Sturm's Morning After: Cowboys have a coaching mess; Garrett ignores reality of the underdog

[khiladi]

This is just a waste of my time.

You don't want to understand so you're not going to understand despite the fact that I've given you many detailed responses and examples and all I get in return is basically your opinion that Garrett sucks because you emotionally "feel" like he sucks.

Of course I've not given any 'logical reasons' why Garrett sucks, but your argumentsare full of well-balanced thought and your un-biased, especially the one about Switzer going to the bathroom from the sidelines and eating hot-dogs. Of course, you were only raising logical possibilities, not implying Wade was anything like that...

BTW, Callahan built this line, another guy that Garrett burnt bridges with, obviously because Garrett likes to get all the credit and can't stand anybody else. Garrett and his buddy Stephen were set on getting guys like Sharif Floyd, while totally oblivious to the fact the defensive coaches didn't want him at all... Garrett had us waffling in a man blocking scheme for multiple years, getting big guys.. a scheme he has always coached in and with a coach he worked with for multiple years. Let's not forget that Wade wanted Solari anyways, a zone-blocking scheme. Just another multiple years late at Valley Ranch, because Garrett has been coaching..

 

[xwalker]

Of course I've not given any 'logical reasons' why Garrett sucks, but your argumentsare full of well-balanced thought and your un-biased, especially the one about Switzer going to the bathroom from the sidelines and eating hot-dogs. Of course, you were only raising logical possibilities, not implying Wade was anything like that...

BTW, Callahan built this line. Garrett and his buddy Stephen were set on getting guys like Sharif Floyd, while totally oblivious to the fact the defensive coaches didn't want him at all...

Unlike you and most people, I'm not going to go to extremes to support my side of the argument.

I will readily admit that Garrett is far from perfect. I blame Garrett for the Doug Free debacle. Callahan preferred Parnell and Garrett insisted on keeping Free as the starter. I'm certain that Garrett "stood on the table" in favor of re-signing Free over Parnell this off-season which as you probably know is a treacherous act from my point of view on the subject.

On the Floyd debacle, I can't really blame Garrett for the general concept of wanting to have the scouts run the draft. We've seen years of Jerry over-riding the scouts and this was one of the few times that it actually worked out. Scouts didn't want to draft Quincy but Jerry was told by somebody outside the organization to draft him. Jerry overrode the scouting dept on the Joey Galloway trade. There are numerous examples where overriding the scouts had a bad result.

After the Floyd debacle, Garrett and Stephen Jones worked together to get Will McClay promoted over Ciscowski because McClay has the personality to deal with Jerry and the coaches. The trio of Garrett, Stephen and McClay did get Jerry to pass on drafting Manziel which was a small miracle that would not have happened just a few years prior.

Again, it comes down to the alternatives and it could be far worse than having Garrett as the HC.

 

[khiladi]

After the Floyd debacle, Garrett and Stephen Jones worked together to get Will McClay promoted over Ciscowski because McClay has the personality to deal with Jerry and the coaches. The trio of Garrett, Stephen and McClay did get Jerry to pass on drafting Manziel which was a small miracle that would not have happened just a few years prior..

Nice, unsubstantiated story you have there, especially considering how much Jerry fawns over Romo and pretty much said,he was going to give him a role like Peyton Manning after the huge contract Jerry awarded him, and along with the contract said Romo would be involved in the game-planning, and further, Jerry himself gushed about the relationship between Linehan and Romo, while everybody else was looking at other aspects of the team. But yeah, Jerry wanted Manziel despite all these facts, even though he also clearly said they weren't going QB in anyway prior to the draft... You sound like Clarence Hill..

In the end, it's all about making Jason look good, despite the claims otherwise. But then again, if we were to accept your rationale, it makes me wonder why Jason couldn't stop Jerry from getting guys like Weeden and Cassell, but he supposedly did have the power to convince Jerry to relinquish his infatuation and obsession with Johnny Manziel..

That being said, considering Kiffen and Rod were hired in January, there is close to 4 months of absolute ignorance by Stephen and Jason not to understand that the defense didn't want Sharif. What makes it more astonishing is the fact he was a 3-4 guy and Dallas already switched to a 4-3.

I mean how does one reconcile one's self with all these contradictions in thought..

 

[Sydla]

Again, it comes down to the alternatives and it could be far worse than having Garrett as the HC.

This is the logic that drives me insane sometimes.

So you'd rather stick with a guy you readily admit is probably average and likely can't win a SB because you are afraid the next coach might be worse than average.

That's such bizarre thinking to me. Continue to be average because you are afraid of being worse.

 

[Dave_in-NC]

Marinelli last year was our hero. Unquestioned.

Now people want to dump him and i think its fair. Because we all know every great coach will forget how to coach in 10 months. It happens every day.... And they never come back.

Every one knew the offense covered for the defense. If there were any hero's it was Romo and Murray.

 

[xwalker]

This is the logic that drives me insane sometimes.

So you'd rather stick with a guy you readily admit is probably average and likely can't win a SB because you are afraid the next coach might be worse than average.

That's such bizarre thinking to me. Continue to be average because you are afraid of being worse.

In the NFL an average HC can win a Super Bowl.

You can't hire an elite NFL HC if they all already have jobs.

There is no guarantee from great college HCs, look at Saban's foray into the NFL.

Assistants are also no guarantee. Philbin in Miami was a disaster from what I understand.

 

[Sydla]

In the NFL an average HC can win a Super Bowl.

You can't hire an elite NFL HC if they all already have jobs.

There is no guarantee from great college HCs, look at Saban's foray into the NFL.

Assistants are also no guarantee. Philbin in Miami was a disaster from what I understand.

I am curious as to what average NFL head coaches (by your measure) have won SBs? A random example here or there doesn't really work. That's like arguing you can win a SB with a bad QB because Trent Dilfer did it once.

 

[Naruto]

The trio of Garrett, Stephen and McClay did get Jerry to pass on drafting Manziel which was a small miracle that would not have happened just a few years prior.

Bummer because with Johnny we may have actually won a game without Romo this season!

 

[CATCH17]

This is just a waste of my time.

You don't want to understand so you're not going to understand despite the fact that I've given you many detailed responses and examples and all I get in return is basically your opinion that Garrett sucks because you emotionally "feel" like he sucks.

Basically all you have said is that Garrett needs a perfect team to have success.

 

[xwalker]

I am curious as to what average NFL head coaches (by your measure) have won SBs? A random example here or there doesn't really work. That's like arguing you can win a SB with a bad QB because Trent Dilfer did it once.

Of the top of my head, I would say that Billl Walsh, Jimmy Johnson and Belichick are the elite HCs of the past 30 years and most of the rest are average or slightly above average.

In the past 12 years:
Belichick - Elite
Payton - Slightly above aveage.
Tony Dungy - Slightly above average.
Tom Coughlin - Average. (Probably the most like Garrett. Steady, maintains discipline, nothing inventive or wow about him).
Mike Tomlin - Average.
Mike McCarthy - Average.
John Harbaugh - Average.

 

[xwalker]

Basically all you have said is that Garrett needs a perfect team to have success.

Nope. I said he needs his top 2 players.

 

[xwalker]

Bummer because with Johnny we may have actually won a game without Romo this season!

Sure. The local spots talk radio guys took some calls yesterday can some caller guaranteed that they would win games with Tim Tebow. They were certain the Cowboys could sign him this week and then win all games until Romo returns.

 

[CATCH17]

Nope. I said he needs his top 2 players.

Anyone could win with those guys.

 

[cowboys1981]

Bummer because with Johnny we may have actually won a game without Romo this season!

Are you saying Manziel would've been the wiser choice over a rookie who made the All Pro team since 1947?

 

[xwalker]

Anyone could win with those guys.

Not really. Dez would likely have pulled TO by now if Wade was the HC and organized a mutiny if he didn't get 100% of all passes thrown to him.

 

[silver]

Sadly, we might have won the Giants game with Weed. If not for the INTs, the running game with 233 yards dominated and the defense was good.

Weeden would've never attempted the TD pass to Devin Street in the end zone. So no, we don't win with Weeden that one, or any other one for that matter.

 

[TwentyOne]

Every one knew the offense covered for the defense. If there were any hero's it was Romo and Murray.

Of course the offense was a big part our defense looked good. I never questioned that. Still Marinelli did a great job with what he had.

Because Marinelli did a great job doesnt mean others did not too. So where is your point other then being very childish in your argumentation ?

 

[GimmeTheBall!]

Garrett can't coach period.

I disagree: He can coach. He just cannot lead or inspire fear in the players.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

Buffalo hasn't won jack squat since Wade left. And by your Switzer logic, Shanahan won the SB based on Wade's team..

Wade was dealing with an inept Garrett during his tenure. It took Jerry 3 years of Garrett bungling the offense on his own, to surround him with some experienced coaches. If he had listened to Wade, Dan Reeves could have taught Garrett a thing or two about running the ball. Of course the standard reaction to that incident is Jerry axed it because of a time-card issue...

Like that is believable.. Jerry saw the need for Garrett to have some experienced input, because Garrett was struggling, but he decided to axe it because of a timecard issue. It's not like he could have gotten somebody else..

garrett produced top 10 offenses with wade....wade presided over a team that dintegrated and quit on the head coach...that same team that was 1-7, went 5-3 after wade was fired. wade's tenure has been the same everywhere. he is a defensive guru, but sucks as a leader and head coach of a team and teams disintegrate under him

 

[Sydla]

Of the top of my head, I would say that Billl Walsh, Jimmy Johnson and Belichick are the elite HCs of the past 30 years and most of the rest are average or slightly above average.

In the past 12 years:
Belichick - Elite
Payton - Slightly above aveage.
Tony Dungy - Slightly above average.
Tom Coughlin - Average. (Probably the most like Garrett. Steady, maintains discipline, nothing inventive or wow about him).
Mike Tomlin - Average.
Mike McCarthy - Average.
John Harbaugh - Average.

Honestly, hard to take you seriously when you try to argue Coughlin is an average coach. Average coaches don't win 2 SBs. Coughlin turned BC into a good team in 3 years after they had been run into the ground the last few years under Bicknell. He then took an expansion team from scratch to a playoff contender in 4 of their first 5 years including two AFC Title game appearances. Then he won not just one, but two SBs with the Giants.

Elite? Certainly not. But average like Garrett? Come on, dude. Shoot, some think he'll make the Hall of Fame.