Twitter: Referee Brad Allen on the 2 point conversion Illegal Touch call

[DallasInDC]

That exert there you posted....isn't that from the very ref that made the call most people (outside of this forum) are saying is a mistake?

I'm having a hard time seeing it...but that looks like Brad Allen's quotes. Is Brad Allen thebref that made the call?

Yes... I assume because of the controversy they wanted to get their side out and get in front of the narrative. You don't normally hear referees take part in interviews.

 

[Direwolf63]

Whatever. Whether 68 declared or not is moot.

70 was eligible and was covered up by 68 on the LOS.

That's a penalty. And it's a penalty whether or not 68 was declared eligible or not

If the ref announced the penalty as being an illegal formation this controversy would have never happened

 

[thunderpimp91]

Wrong - there is no second flag if the right player is eligible

And if you actually watch the play design. I bet decker is still wide open if 68 is declared eligible

It you want to argue the hendershot penalty - now we are talking

Disagree completely.

1) Even if Detroit did everything the right way you still have the fact that the official announced the wrong player. That is still on the Lions to get corrected and they neglected to do so.

2) You can clearly see pre snap that the middle backer is pointing out the eligible player. If that pre snap call gets flipped to the other side the assignments change completely and while i'm assuming a bit here but donovan wilson is probably manned up with #68 off the LOS. If he is aware of a possible eligible olineman releasing on that play his first step is probably not up like it was which is why #8 of Detroit was able to make contact behind him leaving #68 wide open. Even right after the play you can see Wilson throw his hands up like he was confused why 68 would be able to catch a pass. We really don't have any idea if it would have worked if everyone knew 68 was eligible, but I think there is a reason that Detroit tried so hard to hide it.

Detroit intentionally sent three players over to look like they were announcing to try and confuse the defense. It's just not a smart idea as the refs still announce the eligible player so the odds of confusing an NFL defense this way is extremely low. Dan Campbell admitted after the game this is what they were trying to do and he knew from the start this was what they wanted to do as he tried to explain the situation to the refs pre game. If you have to tell the refs about your trick plays before the game even starts we are putting to much on the refs. They are there to call the game, not play a part in a teams deception.

 

[Cydios]

There is no doubt that the Lions sent 3 linemen to the refs to deceive Dallas, but in doing so they was making the refs part of the deception. Why should the refs participate in a ruse like that? I have no idea if the refs had announced 68 as eligible would the Cowboys have stopped the play. The didn';t stop anything on that entire drive.

Exactly!!!!! Confused the refs too. So I guess it worked

 

[thunderpimp91]

I mean, you can see him run up to the ref to report

But you also saw two other players run up to the refs as well. Did they all three report? If so you have an issue. Just because a player is close to the ref doesnt mean they are reporting, and Detroit did this intentionally to confuse the defense. If you're going to do that you have to be 100% sure the ref understands whats going on. Detroit then never corrected the refs once it was announced that #70 was the eligible player.

No matter how you shake this and even if the refs got it wrong, Detroit still just went with it which falls on their shoulders.

 

[JBS]

Disagree completely.

1) Even if Detroit did everything the right way you still have the fact that the official announced the wrong player. That is still on the Lions to get corrected and they neglected to do so.

2) You can clearly see pre snap that the middle backer is pointing out the eligible player. If that pre snap call gets flipped to the other side the assignments change completely and while i'm assuming a bit here but donovan wilson is probably manned up with #68 off the LOS. If he is aware of a possible eligible olineman releasing on that play his first step is probably not up like it was which is why #8 of Detroit was able to make contact behind him leaving #68 wide open. Even right after the play you can see Wilson throw his hands up like he was confused why 68 would be able to catch a pass. We really don't have any idea if it would have worked if everyone knew 68 was eligible, but I think there is a reason that Detroit tried so hard to hide it.

Detroit intentionally sent three players over to look like they were announcing to try and confuse the defense. It's just not a smart idea as the refs still announce the eligible player so the odds of confusing an NFL defense this way is extremely low. Dan Campbell admitted after the game this is what they were trying to do and he knew from the start this was what they wanted to do as he tried to explain the situation to the refs pre game. If you have to tell the refs about your trick plays before the game even starts we are putting to much on the refs. They are there to call the game, not play a part in a teams deception.

Your first point is correct. It’s exactly what I’ve been saying the entire time. I’m not arguing against this

I disagree with two but I’ll concede that it’s possible bc yes, 33 is making it clear to the D to cover the eligible receiver. But the play design is sooooo good that I’m not convinced it doesn’t work anyways

Point 3 isn’t relevant imo

 

[tm1119]

For those still trying to say illegal formation…it just wasn’t.

 

[thunderpimp91]

Your first point is correct. It’s exactly what I’ve been saying the entire time. I’m not arguing against this

I disagree with two but I’ll concede that it’s possible bc yes, 33 is making it clear to the D to cover the eligible receiver. But the play design is sooooo good that I’m not convinced it doesn’t work anyways

Point 3 isn’t relevant imo

Gotcha, I must have misterpreted your other post.

 

[JBS]

Gotcha, I must have misterpreted your other post.

The only thing I meant in the previous post was that there is no flag for illegal formation if the ref gets the right player eligible (68 not 70) - there is no doubt in my mind he got that wrong

 

[thunderpimp91]

For those still trying to say illegal formation…it just wasn’t.

Problem with that is the refs declared #70 eligible. Detroit never cleared up the miscommunication, which is on them.

 

[CowboysLakerBamaFan]

Yes... I assume because of the controversy they wanted to get their side out and get in front of the narrative. You don't normally hear referees take part in interviews.

Hmmmm OK.

Well on a different note, I just saw an email from all the different Offensive Lineman that has ever blocked Micah Parson, and they all say they've never held him.

Welp, I guess that puts the whole "Micah always gets held" narrative to bed...they said they didn't hold him!

 

[thunderpimp91]

The only thing I meant in the previous post was that there is no flag for illegal formation if the ref gets the right player eligible (68 not 70) - there is no doubt in my mind he got that wrong

Ignore my other post, sounds like we pretty much agree then lol

 

[JBS]

Problem with that is the refs declared #70 eligible. Detroit never cleared up the miscommunication, which is on them.

This has been my argument the entire time against Det. They knew the ref got it wrong and did nothing

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

Exactly. Had we been told #68 was eligible, he would’ve been covered.

The entire sequence was a Detroit problem.

- They sent three guys up to the ref when only one needed to be anywhere in the vicinity of the ref
- #68 had the responsibility of ensuring that the ref understood he was declaring himself eligible. That’s usually an announcement, but in the absence of that, it’s still 68’s job
- They tried to get tricky and outsmarted themselves

Aside from all that, the #88 fumble into the end zone and the phantom tripping call were the only reasons the Lions were in the game to begin with. Last week, we had blatant defensive annd offensive holding non-calls that cost us a football game (and a RB who couldn’t break a weak arm tackle at the goal line).

All that means nothing if the ref simply referenced the wrong jersey # (70) when he went up

For those still trying to say illegal formation…it just wasn’t.

I’m thoroughly confused now and lost the will to take care.

 

[Hawkeye0202]

Here's an article where he is quoted ..
https://www.si.com/college/cal/news/goff-lions-lose-on-dubious-call

"I do know that Decker reported."​

​

That is a postgame quote from Lions quarterback and former Cal star Jared Goff.​

​

Taylor Decker later said the same thing, that he reported. "Went to the ref, said, 'Report,'" Decker said.​

Here's the thing.....saying you "said" report and the ref hearing you say "report" are two different things. The ref has zero reason to lie or make it up or more complicated than it has to be. Seem he simply didn't hear 68 report IMO.

 

[JW82]

Finally someone, Rich Eisen pointed out the obvious. Decker would not have been wide open if the D was told he was eligible.

 

[Kingofholland]

Wonder if Rules committee wxqxwill suggest players make a highly visible gesture if reporting as eligible

They sgoukd give them a special blue flag to wear

 

[Hawkeye0202]

Bingo Pete! This is the bottom line.......hell Campbell still could go into overtime and had a better chance IMO coz the Cowboys D was gassed. It was obvious they wanted nothing to do with an extra quarter.

 

[CWR]

It should also be pointed out even if the play stood we had 23 seconds, one time out and a kicker good from 70.

There are all sorts of ifs and buts, including an egregious tripping call that would've put the whole thing to bed anyway.

Just suck it Detroit.

 

[CWR]

Bingo Pete! This is the bottom line.......hell Campbell still could go into overtime and had a better chance IMO coz the Cowboys D was gassed. It was obvious they wanted nothing to do with an extra quarter.

I understood the first shot at it, the subsequent two tries were just foolish, especially since we had been punking them on 3rd/4th and short most the game.