Question re: Dak and greed

[Scotman]

I've grown to really like Dak and where he is heading. I think he's capable of winning the Superbowl.

BUT...he's turning down generational wealth to get more money. He's turning down enough money that he should ever have to work another day in his life if he manages his money at all. He's turning down offers, if what we are being told is accurate, that isn't a slap in the face for his position or status either. He's turning down pretty good offers.

It strikes me as short-sighted at best and down right greedy at worst.

 

[OmerV]

No I am paying attention. What I'm saying is that your original point, is not important, nor is it material to the actual issue. I told you in the first post, the money is not the actual issue. It is you who are not paying attention Omer. The money doesn't matter. Let me say it again, The Money Doesn't Matter.

It seems to me that their are really two different discussion around this contract. One is definitely about the money but who cares? If the cap works and the money is managed, I don't give a crap about the money. I care about the team being able to manage the cap and continue to be able to bring in talent. If the cap isn't managed, that is seriously compromised. It means that you are going to be forced into restructuring and basically pushing cap hits into the future, which ultimately creates cap issues that last much longer then the actual life of the player on the team. That's what you see Washington doing all the time. Is that who we want to be as an organization? I don't.

So you can complain about the money, which makes no difference or you can complain about the cap management, which makes all the difference in the world. Jerry has never shied away from paying QBs. That's never, ever happened so this is about being able to manage the cap IMO. The money is what it is. This is why I just shake my head at all of these people who scream "Pay The Man!" or claim that all posters who are not for this madness are simply against seeing Dak get paid or whatever other ridiculous BS they concoct. All of those people are ignoring what's right in front of them and they are as bad, or worse even, then the ones complaining about money. I've said many times that I don't think any of these QBs are worth the money they are getting paid and that's absolutely an honest statement. But I don't really care about the actual money, except in terms of how it effects the cap.

I wouldn't want anybody to tell me how much I get paid for the job I do if I'm making the company money but on the other hand, I'm not going to pay myself so much money that I ruin the company either. To all things balance. That's what's important.

You don't think the money matters to the player? Really? lol. That kind of kills your entire narrative.

But, ultimately, you really aren't paying attention. You are changing the subject and pretending as if it applies to what me and pansophy were talking about.

And you are talking about me complaining about the money, and I did not. You are just making up arguments that have nothing to do with the conversation you jumped in the middle of and pretending they apply.

Whether you care about the actual money as opposed to how it affects the cap also has no relevance to what panoshy and I were discussing.

Aside from all that, you don't even seem to grasp that what we were talking about was actually from the player's perspective, what he signed on for in order to get the guarantee (which was 4 years). You somehow have twisted that into the team's perspective and distribution under salary cap rules, which, again, is you changing the subject and pretending it applies to what we were discussing.

 

[tyke1doe]

I'm of the opinion that Dak shouldn't be paid as if he's among the top quarterbacks. But … I support Dak's right to negotiate top pay. If Dak feels THAT confident in his abilities as a quarterback, more power to him. I'm not going to criticize him for getting as much as he can.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

You don't think the money matters to the player? Really? lol. That kind of kills your entire narrative.

But, ultimately, you really aren't paying attention. You are changing the subject and pretending as if it applies to what me and pansophy were talking about.

And you are talking about me complaining about the money, and I did not. You are just making up arguments that have nothing to do with the conversation you jumped in the middle of and pretending they apply.

Whether you care about the actual money as opposed to how it affects the cap also has no relevance to what panoshy and I were discussing.

Aside from all that, you don't even seem to grasp that what we were talking about was actually from the player's perspective, what he signed on for in order to get the guarantee (which was 4 years). You somehow have twisted that into the team's perspective and distribution under salary cap rules, which, again, is you changing the subject and pretending it applies to what we were discussing.

No I don't and no, it doesn't. The money doesn't matter. The ability to manage the cap matters. I was not having a discussion with panoshy. I was having a discussion with you. The money doesn't matter. That's a small minded way of looking at the bigger picture, in my view.

I never said anything about you complaining about the money. Show me where I specifically said this. You are all over the place here.

 

[OmerV]

No I don't and no, it doesn't. The money doesn't matter. The ability to manage the cap matters. I was not having a discussion with panoshy. I was having a discussion with you. The money doesn't matter. That's a small minded way of looking at the bigger picture, in my view.

I never said anything about you complaining about the money. Show me where I specifically said this. You are all over the place here.

Your comments to me were a response to my comments panoshy, so if you ignored the context my comments were made in, your comments to me had no relevance. You can't rationally ignore what I was talking about, and respond in a different context and pretend what you said applies.

As for quoting where you talked about complaining about the money, here it is …

So you can complain about the money, which makes no difference or you can complain about the cap management, which makes all the difference in the world.

And, again, if you think the guaranteed money means nothing to the player and his agent, this discussion is too nonsensical to have anyway

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Your comments to me were a response to my comments panoshy, so if you ignored the context my comments were made in, your comments to me had no relevance. You can't rationally ignore what I was talking about, and respond in a different context and pretend what you said applies.

As for quoting where you talked about complaining about the money, here it is …

So you can complain about the money, which makes no difference or you can complain about the cap management, which makes all the difference in the world.

And, again, if you think the guaranteed money means nothing to the player and his agent, this discussion is too nonsensical to have anyway

Yes, my comments were to you. Not comments to anybody else. You are free to go ahead and continue your discussion with panoshy. I am not limited by whatever discussion you are having. That's between you and he/she. Nothing to do with me.

I can rationally ignore anything that represents baseless points of view. LOL...... just watch me. The line you reference as "complaining about the money" is not address to you anywhere. It does not say that you are doing that or point you out specifically anywhere in the text. It's a general statement but you know this. So again, show me where I specifically accuse you of this because what you point out here is not it.

While you are at it, identify where I address the upfront money specifically. I said the money in general. I further explained that the amounts of money were not important and that managing the cap is all that is important to me. You are muddying the water in this conversation. If you don't want to have it, just say so. Don't waste my time with this stuff. You know what I am saying to you. You are throwing stuff into the conversation that only detracts from it. If you are done with this, just say so. We can each go our own ways on it.

No big deal.

 

[OmerV]

Yes, my comments were to you. Not comments to anybody else. You are free to go ahead and continue your discussion with panoshy. I am not limited by whatever discussion you are having. That's between you and he/she. Nothing to do with me.

I can rationally ignore anything that represents baseless points of view. LOL...... just watch me. The line you reference as "complaining about the money" is not address to you anywhere. It does not say that you are doing that or point you out specifically anywhere in the text. It's a general statement but you know this. So again, show me where I specifically accuse you of this because what you point out here is not it.

lol - so if me and another poster were discussing the picture quality of a Sony TV, and you jumped in and told me what I thought was wrong because Sony TV's have a better sound quality, it wouldn't matter that we weren't even discussing sound quality, or that your comment didn't relate to what I said about picture quality. You just get to pretend your comment about sound quality somehow contradicts what I said about picture quality.

lol - that's idiotic. You can't quote me and respond as if I said something different than I did, and in a different context than I did, and pretend your response applied to what I said. That's idiotic. If you want to tell me I'm wrong it has to be based on what I said, not a different topic that I wasn't even referring to.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

lol - so if me and another poster were discussing the picture quality of a Sony TV, and you jumped in and told me what I thought was wrong because Sony TV's have a better sound quality, it wouldn't matter that we weren't even discussing sound quality, or that your comment didn't relate to what I said about picture quality. You just get to pretend your comment about sound quality somehow contradicts what I said about picture quality.

lol - that's idiotic. You can't quote me and respond as if I said something different than I did, and in a different context than I did, and pretend your response applied to what I said. That's idiotic. If you want to tell me I'm wrong it has to be based on what I said, not a different topic that I wasn't even referring to.

Cool, you don't want to have the conversation, no big deal. See ya around.

 

[OmerV]

Cool, you don't want to have the conversation, no big deal. See ya around.

If you want to have a discussion, I'm happy to, but initiate a new discussion based on the topic you want to discuss, not by interjecting a new topic into another conversation and pretending it applies.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

If you want to have a discussion, I'm happy to, but initiate a new discussion based on the topic you want to discuss, not by interjecting a new topic into another conversation and pretending it applies.

No, you are really not. But that's fine. We are done here. It's all good.

 

[CCBoy]

You don't think the money matters to the player? Really? lol. That kind of kills your entire narrative.

But, ultimately, you really aren't paying attention. You are changing the subject and pretending as if it applies to what me and pansophy were talking about.

And you are talking about me complaining about the money, and I did not. You are just making up arguments that have nothing to do with the conversation you jumped in the middle of and pretending they apply.

Whether you care about the actual money as opposed to how it affects the cap also has no relevance to what panoshy and I were discussing.

Aside from all that, you don't even seem to grasp that what we were talking about was actually from the player's perspective, what he signed on for in order to get the guarantee (which was 4 years). You somehow have twisted that into the team's perspective and distribution under salary cap rules, which, again, is you changing the subject and pretending it applies to what we were discussing.

No, this is what is killing topic...


1. Dallas Cowboys at Los Angeles Rams | Sept. 13
The Rams welcome Dallas into their humble, new home. The Sunday night lights are on and bright. This game is sure to draw in eyeballs.

The 2018 NFL Divisional Round, a 22-30 loss, is still in Dallas’s memory. Like the Dallas Cowboys in 2019, the Rams missed out on the playoffs with a 9-7 record. With a new stadium to look forward to, which was five years in the making, the Rams look to contend in 2020, and that all starts with America’s Team.

Prescott’s contract situation caused him to miss some time. The quarterback needs time to adjust with Mike McCarthy, and the Rams expose the Cowboys offensively. Though I think Dallas will be the better NFC team overall in 2020, the ‘Boys fall to the Rams, 24-10.

https://thelandryhat.com/2020/05/12/dallas-cowboys-start-2020-500-five-games/


This team has to hit the carpet running, this year...3-2 after the Giants isn't good enough. No team will reach 14 wins this season. So wins will be important for Dallas.

 

[OmerV]

No, you are really not. But that's fine. We are done here. It's all good.

how would you know? You didn't try. The funny thing is I didn't even disagree with some of what you were saying, but rather that you insisted that is somehow related to what I said.

 

[Brax]

Grow up

The Dak worshipers are out calling names, SOP, and still believing Dak average is worth 35 Million. When he signs they will be beating their keyboards with I told you so posts . 3-4 years down the road they will have another coach or two to burn at the stake and so many more made up excuses to try and prop Dak up. Dak isn't stupid this is a once in a lifetime opportunity for a limited skills QB to hold up a franchise for top $$$$. Dak isn't betting on himself he's betting on Jerry folding, it is just a matter of when Jerry does. Daks out for #1.

 

[MarcusRock]

I'm not going to criticize him for getting as much as he can.

75% of CowboysZone: "Hold my beer."

 

[kskboys]

I'm of the opinion that Dak shouldn't be paid as if he's among the top quarterbacks. But … I support Dak's right to negotiate top pay. If Dak feels THAT confident in his abilities as a quarterback, more power to him. I'm not going to criticize him for getting as much as he can.

Even if he's doing it at the expense of the team?

 

[OmerV]

No, this is what is killing topic...


1. Dallas Cowboys at Los Angeles Rams | Sept. 13
The Rams welcome Dallas into their humble, new home. The Sunday night lights are on and bright. This game is sure to draw in eyeballs.

The 2018 NFL Divisional Round, a 22-30 loss, is still in Dallas’s memory. Like the Dallas Cowboys in 2019, the Rams missed out on the playoffs with a 9-7 record. With a new stadium to look forward to, which was five years in the making, the Rams look to contend in 2020, and that all starts with America’s Team.

Prescott’s contract situation caused him to miss some time. The quarterback needs time to adjust with Mike McCarthy, and the Rams expose the Cowboys offensively. Though I think Dallas will be the better NFC team overall in 2020, the ‘Boys fall to the Rams, 24-10.

https://thelandryhat.com/2020/05/12/dallas-cowboys-start-2020-500-five-games/


This team has to hit the carpet running, this year...

I don't disagree at all. It's just that none of this, nor what ABQCowboy has posted relates to the post of mine that ABQCowboy quoted and responded to.

I wholeheartedly with you that we need Dak signed up as quickly as possible to prepare for the season.
And I wholeheartedly agree with ABQCowboy that how a team is able to spread things our under the salary cap is important.

 

[CouchCoach]

Do I think Prescott is greedy? No, I do not.

One of the most amusing parts of this forum is our determination of what a player is worth. Or that it is any player's responsibility to help the team manage it's cap.

Any player is worth whatever he can get come negotiating time including Lawrence, Smith, Big Smitty, Collins, Martin, Cooper, Elliott and Prescott. Not one of them is responsible for making sure the others can get what they want. Prescott has been the best bargain player over his 4 years and took a chance on himself in his contract year. In his mind, has he not earned this contract and the right to it? Are we guilty of looking forward and not back over those 4 years at what a deal he was?

Now, add to this those players getting what they've got and do you think that doesn't have an effect on all future negotiations? The bank is open and Booger is signing checks.

Let's add two more elements to this. One is the ego and pride that goes with knowing you are at the top of your peer group and that is so important to some that is written into their contract, no player can make more at their position and that's been in there a long time.

Now, let's add this last element and if you don't think this matters to a man from Prescott's background, you need to think again. This owner is a show off. Lives in a mansion, makes sure the public knows how much his toys cost, constantly seeks the spotlight, drinks $75 a bottle scotch and even shows up all the owners in the league in the draft by picking form his 250M boat and makes sure everyone knows that. You are going to cut this guy a break?

The joke in all of this are the posters that react to Stuphen's comments about % of the cap to the QB or Booger's about it's Prescott's responsibility to help us build the team around him. Where in the hell do the Joneses think Prescott's been while they've been doing the Lawrence, Elliott, Smith and Cooper deals?

If I need to justify whatever he's going to get, I can easily do that by adding the past 4 years and that money along with the guarantee portion of this and divide by the total number of years.

I can also justify the player by not laying those playoff losses on him. It is not his fault that in his bargain years they failed to do what BAL, KC and HOU have done with their 1st contract QB's.

 

[OmerV]

Even if he's doing it at the expense of the team?

Aren't you the one that mentioned something earlier about a free market system? In a free market the argument can't be that a player has to accept what the team offers because otherwise he is hurting the team. In a free market a player has to be able to try and negotiate for what he thinks he is worth.

 

[Runwildboys]

I'm of the opinion that Dak shouldn't be paid as if he's among the top quarterbacks. But … I support Dak's right to negotiate top pay. If Dak feels THAT confident in his abilities as a quarterback, more power to him. I'm not going to criticize him for getting as much as he can.

On the other hand, I wouldn't say he's not being greedy by doing so.

 

[OmerV]

Any player is worth whatever he can get come negotiating time including.

This is the key thing many don't understand. Pay isn't based on somebody's ranking of players at a position, or whether someone thinks a number just sounds too big, or even how much of the salary cap a player's salary takes up. It's based on whatever a player can negotiate, and whatever a team is willing to pay.