QBs rarely win Superbowls on extension expensive contracts

[CowboysFaninHouston]

Yes, but Dak has to accept he isnt elite and gets/accepts payment accordingly. Even then, this repeated inability to perform under duress is worrying..... even Purdy came back from a 17pt deficit.

the payment has nothing to do with it. its ability to build a team around them. our drafts suck. we hit on one every few years. we don't sign FAs.

last year we had 20M on the cap and chose not to sign anyone. this year before Diggs contract we had 25M on the cap, yet didn't sign anyone.

in the meantime, SF traded a 2nd to get chase young and add to their DL. they traded picks to get mccaffrey. so on and so forth.

the issue is not money or contract. that's what most are enamoured with. we had Dak on Rookie contract at about 500K/year and still failed.

the issue is the GM.

and Purdy has a strong team around him. #3 defense. #3 rushing attack. great OL. great support. great coach.

to be clear. I am not advocating to give Dak a large contract. my point is the contract is not what's stopping us from succeeding.

 

[CowboyoWales]

the payment has nothing to do with it. its ability to build a team around them. our drafts suck. we hit on one every few years. we don't sign FAs.

last year we had 20M on the cap and chose not to sign anyone. this year before Diggs contract we had 25M on the cap, yet didn't sign anyone.

in the meantime, SF traded a 2nd to get chase young and add to their DL. they traded picks to get mccaffrey. so on and so forth.

the issue is not money or contract. that's what most are enamoured with. we had Dak on Rookie contract at about 500K/year and still failed.

the issue is the GM.

and Purdy has a strong team around him. #3 defense. #3 rushing attack. great OL. great support. great coach.

to be clear. I am not advocating to give Dak a large contract. my point is the contract is not what's stopping us from succeeding.

But Purdy isnt paid like an elite QB. It is Dak's contract that's effecting us from succeeding, because we fail to pay it off and it's kicked down the alley. Its on Dak to take the team friendly deal (by team friendly I mean length of contract).

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

But Purdy isnt paid like an elite QB. It is Dak's contract that's effecting us from succeeding, because we fail to pay it off and it's kicked down the alley. Its on Dak to take the team friendly deal (by team friendly I mean length of contract).

how? how is it that his contract is stopping us from succeeding?. as mentioned, we had 20M on the cap last year and over 10M this year after signing diggs. who would you want to sign and we couldn't?
why when Dak was under rookie contract we weren't able to build a team?

its not Dak's contract. its the GM. the past three years the cap hit has been 26M, 19M and 17M. so not devestating. but how did it stop us from signing anyone?

and KC handed 10 year 450M contract to Mahomes. yet they made it. Lamar got a contract and they were in the AGCCG. his AAV was 3rd at 52M. Jared Goff had a 30M cap hit in 2023. Dak was 26M...Detroit just played in NFCCG.

all the people who complain about Dak and contract can't give a single example of who we would want to sign and didn't because of the contract.

contracts get manipulated all the time. money pushed to future.

now, look at our drafts. specifically defensive drafts. how was 2023 draft? 2022 we took Sam Williams in the second. how is that working out. in 2021 we lucked into Parson at 11 (after trading down, which tells you what they thought of Parsons) and then Joseph in the second. no longer on the team. 2020, they found diggs, so I give them that. in 2019 Hill, a bust. in 2018, LVE. in 2017 Taco charlton and so on.

these drafts suppose to be the core of the defense and we got two players out of it. Jerry can't draft defensively. that's why they go FA route and even there, they go cheap like Kearse, Hankins, etc.

Defensive players that are not superstars don't sell Jersey's. so why spend money on Defense. in the meantime in SF, Baltimore.....

 

[nate dizzle]

Winning the Super Bowl is like picking a number on the roulette wheel.

Yeah, if you're incompetent at team building. Absolutely.

 

[nate dizzle]

Just come out and say, I don't like Dak Prescott, I want him gone. That's a lot more interesting than the constant brain scrambling anecdotal content just to say, I don't like Dak Prescott.

I don't like Dak Prescott as the starting qb of the Dallas Cowboys.

 

[Zekeats]

This is nonsense - total bs

You need a stud qb. Doesn’t matter what his contract is..

Is Lamar’s contract a problem? Mahomes? No. Enough of this stupidity

Exactly, which is just another reason to cut ties with Dak

 

[PAPPYDOG]

QBs typically win super bowls on rookie contracts or team friendly contracts, Brady , Aaron Rogers , Mahomes , Wilson etc .
But now Dak wants an SECOND. Extension mammoth contract ? He has had that and has not delivered .
sometimes I wonder is it Jerry or Stephen approving such decisions.

The people demand 60 million for 4 years (so Dak can have another bite of the apple) or else we will revolt!!!

To Nowhere land......................

 

[CowboyoWales]

all the people who complain about Dak and contract can't give a single example of who we would want to sign and didn't because of the contract.

contracts get manipulated all the time. money pushed to future.
..

It's not about the player, it's that he isnt worth the money and has proved that he cant shoulder the responsibility, always needs some weapon or help. He just hasnt the mental ability to step up, so why pay him as an elite when his mental fragility comes up short (as it has in three consecutive years......though you like to focus on deflecting the blame, despite Dak having the ball on every offensive snap).

The CAP issue isnt about star players, you can always find a way of manipulating, however, the Chiefs acknowledged that it's nigh on impossible to add (eg Tyreek trade), it's about rounding out a roster. If Dak doesnt sign an extension (and im sure the pressure's not on him, he's due to get paid $35m), I worry for his health as we dont have the CAP to protect him as 2/5 of the O-Line are FA's and Martin is starting to show his age.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

It's not about the player, it's that he isnt worth the money and has proved that he cant shoulder the responsibility, always needs some weapon or help. He just hasnt the mental ability to step up, so why pay him as an elite when his mental fragility comes up short (as it has in three consecutive years......though you like to focus on deflecting the blame, despite Dak having the ball on every offensive snap).

The CAP issue isnt about star players, you can always find a way of manipulating, however, the Chiefs acknowledged that it's nigh on impossible to add (eg Tyreek trade), it's about rounding out a roster. If Dak doesnt sign an extension (and im sure the pressure's not on him, he's due to get paid $35m), I worry for his health as we dont have the CAP to protect him as 2/5 of the O-Line are FA's and Martin is starting to show his age.

so what is this worth the money thing? is it a fan percieved value of a player? there are 16 QBs in NFL that make 30M or more. 12 that make 40M or mor. so none of them except maybe the top 3 are worth it. is that it? and elite money is what fans percieve it. to me its the market. supply and demand. and the market sets the value. not some percieved made up in people's mind number which is far from reality of how the real NFL works.

and I am not advocating to keep or dump Dak. just that the contract is not the reason we can't build a team. its a weak excuse from people just screaming about something, ala yourself and when I asked for an example you took a left turn and avoided answering the question.

and its about managing the cap, KC didn't keep Hill, yet they have been to two superbowls since. so did they make the right decision? perhaps the KC GM knows a little more about his team than the average fan.
and the OL is getting old in the tooth. we really haven't addressed either line and outside of Tyler Smith, have missed out on several draft picks, which the crux of the problem.

again, the issue is the GM and his inability to build a winning team. in the meantime in SF, KC, Baltimore, etc. they hand out large contracts. they build successful teams.

 

[Walker]

if you issue a big contract you have to make sure that player makes everyone around him better. Dak on the other hand needs everyone else around him to make him better. That is the real issue.

 

[CATCH17]

You’ve been telling this board for years that if a QB doesn’t win a SB on their rookie deal you’re moving on. Which means you would have moved on from Joe Burrow and Josh Allen. You’ll move on from CJ Stroud no matter how well he plays if he doesn’t win a SB on his rookie deal.

I said you never move on from truly elite QBs.

 

[sunalsorises]

Who did Dallas have to let go or not sign because they didn't have money? Zeke?

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

Who did Dallas have to let go or not sign because they didn't have money? Zeke?

can't recall anyone. its a fan made up thing about contracts and value.

 

[CowboyoWales]

so what is this worth the money thing? is it a fan percieved value of a player? there are 16 QBs in NFL that make 30M or more. 12 that make 40M or mor. so none of them except maybe the top 3 are worth it. is that it? and elite money is what fans percieve it. to me its the market. supply and demand. and the market sets the value. not some percieved made up in people's mind number which is far from reality of how the real NFL works.

and I am not advocating to keep or dump Dak. just that the contract is not the reason we can't build a team. its a weak excuse from people just screaming about something, ala yourself and when I asked for an example you took a left turn and avoided answering the question.

and its about managing the cap, KC didn't keep Hill, yet they have been to two superbowls since. so did they make the right decision? perhaps the KC GM knows a little more about his team than the average fan.
and the OL is getting old in the tooth. we really haven't addressed either line and outside of Tyler Smith, have missed out on several draft picks, which the crux of the problem.

again, the issue is the GM and his inability to build a winning team. in the meantime in SF, KC, Baltimore, etc. they hand out large contracts. they build successful teams.

The issue with the GM is he gave a stupid contract to Dak, with NTC, on Daks terms and then compounded the issue by deferring payments until he's backed into a corner....
......we end up having to extend a good regular season QB, who hasn't got the mental capability to up his game in crucial moments and actually fulfills that same GM's goal of being relevant (without that ability to take it to the next step).

 

[Flamma]

Great post. I think the key difference is that Mahomes had already shown that he could 'get it done' before he got his big extension and even that extension was (relatively) team friendly. All the talk from Chiefs was that Mahomes was reasonable in the negotiations and whilst it was a rich contract, it was not the richest in the league nor was it the potential market setting amount that others might have paid.

I would also say that Mahomes on 17% is still less than the 20.4% hit that Dak will be next year... which speaks volumes.

How you can justify paying Dak more than Mahomes is just beyond me. I literally do not understand how this is not ringing huge alarm bells in the front office.

So the options are the same two options you've always had.. a rookie deal QB OR a superstar truly elite Brady/Mahomes level on about 15% (ideally)

The rest is just trying to 'catch lightning in a bottle' and get lucky.

Dak is actually 23.4% next year. But that's not going to happen. It's that high now because they keep pushing his money forward to keep a manageable cap hit. So it builds up.

A QB being 15% of the cap really isn't that good unless you have a superstar at QB. I think it's only Mahomes that won a SB with that or higher percentage of the cap. I think Ideally it's closer to 10%.That's just to get to the SB. But rookie deal QBs do have an advantage.

 

[Flamma]

Yes, but Dak has to accept he isnt elite and gets/accepts payment accordingly. Even then, this repeated inability to perform under duress is worrying..... even Purdy came back from a 17pt deficit.

That's more than worrying, it's a real problem. He looks like a different QB.

 

[CowboyoWales]

Dak is actually 23.4% next year. But that's not going to happen. It's that high now because they keep pushing his money forward to keep a manageable cap hit. So it builds up.

A QB being 15% of the cap really isn't that good unless you have a superstar at QB. I think it's only Mahomes that won a SB with that or higher percentage of the cap. I think Ideally it's closer to 10%.That's just to get to the SB. But rookie deal QBs do have an advantage.

Yep, the problem is the deferred CAP that we've already pushed into the Void years (but I'm reliably informed that can be redistributed). The biggest issue (as well as the $$) is the number of years that'll give us a fighting chance to build a team good enough to help him. We can't afford a short term extension due to that deferrment (and the $35m of salary he'll believe he's owed).

 

[JBS]

Exactly, which is just another reason to cut ties with Dak

I’m not defending Dak. Just saying you can win w a QB on a second contract. I’m on record vehemently against extending Dak

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

The issue with the GM is he gave a stupid contract to Dak, with NTC, on Daks terms and then compounded the issue by deferring payments until he's backed into a corner....
......we end up having to extend a good regular season QB, who hasn't got the mental capability to up his game in crucial moments and actually fulfills that same GM's goal of being relevant (without that ability to take it to the next step).

this GM has not just given stupid contracts to Dak. he has given it to Zeke, Gallup, Cooper, Lawrence and on and on and on. get the point?

and btw, the payment deferrements is a typical strategy for all large contracts. See Herbert, Jackson, Hurts, etc. so this one I don't fault him for.

and Dak's issues are what they are. he is what he is. the GM is responsible to build a team, find the right QB, put the right team around him and build a championship team. 28 years and counting.

and the QB market is what it is. 16 QBs with 30M+ AAV contracts. 12 with 40M AAV contracts. outside of a few most are regular season QBs. so you just described most of NFL QB market.

this GM has continuously failed. he couldn't build a team around Romo, on his initial contract, nor after he gave him a new contract. he couldn't do it with Dak on Rookie contract, and not with new contract. you get the point?
remove Dak. is anything going to change? who would you sign to make this team into a championship team? do you think Rush is capable (Yeah I have heard the fallacy of the 4-1 record). nobody can give any specific example of how they would build a championship team. everyone just complains, complains, complains and everyone just wants to point to Dak. nobosy has offered any better alternative. none. until then what we have is our best option, which is a sad state of affairs.

 

[CowboyoWales]

this GM has not just given stupid contracts to Dak. he has given it to Zeke, Gallup, Cooper, Lawrence and on and on and on. get the point?

and btw, the payment deferrements is a typical strategy for all large contracts. See Herbert, Jackson, Hurts, etc. so this one I don't fault him for.

and Dak's issues are what they are. he is what he is. the GM is responsible to build a team, find the right QB, put the right team around him and build a championship team. 28 years and counting.

and the QB market is what it is. 16 QBs with 30M+ AAV contracts. 12 with 40M AAV contracts. outside of a few most are regular season QBs. so you just described most of NFL QB market.

this GM has continuously failed. he couldn't build a team around Romo, on his initial contract, nor after he gave him a new contract. he couldn't do it with Dak on Rookie contract, and not with new contract. you get the point?
remove Dak. is anything going to change? who would you sign to make this team into a championship team? do you think Rush is capable (Yeah I have heard the fallacy of the 4-1 record). nobody can give any specific example of how they would build a championship team. everyone just complains, complains, complains and everyone just wants to point to Dak. nobosy has offered any better alternative. none. until then what we have is our best option, which is a sad state of affairs.

You're ranting again. The bottom line is that in 3 consecutive years Dak, after leading the same team in a successful regular season, has failed ,due to his lack of composure, to lead the team at the crucial moment.
It doesn't really come down to contract, players around him, it's evident he has the mental make-up under pressure....AND this isn't the first year I've made this point to your good self.