So Fellas, Do You Think Jerry Trades Both 1s For Mcfadden

[Apollo Creed]

I watched D-Mac live in Columbia, SC last year - I've watched a lot of football live. I've never seen a guy make people miss the way he does, hes not that strong or that shifty - he has great body control. Granted, it was against the Carolina Gamecocks - but even with 8 men in the box he'd consistently break 40 yarders like it was nothing. Watching him live, showed me he was the real deal.

He wont be able to carry the ball 20+ times in the NFL, he doesn't need to. Jerry Jones has already sent in the Cowboys #1 pick and its D-Mac. The only way I'd concede to McFadden plans, if he we somehow get Slaton or Ray Rice, as well as DeSean Jackson (Ted Ginn's sucess plays a big role in his spot).

RB/WR/CB, repeat.

 

[Rack]

You know. Sometimes you have something half way enlightening to say. Other times, well my three month old puppy's whinning is more intelligent. The draft isn't a perfect science. I'm not sure what you were implying when you said Russell Maryland. As a first overall pick, I consider him a bust. Was he a good player? Yes, but a bust as a #1 overall pick. BTW, Jimmy Johnson gets credit for that one. Reading back over what you replied to me vs what I wrote. I said he made mistakes and you quoted many of them and then acted like I didn't know what I was talking about. I have no f'in clue what the hell you are talking about. Dude, don't use drugs before you post.

At least I get it sometimes. You on the other hand....



ANd the draft isn't an exact science, but here's some common sense for you (common for most of us anyway):


The higher you draft, the better chance you have at getting an elite player.


Would you rather have a Shante Carver and David Lafleur or a Darren McFadden?

 

[iceberg]

I watched D-Mac live in Columbia, SC last year - I've watched a lot of football live. I've never seen a guy make people miss the way he does, hes not that strong or that shifty - he has great body control. Granted, it was against the Carolina Gamecocks - but even with 8 men in the box he'd consistently break 40 yarders like it was nothing. Watching him live, showed me he was the real deal.

He wont be able to carry the ball 20+ times in the NFL, he doesn't need to. Jerry Jones has already sent in the Cowboys #1 pick and its D-Mac. The only way I'd concede to McFadden plans, if he we somehow get Slaton or Ray Rice, as well as DeSean Jackson (Ted Ginn's sucess plays a big role in his spot).

RB/WR/CB, repeat.

turner, fitzgerald, draft

possible also and likely of more value as we can trade our pick for fitzgerald, sign turner as an UFA, trade down maybe w/clevelands pick and get a CB + another 2nd rounder where we can look at OT or DT.

people need to get off mcfaddens jock. he's NOT the only player out there who can help us. if we can land him w/o going crazy, let's look at that *as an option*. not as a do or die.

 

[YosemiteSam]

At least I get it sometimes. You on the other hand....

ANd the draft isn't an exact science, but here's some common sense for you (common for most of us anyway):

The higher you draft, the better chance you have at getting an elite player.

Would you rather have a Shante Carver and David Lafleur or a Darren McFadden?

Would you rather have Ryan Leaf (Round #1 Pick #2) and Ki-Jana Carter (Round #1 Pick #1) or Roger Staubach (Round #10 Pick #129) or even Tony Romo (Un-freakin drafted).

You are the one who said you would take Fatboy Meacham over Revis and said Patrick Willis, Laron Landry, and Adrian Peterson wouldn't be on your list! I suspect Adrian Peterson will be ROY and Patrick Willis will be DROY.

 

[Zaxor]

I watched D-Mac live in Columbia, SC last year - I've watched a lot of football live. I've never seen a guy make people miss the way he does, hes not that strong or that shifty - he has great body control. Granted, it was against the Carolina Gamecocks - but even with 8 men in the box he'd consistently break 40 yarders like it was nothing. Watching him live, showed me he was the real deal.

He wont be able to carry the ball 20+ times in the NFL, he doesn't need to. Jerry Jones has already sent in the Cowboys #1 pick and its D-Mac. The only way I'd concede to McFadden plans, if he we somehow get Slaton or Ray Rice, as well as DeSean Jackson (Ted Ginn's sucess plays a big role in his spot).

RB/WR/CB, repeat.

Archie Griffin is the example I like to bring up in these situations ... He was so much better than everyone else that he not only one 1 heisman but 2 and as far as I know is still the only college player ever to do so... he was that special and anybody who watched him would tell you just how special he was...but when he went pro he sucked... the moral of this story is that no matter how good they look in College there is still a 50% chance for the RB to bust...now if we had say a top 5 pick and they want to use that for the RB thats okay but to give up 2 1st rnd and probably other picks as well to move up and get mcfadden and put all their eggs in one basket is foolish...Ditka tried that with Ricky Williams (another can't miss pick)

 

[Rack]

Would you rather have Ryan Leaf (Round #1 Pick #2) and Ki-Jana Carter (Round #1 Pick #1) or Roger Staubach (Round #10 Pick #129) or even Tony Romo (Un-freakin drafted).

You are the one who said you would take Fatboy Meacham over Revis and said Patrick Willis, Laron Landry, and Adrian Peterson wouldn't be on your list! I suspect Adrian Peterson will be ROY and Patrick Willis will be DROY.

Ok, I'll type this reeal slow so that maybe even YOU can understand...


YOU

HAVE

A

HIGHER

CHANCE

OF

GETTING

AN

ELITE

PLAYER

THE

HIGHER

YOU

DRAFT.

THAT

DOESN'T

MEAN

IT

IS

THE

ONLY

WAY

TO

GET

AN

ELITE

PLAYER

BUT

IT

IS

THE

BEST

CHANCE

OF

GETTING

ONE.

Better?

 

[GimmeTheBall!]

I find it strange that everybody has been salivating over MB performances and then there is this parallel yearning for McFad.

I think we need a WR and shutdown CB more than a rookie running back.

 

[wileedog]

I find it strange that everybody has been salivating over MB performances and then there is this parallel yearning for McFad.

I think we need a WR and shutdown CB more than a rookie running back.

We have a shutdown CB. We don't need two.

And a rookie WR is no better than rookie RB. Usually worse actually, if you are only thinking short term.

Barber is great, but he's not a feature back. He's not a guy who keeps opposing DCs up late at night scheming around. He's not a guy who draws an extra safety into the box just by stepping on the field.

McFadden is *potentially* all of those things. And it would replace what we will lose in TO not too far down the road.

Now if there was a WR as clearly ahead of the pack among that position as McFadden is to RBs (in some folks mind), then I have no problem going for the WR. Or pulling a deal for Fitzgerald if that fantasy turns out to be real. I just want the most talented offensive skill player we can get our hands on, because we will be losing a good one or two relatively shortly.

McFadden looks like the best bet at this point as far as the draft goes. If Ireland has him ranked that far ahead of everyone, then make the deal IMO.

 

[CATCH17]

I find it strange that everybody has been salivating over MB performances and then there is this parallel yearning for McFad.

I think we need a WR and shutdown CB more than a rookie running back.

I think people have bought into the 2 back thing thats why.

I've always been a guy who wants to give it to my back 20+ times a game.

But from what i've seen and from what other teams are doing 2 backs is really the way to go.

We could really really beat up on teams with McFadden and Barber as a tandem. JMO.

My dream is to somehow get McFadden and Fitzgerald somehow this offseason. Not going to happen but that would be bad ***.

 

[browniis69]

I'm not sold on the idea of drafting McFadden with a top pick, much less trading up to get him. I admit, I've never seen him play. I'm not argueing that he isn't a great back. But is he that much better than Barber that you'd take that huge gamble on him? If he's as good as everyone is saying the gamble isn't so much that he'll be a bad player, it's just a gamble that he'll be a huge upgrade for the team over our current running back duo which are doing a great job. I don't see any way you spend a top pick on a running back and then pay what it'd take to sign Barber as a backup. Maybe someone can do it before draft day comes, but I'm still waiting to be convinced that McFadden will improve our team more than two first round draft pics in other positions.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

I'm not sold on the idea of drafting McFadden with a top pick, much less trading up to get him. I admit, I've never seen him play.

That's the problem, then... You need to watch the next time UA plays on TV.

 

[Clove]

I have no problems getting McFadden, as long as we find a way to address our OLD WR group. Stanback may or may not be the answer there, and Crayton is a 2 at best, TO will last another 3 years (maybe/maybe not) Glenn is injured almost always.

But for those who think we will sign Barber (nice fat contract if he keeps playing the way he's playing) and then sign McFadden (HUGE CONTRACT HERE) I don't think so.

Barber and JJ are gone if we get McFadden, which isn't the end of the world, as long as McFadden is a can't miss. (we already know what Barber can do)

EDIT: Let me add this... If we let JJ walk, and Barber agrees to an acceptable contract that isn't way over board, and also agrees to WAY less carries, then keeping Barber is a good idea.

 

[CATCH17]

I'm not sold on the idea of drafting McFadden with a top pick, much less trading up to get him. I admit, I've never seen him play. I'm not argueing that he isn't a great back. But is he that much better than Barber that you'd take that huge gamble on him? If he's as good as everyone is saying the gamble isn't so much that he'll be a bad player, it's just a gamble that he'll be a huge upgrade for the team over our current running back duo which are doing a great job. I don't see any way you spend a top pick on a running back and then pay what it'd take to sign Barber as a backup. Maybe someone can do it before draft day comes, but I'm still waiting to be convinced that McFadden will improve our team more than two first round draft pics in other positions.

You gotta see him dude. He is the shiznit for real.

Hes putting up numbers like Bo Jackson and Herschel Walker did in that conference and breaking some of their records.

 

[Wolfpack]

Not necessarily.

Think of it this way...

What if the Browns' pick ends up being around 15 and our pick around 25.


With those picks, on THIS team, we likely won't get a year 1 or year 2 starter. That player would likely be depth.

SOrt of like Bobby Carpenter. We all know people cry like babies cuz Carp isn't a starter (nevermind that we have A LOT of talent on the team and it's harder for 1st round picks to start, it's not like 5-6 years ago where our roster was so weak that it was easy for a rookie to start).


Would you rather have another "Bobby Carpenter" or would you rather trade those two Carpenters and get an elite starter?


That said, I like Carpenter and think he'll be a good LB for us for years to come. BUt he'll never be "Elite".


On THIS team, since we have A LOT of depth, I'd add a superstar starter. If it were 6 years ago and we need a lot of players, I'd take the multiple starters (cuz 6 years ago they'd have a MUCH better chance of starting).


Of course we'd probably only be able to get up to around 6th or 7th with those two picks but that might be good enough to get him.

Thats pretty much what JJ talked about around draft time this year if I recall.

 

[iceberg]

You gotta see him dude. He is the shiznit for real.

Hes putting up numbers like Bo Jackson and Herschel Walker did in that conference and breaking some of their records.

funny you should use these two that while were good, were far short of where people thought their careers would go. sometimes even a "sure thing" is far too expensive.

 

[silverblue]

You gotta see him dude. He is the shiznit for real.

Hes putting up numbers like Bo Jackson and Herschel Walker did in that conference and breaking some of their records.

Oh, and what shiznit(literally) Bo Jackson and Herschel walker were in the NFL. Great examples there CATCH

 

[tyke1doe]

and if Mcfadden fails... let me think of all the can't miss RB's taken in the first round off the top of my head KiJana Carter, Blair Thomas, Alonzo Highsmith, Curtis Enis aww heck there is a TON of them also look at the % of them that go bust 49% so roughly half are full blown busts...now check out the CB's and DE's and if you can get 2 Stars or even if you are lucky 2 superstars is it worth giving them up for a half a chance that you might get a good RB...I don't think so...there are other RB's that can be had without forfeiting the other pick...

But no one is going to criticize or fault the Cowboys for jumping up to take a running back most if not al have as the consensus No. 1 back.

You act as if teams have hindsight when they make their picks.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=kluck/wrapup/070425&sportCat=nfl

First-Round Bust Percentages
QB -- 53 percent
RB -- 49 percent
WR -- 45 percent
DT -- 33 percent
OL -- 31 percent
DE -- 31 percent
CB -- 29 percent
LB -- 16 percent
S -- 11 percent

With all due respect, those statistics are meaningless without knowing how many players of each position are drafted and how high they're drafted.

For example, if we're talking about safeties, safeties are rarely selected in the first round, unless they're considered exceptional safeties. So, of course, their bust rating is lower. That says more about how teams view safeties moreso than if you select a safety in the first round he has less chances of being a bust.

 

[Apollo Creed]

Players being busts depends greatly on their situation, sometimes guys are put in positions where they just can't win. However, some guys are put in good positions and can't handle the speed of the NFL game.

Darren McFadden is a consensus superstar in the eyes of almost all scouts, the Arkansas football program isn't exactly dominant - so imagine his talent and elusiveness behind our enormous o-line. He could've gone to any school in the entire country but decided to stay in the 501, we can debate all we want about what we're willing to sacrifice for him - but put me on board for giving up both picks if the Browns slip out of the top 10.

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=darren+mcfadden

Watch any given highlight film, and you'll see this kid running all over the best conference in football.

 

[wileedog]

funny you should use these two that while were good, were far short of where people thought their careers would go. sometimes even a "sure thing" is far too expensive.

Bo got hurt. He was every bit as advertised beforehand, and all picks high or low carry the same risk of injury.

And heck, Herschel should be in the Ring of Honor for the valuable service he provided this team by being traded...

 

[Fletch]

Not necessarily.

Think of it this way...

What if the Browns' pick ends up being around 15 and our pick around 25.


With those picks, on THIS team, we likely won't get a year 1 or year 2 starter. That player would likely be depth.

SOrt of like Bobby Carpenter. We all know people cry like babies cuz Carp isn't a starter (nevermind that we have A LOT of talent on the team and it's harder for 1st round picks to start, it's not like 5-6 years ago where our roster was so weak that it was easy for a rookie to start).


Would you rather have another "Bobby Carpenter" or would you rather trade those two Carpenters and get an elite starter?


That said, I like Carpenter and think he'll be a good LB for us for years to come. BUt he'll never be "Elite".


On THIS team, since we have A LOT of depth, I'd add a superstar starter. If it were 6 years ago and we need a lot of players, I'd take the multiple starters (cuz 6 years ago they'd have a MUCH better chance of starting).


Of course we'd probably only be able to get up to around 6th or 7th with those two picks but that might be good enough to get him.

Nicely put. I was looking for some kind of justification for trading both 1st rounders to move up in the McFadden sweepstakes. Well stated.

But I'd also, just in case McFadden's stock goes through the roof and is unattainable, want to look at all of the other RB options, being that the way things are stacking up for Julius, he's most likely not going to be in Dallas after this season.

Not sure I trust looking into free agency for somebody's retread RB. So who should we look into signing if RB is a first day priority for the Cowboys?