Russia invades Ukraine *** READ RULES IN POST 6 BEFORE POSTING ***

[Bigdog]

Agreed, Putin laid out his terms, Ukraine should abide.

Putin may have laid out the terms but Ukraine wi not abide by them. They don’t want Russia telling them what they can and can not do. They are willing to die than be ruled by another country. Russia’s terms were somewhat unrealistic but they do need to come to a compromise and end all this killing of innocent people.

 

[Cowpolk]

Putin may have laid out the terms but Ukraine wi not abide by them. They don’t want Russia telling them what they can and can not do. They are willing to die than be ruled by another country. Russia’s terms were somewhat unrealistic but they do need to come to a compromise and end all this killing of innocent people.

I think Russia bit off more than they can chew

 

[Bigdog]

I think Russia bit off more than they can chew

Yup. I think they just thought they can just roll in and Ukrainians would just laid down. I think Putin greatly underestimate the will of people to be free and independent.

 

[Cowpolk]

Yup. I think they just thought they can just roll in and Ukrainians would just laid down. I think Putin greatly underestimate the will of people to be free and independent.

The Ukrainian's are set to fight to the end The Russian troupes do not want to be there Read a report the Russians are running out of munitions Ukraine is receiving a steady supply of new weapons rapidly

 

[John813]

IMO the only card Putin has on the table is Nukes for deterrent for the West.
Cause without those, he would be sweating bullets if NATO ever got involved. While China is an "ally" I doubt they would ever want to be involved in any conflict outside of taking back Taiwan.
Shame about the delay of transfer of MiGs to Ukraine.

 

[Sarek]

Shame about the delay of transfer of MiGs to Ukraine.

Classic western mistake. Banker mentality.

 

[Sarek]

Ukraine needs to step up its attacks on Russian forces. Russian army seems to be moving in slowly and comfortably. Hopefully those peace talks start picking up steam. Ukraine is out matched and the American Government is upping it’s 10billion to 13billion. No end in site and American people have to pay for a country that can’t defend itself. Ukraine had 30 years to prepare. Ask someone else besides America for the money.

 

[Fritsch_the_cat]

Putin may have laid out the terms but Ukraine wi not abide by them. They don’t want Russia telling them what they can and can not do. They are willing to die than be ruled by another country.

Then it's Ukraine being stubborn and getting people killed because of it. Russia did not say they wanted to rule over Ukraine, that's a strawman.

Crimea is already under Russian control, has been for several years, Ukraine needs to give up on it. Donetsk and Luhansk have not been part of Ukraine in all practicality for several years now. Ukraine needs to quit imposing tyranny on that region and let the go independent, no need to prolong that war.

All Ukraine had to do was let the Donbas region be autonomous, that's what they agreed to in the Minsk accords but they did not abide by their promise. That was Russia's original stance. Now it's to let them become independent nations.

Ukraine should see they are never going to be part of NATO. High ranking officials are on record back in 1997 saying Ukraine joining NATO would be a bridge too far for the Russians, that's why even up to this current conflict they have been hesitant on letting them join NATO.

That is sort of what started this, Zelensky stamping his feet about how if they can't join NATO they might seek to reacquire nukes. Putin got tired of all their crap.

A promise to not join NATO (which by all appearances isn't going to happen either way)...

Letting the Donbas region have their independence...

Recognizing Crimea now belongs to Russia...

None of those seem unreasonable.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

There will be no personal insults and name calling nor are you allowed to circumvent the language filter while posting.

 

[Sarek]

Peace is in the best interest of all countries involved. Peace helps everyone. This world needs less war.

 

[Bigdog]

Then it's Ukraine being stubborn and getting people killed because of it. Russia did not say they wanted to rule over Ukraine, that's a strawman.

Crimea is already under Russian control, has been for several years, Ukraine needs to give up on it. Donetsk and Luhansk have not been part of Ukraine in all practicality for several years now. Ukraine needs to quit imposing tyranny on that region and let the go independent, no need to prolong that war.

All Ukraine had to do was let the Donbas region be autonomous, that's what they agreed to in the Minsk accords but they did not abide by their promise. That was Russia's original stance. Now it's to let them become independent nations.

Ukraine should see they are never going to be part of NATO. High ranking officials are on record back in 1997 saying Ukraine joining NATO would be a bridge too far for the Russians, that's why even up to this current conflict they have been hesitant on letting them join NATO.

That is sort of what started this, Zelensky stamping his feet about how if they can't join NATO they might seek to reacquire nukes. Putin got tired of all their crap.

A promise to not join NATO (which by all appearances isn't going to happen either way)...

Letting the Donbas region have their independence...

Recognizing Crimea now belongs to Russia...

None of those seem unreasonable.

I agree with letting Russia have those lands and their independence but no country should dictate to another country if they should join with other nations. It is their choice for being independent. Finland is thinking about joining NATO and they have 383 mile border with Russia. Another reason why Putin also invaded is they have a Russian pro government in Ukraine then they don't have to pay them the $2 billion dollar fee to have oil transport it thru the country.

 

[Fritsch_the_cat]

no country should dictate to another country if they should join with other nations.

I agree but like I said, I don't think they will be allowed to join NATO anyway. Doesn't sound like much of a giveaway really.

Another reason why Putin also invaded is they have a Russian pro government in Ukraine then they don't have to pay them the $2 billion dollar fee to have oil transport it thru the country.

Meh, I don't think he really wants to control all of Ukraine. I think he just wants the Donbas region and for them to not join NATO. I think for him, that will be about as good as controlling all of Ukraine. Not sure he's so worried about what he pays for using the pipeline, he'll just do like every other company does and pass that cost along to whoever buys it.

With all that said I just want to add, I don't really trust Putin, it just seems at this point making peace with him is Zelensky's best hope. Those war planes aren't coming and Germany is starting to hedge on sanctioning Russia. China is taking up some of the slack for Russia too.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

If Putin just wanted those two areas in Ukraine...he would have just moved troops there without resistance since they are already pro russian and dare Ukraine to do anything about it.

Nope. If you think he does not want to control Ukraine I think you are being Naïve.

Just to be clear, I am not trying to be confrontational nor rude. I am just rather blunt at times and hope you do not take offense to a strong opinion.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

 

[DallasEast]

Peace is in the best interest of all countries involved. Peace helps everyone. This world needs less war.

Putin is ex-KGB. He has access to one of the best intelligence networks on the globe.

Putin (not the Russian government or its people) fabricated a lie to 'validate' his invasion scheme. He is the aggressor.

Any peace talk overtures submitted by Ukraine should be accepted without reservation by Putin. He is the bad guy in this entire horrific affair. As such, any discussion about peace between Russia and Ukraine should start and end with what Putin is or is not doing towards ending hostiles between both nations permanently in my opinion.

 

[Sarek]

Putin is ex-KGB. He has access to one of the best intelligence networks on the globe.

Putin (not the Russian government or its people) fabricated a lie to 'validate' his invasion scheme. He is the aggressor.

Any peace talk overtures submitted by Ukraine should be accepted without reservation by Putin. He is the bad guy in this entire horrific affair. As such, any discussion about peace between Russia and Ukraine should start and end with what Putin is or is not doing towards ending hostiles between both nations permanently in my opinion.

I know, but this is not a fair world. Peace talks must be realistic.

 

[JJHLH1]

What is Russia’s endpoint in a war they can’t win?

Even if Russia manages to take over territory how will they hold it when their economy collapses?

 

[DallasEast]

I know, but this is not a fair world. Peace talks must be realistic.

How realistic is it to believe peace will ever happen if an aggressor will continue directing his invasion force to kill and pillage despite any peace overtures extended by the Ukrainians?

 

[Fritsch_the_cat]

Nope. If you think he does not want to control Ukraine I think you are being Naïve.

He could take control of Ukraine and they couldn't do anything about it too. He's been pulling his punches so far. Anyone who doesn't realize that is being naive.

 

[Fritsch_the_cat]

Even if Russia manages to take over territory how will they hold it when their economy collapses?

China is taking up the slack and Germany is starting to go soft on sanctions. The Saudi's are refusing to pump out more oil. Europe will only go so long without that Russian oil.