So Sick of The Shawne Merriman Hype

[superpunk]

Yes, you are being a homer, there's no hype, he's the real thing. Had we picked him, he would still be getting credit, maybe even more because of the star. He can play lb and de, he played at a bigger school than Ware and he is probably faster and more powerful than Ware. He was the one who exposed Peyton Manning's weakness to the Steelers. He almost single-handedly beat the Colts by himself. I would have drafted him and the other lineman that the Chargers drafted over Ware and Spears, but I wouldn't have drafted Phillip Rivers or Charlie Whitehurst, just to show you I'm not a closet Charger fan.

I bet you'd have drafted Cleo Lemon.

 

[kartr]

Last week, I got grilled comparing Merriman and Ware. "You shouldn't do that, be happy with who we have". Now I click on this trend and everyone is comparing the two. Where is the justice.

Anyway, Merriman made the probowl and such, so he will get more attention. I think and hope that Ware will have a big season this year, as these two will be compared cause we passed on Merriman for Ware.

Winning and production will make Ware more visible.

What is Merriman's nickname anyway??

Lights out is his nickname.

 

[YosemiteSam]

BTW, if we drafted Merriman last year, we probably would have gotten Manny Lawson this year...

makes me a little sick to think about it that way...

But anyway, I am still happy with our moves.

Yes and no. I'm not sure (2) DeMarcus Ware type players is what you want. To have two extremely quick pass rushers generally creates a run stopping weakness on both sides rather than one. Thats why you hear DeMarcus Ware holds his own against the run. In a 3-4 the linebacker has to take on linemen that can be more than 70lbs heavier. He gets safety help. (Parcells is going to let Williams run more free (closer to the line) this year) With Ellis playing the other side and him being 270lbs gives us more bulk (with some quickness) in stopping the run. I think Ellis (run wise) is a great outside linebacker opposite Ware. Merriman is 275 and very similar to Ware also! Rushing the passer, Ware is better. Run stopping, Merriman is better. Merriman may be the better total package since he can do both prolifically, but as a pure pass rusher. Ware is more dominate.

Edit: Whoops went off topic. I said if we had (2) DeMarcus Ware type players when you said if we had drafted Merriman. Merriman is big enough to stop the run which would have made Manny Lawson an acceptable draft choice!

 

[kartr]

Never watched the Chargers?
And yet you're dissing one of their sickest players...

hmmm


Merriman is a freak.
He is beast and is only going to get better.

Some of the homerism here goes too far.
If all you do is watch Dallas every week then I think that makes you a Cowboys fan but NOT a football fan. Therefor, you're not qualified to comment on other players around the league.

I LOVE ME SOME WARE.
But had we drafted Merriman instead, I'd feel the same about him and so would you.

Point is, there are LBers around the league better than Ware.
Merriman might be one of them.

Well said, these guys need to get a grip. There would be even more hyped heap on Merriman if we had drafted him.

 

[kartr]

Only one of Ware's sacks was that way. He got Delhomme to fumble three times, but he was at Delhomme's body on two of those and simply stripped the ball. Only once did he reach and poke out the ball from "outside the tackling zone." And none of his sacks on other quarterbacks came that way, either.

See what I mean about the homerism, you're comparing Delhomme to Peyton Manning. Manning had a better line, better receivers and a better running back than Delhomme and yet Merriman still disrupted their offense tremendously. Did the Chargers defense change dramatically after getting Merriman, yes it did. The Chargers secondary isn't even as good as ours, yet Merriman transformed their defense. Did the Chargers defense disrupt our offense when Merriman missed the first game, no it didnt. Our defense was better with Ware than without, but the Chargers' defense completely changed for the better. There is a big difference. Now imagine what our defense would be like with Merriman and Castillo.

 

[kartr]

I bet you'd have drafted Cleo Lemon.

Get real, I like athletic qb's, but only those who've demonstrated that they can play against the big boys. Rivers hasn't proven anything yet, can't throw deep and has zero mobility and is over-rated. Whitehurst is a good athlete who was an underachiever his whole career. Quarterback might not be even his best position. The Chargers have about the worst qb situation you could possibly have, that's why I mentioned it and did it to themselves when they let Brees go.

 

[LD Fan]

Yes, you are being a homer, there's no hype, he's the real thing. Had we picked him, he would still be getting credit, maybe even more because of the star. He can play lb and de, he played at a bigger school than Ware and he is probably faster and more powerful than Ware. He was the one who exposed Peyton Manning's weakness to the Steelers. He almost single-handedly beat the Colts by himself. I would have drafted him and the other lineman that the Chargers drafted over Ware and Spears, but I wouldn't have drafted Phillip Rivers or Charlie Whitehurst, just to show you I'm not a closet Charger fan.

So you're agreeing that Merriman is a legit #11 in the NFL? And a player with comparable stats doesn't make the list? A guy isn't a homer to question that. Either Merriman is over-hyped or Ware is underappreciated. Probably a little of both is the answer. That's not homerism it's logic.

 

[Jarv]

Yes and no. I'm not sure (2) DeMarcus Ware type players is what you want. To have two extremely quick pass rushers generally creates a run stopping weakness on both sides rather than one. Thats why you hear DeMarcus Ware holds his own against the run. In a 3-4 the linebacker has to take on linemen that can be more than 70lbs heavier. He gets safety help. (Parcells is going to let Williams run more free (closer to the line) this year) With Ellis playing the other side and him being 270lbs gives us more bulk (with some quickness) in stopping the run. I think Ellis (run wise) is a great outside linebacker opposite Ware. Merriman is 275 and very similar to Ware also! Rushing the passer, Ware is better. Run stopping, Merriman is better. Merriman may be the better total package since he can do both prolifically, but as a pure pass rusher. Ware is more dominate.

Edit: Whoops went off topic. I said if we had (2) DeMarcus Ware type players when you said if we had drafted Merriman. Merriman is big enough to stop the run which would have made Manny Lawson an acceptable draft choice!

The stats do not match up with your analysis. Fact is Ware made more tackles (and tackles behind the line of scrimage) than Merriman in run Support.

Also Merriman got more sacks than Ware in the pass rush game.

You analysis makes sense, but the actual season stats (last years) don't back it up.

 

[Doomsdayblitz]

I danced up & down yelling for 10 minutes after we drafted Ware. I couldn't believe we had the chance to take a player with Merriman's ability, & passed. Now that a season has passed, I couldn't be happier to have Ware. I would love to have "Lights Out" too. The fact is that they are going to both be great players in this league.

Here is my bottom line: After wiffing on pass rushers Shante Carver, Kavika Pittman, & Ebenezer Ekuban, Ware is like a dream come true. So, if you want to compare him to someone, compare him to these guys. Then, maybe, you'll have the kind of appreciation that I do that we took Ware instead of another loser.

Carpenter is another great pick that will paying dividends long after the Tuna is gone. Even the great Tom Landry gave his LBs 3 years to develop. Most of you have given Carp TC & preseason to dig his grave. Way to go, Cowboys fans.

 

[AdamJT13]

See what I mean about the homerism, you're comparing Delhomme to Peyton Manning.

Are you insane? I haven't said a word about Peyton Manning, and I didn't compare Delhomme to anyone.

You just bought a one-way ticket to my ignore list. Have fun.

 

[LD Fan]

Are you insane? I haven't said a word about Peyton Manning, and I didn't compare Delhomme to anyone.

You just bought a one-way ticket to my ignore list. Have fun.

Probably not insane.....just belongs to the "I have an opinion and I'll say anything stupid to support it" club.

 

[YosemiteSam]

The stats do not match up with your analysis. Fact is Ware made more tackles (and tackles behind the line of scrimage) than Merriman in run Support.

Also Merriman got more sacks than Ware in the pass rush game.

You analysis makes sense, but the actual season stats (last years) don't back it up.

Not true! If Ware beats his linemen into the backfield, then he could get the running back in the backfield. If they are running wide, Ware could beat them wide to make the stop. Ware is fast enough to catch running backs from behind when linemen pull the other way also. What I'm talking about is Ware getting bulldozed by a 320 offensive linemen. All runs don't happen the same every time. If they running at Ware vs running at Merriman, Merriman has the advantage.

 

[Stautner]

The stats do not match up with your analysis. Fact is Ware made more tackles (and tackles behind the line of scrimage) than Merriman in run Support.

Also Merriman got more sacks than Ware in the pass rush game.

You analysis makes sense, but the actual season stats (last years) don't back it up.

I know Merriman held out of training camp and wasn't a starter for several games early in the season last year. I'm not sure, but he may have even missed a game or two - at the very least played very little early on.

The point is that Merriman's stats were built on less playing time than Ware's. That's not to say Ware won't be better over time, but the reality is that Merriman was more of an impact player last year than Ware.

 

[tyke1doe]

I think he is hyped too much, but at this point his is a more disruptive player, plus he's one of those energy guys teammates feed off of, like Irvin. I've seen him drop back and he seems to be a little better than Demarcus right now, but I think thats because of experience, and in time that will change in our favor.

I think the main difference is demarcus still just tries to speed around the corner, although he has started bull rushing. I think in time both will end up around the same place, having said that I'm all for high energy guys, I think they elevate everyone around them, IF they don't blow up. I'm happy with Demarcus, but I think if Merriman was on our team, we'd be hyping even more than he is now, after all, we are Cowboys fans.

If Merriman was on the Cowboys, I doubt he would have gotten 10 sacks. He would not be a rush-only linebacker as he is with the Chargers.

Put Ware on the Chargers and, it is my opinion, he would have had double digit sacks becuse he is good at chasing down QBs from the back side and would have benefited from the presence of Foley and Edwards.

 

[justbob]

Ware doesn't dance around like an idiot after every tackle so he doesn't get noticed. I'll still take Ware anyday.

Once again I agree ---:starspin

 

[AdamJT13]

Put Ware on the Chargers and, it is my opinion, he would have had double digit sacks becuse he is good at chasing down QBs from the back side and would have benefited from the presence of Foley and Edwards.

True. Watch Merriman's sacks, and there's usually pressure by other players. At least half of his sacks came after the quarterback had tucked the ball, often because of pressure by other players.

Watch Ware's sacks, and he's almost always the only one anywhere close to the quarterback. And he almost always gets to the quarterback quickly, beating his man right away. On his only sack with the quarterback out of the pocket, he was the one who flushed him out.

 

[Deep_Freeze]

I danced up & down yelling for 10 minutes after we drafted Ware. I couldn't believe we had the chance to take a player with Merriman's ability, & passed. Now that a season has passed, I couldn't be happier to have Ware. I would love to have "Lights Out" too. The fact is that they are going to both be great players in this league.

Here is my bottom line: After wiffing on pass rushers Shante Carver, Kavika Pittman, & Ebenezer Ekuban, Ware is like a dream come true. So, if you want to compare him to someone, compare him to these guys. Then, maybe, you'll have the kind of appreciation that I do that we took Ware instead of another loser.

Carpenter is another great pick that will paying dividends long after the Tuna is gone. Even the great Tom Landry gave his LBs 3 years to develop. Most of you have given Carp TC & preseason to dig his grave. Way to go, Cowboys fans.

I remember a week ago, you blasting me for comparing these two, like it shouldn't be even thought of. Well, here is 6 pages of a trend about the very subject you went off on me about for bringing it up. Apparently, people do compare the two.

 

[superpunk]

True. Watch Merriman's sacks, and there's usually pressure by other players. At least half of his sacks came after the quarterback had tucked the ball, often because of pressure by other players.

Watch Ware's sacks, and he's almost always the only one anywhere close to the quarterback. And he almost always gets to the quarterback quickly, beating his man right away. On his only sack with the quarterback out of the pocket, he was the one who flushed him out.

I'm a big Merriman fan, so I decided to check it out.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D_v7awqSfmU

Sack 1 - he bullrushes Williams? straight into the Bills QB. All Merriman on that one.

Sack 2, there is pressure up the middle from another defender, but when Jets QB steps up, Merriman trips him. Not extraordinarily impressive, but I think you attribute that solely to Merriman.

it shows Green going down, not sure if it's a sack, but it just looks like a busted play.

Sack 4, Merriman gets a free shot at the Steelers QB. Not a very impressive sack, but he got there with hustle.

Sack 5 against Manning, I think was a nice play where he recovered from biting the play action, and ran Manning down. Coverage sack, unless it was a designed keeper, which I doubt.

Sack 6, he doesn't beat anyone, just gets McNabb when McNabb breaks containment. No help from other players

Sack 7, he completely beats the RT. It's a pathetic sack in the end, not sure if he got whole r half, but Castillo takes Peyton down.

Sack 8, gets Green when he steps up, outside pressure applied by others. He does get alot of pub for pushing Roaf backwards a few feet, tho.

Sack 9, he owes to others. Bills QB flushed right, simple take down.

Sack 10, he drives the G straight back into Peyton, and gets him when he steps up.

I didn't see him getting an inordinate amount of cheap sacks, and I don't know how this relates to Ware (might look at that in a minute). I think Ware was the more complete LB last year, more responsibilities - but Merriman did what the Chargers asked him to do as well as could be expected.

 

[kartr]

Are you insane? I haven't said a word about Peyton Manning, and I didn't compare Delhomme to anyone.

You just bought a one-way ticket to my ignore list. Have fun.

Turn and run if you want to, I don't care, but you deliberatedly tried misinterpret what I said. You know damn well I was comparing what Merriman did to Manning as opposed to what Ware did to Delhomme. The Cowboys running game did in Delhomme and the ejection of Steve Smith,not Ware. You do the math. Manning is a better qb than Delhomme or Bledsoe and has better weapons than either, yet Merriman helped dismantle the Colt offense with a crummy secondary backing him up. He was down-right Haleyesque. I like Ware, but he's not nearly as disruptive as Merriman. The Colts had to even change their blocking schemes for him which freed up his teammates to make plays. Where is the insanity in this viewpoint?

 

[kartr]

Probably not insane.....just belongs to the "I have an opinion and I'll say anything stupid to support it" club.

Hey, I thought name calling, which is a personal attack was out of bounds. You and Adam can both give yourselves a demerit.