 at the John Lucas Treatment Center in Houston, Mortensen reported.

That's what I've read, and that's what we've been led to believe. If you choose to believe it or not, that's up to you. But before I start raining down flames on people, I like to know the entire situation.

I dont look at guys with drug problems as losers, or rip them. and dont know that quincy was bi-polar, but as to what was posted by portland fanatic - yes people with bi-polar often self medicate, and unless you have known someone with bi-polar on an intimate level as in family member or close friend, its hard to truly grasp the frustartions that this disorder brings. its a chemical imbalance that one has to live with and people naturally try to find releif when the meds or therapy are not working as they should.
as far as him being qb for an nfl team, if you cant get the job done, you need to find a job that is better suited to who you are and your abilities. nothing personal but if the disorder or drug use prevents you from performing a certain job, you have to find another job. thats all.

I agree wholeheartedly.

 

[k19]

Yo Vin, You know we've seen worse QC threads. I personally thought it was a good discussion up until it got slightly derailed. Besides, it's offseason, what else is there to discuss up until the next minicamp?

I mean, when a thread about the Quarterback School goes a 100 posts deep cuz people think golf is going to hurt Romo's development as a QB prospect, you know we're bored...lol

Yupp Michelle we've seen ALOT worse QC threads but it amazes me how we are getting ready to start the 2nd season post Q and people still bicker back and forth like he was a boy scout and sang in the church choir, went on to UGA and won the heisman, was a number top 5 over all pick. Started day one and people believed he had what it took to be one of the greatest and could be the missing piece to lead us to the promise land and one day he was just......gone. Oh wait my bad that was Ricky

Seriously though, He came into the NFL in the program and eventually he'll leave the NFL in the program if he doesnt get his act together. Its sad that things like this happen but they do everyday be it to a star QB or the kid down the street. Problem is know one argues for or against the kid down the street but they come a running to argue for or against Q. Sad actually. Either way the guy is just like all of us, human, and allowed to make mistakes and let people down.

*I know hand over my soap box*

 

[SALADIN]

Our Society does not condon drug use.

Yet you can't watch a sporting event without seeing a zillion ads for beer.

Or is that not a drug?

So its OK to have a couple of drinks every now and then but it's not OK to smoke a joint every now and then?

I'd say that our society picks the drugs that it condones and the ones they don't.

 

[k19]

Yet you can't watch a sporting event without seeing a zillion ads for beer.

Or is that not a drug?

So its OK to have a couple of drinks every now and then but it's not OK to smoke a joint every now and then?

I'd say that our society picks the drugs that it condones and the ones they don't.

according to the law it is and thats what people are judged by as far as most are concerned. Just like the days of prohibition maybe someday weed will be legal and people won't think twice about situations like this

 

[Alexander]

Yet you can't watch a sporting event without seeing a zillion ads for beer.

Or is that not a drug?

So its OK to have a couple of drinks every now and then but it's not OK to smoke a joint every now and then?

I'd say that our society picks the drugs that it condones and the ones they don't.

Right on, man.
http://www.cosgan.net/images/smilie/froehlich/s050.gif

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Yet you can't watch a sporting event without seeing a zillion ads for beer.

Or is that not a drug?

So its OK to have a couple of drinks every now and then but it's not OK to smoke a joint every now and then?

I'd say that our society picks the drugs that it condones and the ones they don't.

Interestingly enough, I basically stipultated that point earlier. Do I think it's hypocritical? To a certain extent, yes, I do. However, the fact remains that it's legal. The others are not. I voiced my opinions on these and I clearly stated that it is not my right to hold judgement on what people elect to do in there personal life but everybody must be responsible for there own actions. Society makes the laws. We are forced to abide if we want to be a part of society.

What can I say?

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I heard he was into sniffing monkey dung, ate the bark off of trees, smoked dried boogers, sprinkled toenails on is salad and ate spam sandwiches.

He ate spam sandwiches?

Well yeah.................. then I can see why.