The absurd underrating of Tony Romo just hit a new low

[Sammy Baugh]

I had better insert this factoid into the thread before Sammy Baugh skewers the relevancy of Pro Bowl nominations:

1) I am quite aware of how Pro Bowl berths originate.

2) I am also aware of the complaints of many players, including those who make the Pro Bowl, that the process is skewed by popularity. Coaches have made comments to the same effect.

3) I am aware that there are many people at Cowboys Zone who argue about whether Pro Bowls are deserved or not, including a whole thread regarding Bob Hayes in this light. If Pro Bowls were purely objective standards of performance, these arguments could not happen.

Therefore in pointing out that Pro Bowl berths are not purely objective yardsticks for measuring performance, I am not saying anything controversial, regardless of your chart.

 

[Dodger]

I was referencing the idea that he is not among the best starters in the league but he is not among the worst, either. He is middle of the road.

Meaning, as I mentioned, ranked somewhere around 16th in the league? Or do you have a different view as in a small percentage of QBs being the best and worst with all others lumped into the category of middle of the road?

 

[Nav22]

I was referencing the idea that he is not among the best starters in the league but he is not among the worst, either. He is middle of the road.

I don't know what you consider to be "middle-of-the-road", but if you don't think Romo is at least a top 10 QB you're blind as a bat.

 

[TNCowboy]

That is not what I meant. I agree that your definition does not fit Romo. By "middle of the road" I was talking purely about starters. I was referencing the idea that he is not among the best starters in the league but he is not among the worst, either. He is middle of the road.

To me, before he can be considered one of the best starters in the NFL, he has to cut down on his turnovers and win when it counts.

Talking purely starters still holds no water.

I don't buy the Romo all-time QB posts that frequently compare him to Tom Brady or Joe Montana. I'm not a Tony Romo kool-aid drinker, nor am I someone who criticizes his every move.

But what have 15 or 16 NFL QBs (those who you would have ranked above him) done that Romo hasn't? Few have won more games than he has since he took over. Few have better #s. And only a handful have had real postseason success.

To use McNabb as an example, he's won a lot of games, a lot of post-season games, and put up some great #s. But at the same time, he's also turned in some pedestrian to downright poor postseason games that have cost his team a shot at winning it all. And the one time he made it to the grand stage, he puked his guts out with the game in the balance, and only an amazing performance by TO kept them in it.

Neither has Carson Palmer won when it counts. Neither has Drew Brees Neither have most of the league's QBs. So there really isn't any measure anyone can use that puts Romo in the middle of the pack (beyond Commander wishful thinking, magnified by their frustration that middle-of-the-pack would be a vast improvement for Jason Campbell).

A case could be made that Romo is the 7th or 8th or 9th best QB in the NFL, just as a case could be made that he's 3rd or 4th best QB.

But that he's 15th? Or 17th? That case simply can't be made.

 

[DallasEast]

1) I am quite aware of how Pro Bowl berths originate.

2) I am also aware of the complaints of many players, including those who make the Pro Bowl, that the process is skewed by popularity. Coaches have made comments to the same effect.

3) I am aware that there are many people at Cowboys Zone who argue about whether Pro Bowls are deserved or not, including a whole thread regarding Bob Hayes in this light. If Pro Bowls were purely objective standards of performance, these arguments could not happen.

Therefore in pointing out that Pro Bowl berths are not purely objective yardsticks for measuring performance, I am not saying anything controversial, regardless of your chart.

1) Regardless, you unnecessarily berate Pro Bowl berths.

2) In my opinion, most posts on this forum pertaining to Pro Bowl voting factors in the popularity angle, but doesn't do so to the point where validity is totally dismissed.

3) Arguments on CowboysZone do not exclusively promote Pro Bowls as 'purely objective standards of performance', but as valid subcomponents of a player's career.

As far as your controversial comments regarding Pro Bowl berths, see #1.

 

[zrinkill]

That is it ...... Gotta go back old school.

 

[Hostile]

Or more "serious questions" about Tony Romo.

Which never seem to allay my serious doubts.

 

[DFWJC]

A case could be made that Romo is the 7th or 8th or 9th best QB in the NFL, just as a case could be made that he's 3rd or 4th best QB.

But that he's 15th? Or 17th? That case simply can't be made.

I've seen two non fantasy QB rating just this week and our Tony was 10th in one and not in the top 10 in the other. I disagree, but just saying there are many non-cowboy fans who would put him closer to the middle than the top.

I say he certainly is in the top 10.

 

[PullMyFinger]

Florio lives in WV somewhere close to WVU. I believe he is a lawyer or something.

That explains everything then, look at my sig.

 

[cowboys#1]

tony romo hasnt done anything...he is my QB but he should be considered avg. i hope he cleans up his attitude about not caring if he loses and starts to act like a leader like our last true QB troy

 

[BrassCowboy]

What!?...so you're saying Vick should be compared to RB's instead?

Vick is a QB that can run, same as Randall Cunningham and Steve Young were before him. A QB that can run is not a negative in my book and it does not turn him into a RB either. Vick got over a 1,000 yards rushing in 2006 and your gonna hold that against him?

Wow....just wow!

yeah wow, thats what I said too when I saw your original post. In the context of the original thread post and my reply to yours, I really do not understand why it is so hard for you to not understand.

But to make it clearer for ya, Vick is not a "QB" worthy of being compared to 80% of the NFL QBs and your post with all these rushing stats comfirmed that. Am I to think his rushing stats make him a better QB worthy of playing on the same field that Romo plays on? That is laughable plain and simple.

Oh and your reply to my reply about Cunningham and Young AGAIN comfirms my point because the difference between Young/Cunningham and Vick is they can actually play the QB position effectively in the passing game.

But if it makes you feel better, I do like a QB that can run as well, it is just that Vick is not in the same league as most QBs run or non run alike.

Yes, Marino won games in the postseason (Romo hasn't) and so did Fran Tarkenton, Jim Kelly and Warren Moon...all HOF'ers without SB rings.

What's your point?

Again you need to read the post of yours I was replying to and again I will clarify it, you bring up this "oh Vick is 2-2 in the playoffs" hmmmm I can tell you a broken clock is right twice a day also, but what is YOUR point?

Hell, I know a QB with a SB ring that is barely worthy of carrying Romo's socks..... See the phrase above my sig? it is not one man but a team....

 

[Idgit]

tony romo hasnt done anything...he is my QB but he should be considered avg. i hope he cleans up his attitude about not caring if he loses and starts to act like a leader like our last true QB troy

That's your QB, man? That's your QB? Only he hasn't done anything except come in as a street free agent and win 2-3 out of every 4 games he plays. He should be considered average despite being one of the very best players at his position in the league because your feelings are hurt that the team underperformed last year. He needs to change the attitude that got him where he is b/c you don't like his post-game interview demeanor after one particular loss. He's not a leader or a true QB like Troy b/c he hasn't won a championship yet with fewer opportunities than Troy had. Opinion noted.

 

[Gemini Dolly]

The argument is Troy had to start from scratch, Peyton had to start from scratch. Tony was put in a *playoff caliber* team and should have had playoff wins by now. And because he doesnt, that means he sucks.

 

[BrassCowboy]

I've seen two non fantasy QB rating just this week and our Tony was 10th in one and not in the top 10 in the other. I disagree, but just saying there are many non-cowboy fans who would put him closer to the middle than the top.

I say he certainly is in the top 10.

Let me share with you something I read the other day and I will try and paraphrase it the best I can due to me not being able to articulate it to you 100% but you will understand it nonetheless. You will have to read the entire thing to understand, so please do so.

I was reading how an investor analyst recommended that all investors in Palm pull out and sell their Palm stocks. He went on to give reason as to a poll that was given amongst Palm Pre customers and that 40% of these customers had returned their Palm Pre's due to hardware malfunction.

40% is alot you and I both would say and would certainly tell me that an investment in Palm stocks would be bad, but what this investor failed to see and disclose is where this poll was done.

This poll was done on a forum for Palm customers, where they would normally frequent, and come to for answers on their Palm product. How an investor could expect a fair and accurate result from such faulty test data is beyond me.

My point here is you are basing his worth on his fantasy value. Would an offensive linemen make you alot of points in fantasy football? ok, does that make an olineman unimportant or not good?

I play fantasy football every year and every league's value of QBs is different. I am not knocking your point or your knowledge. To make my point, in fantasy football - would you take a QB that can drive the ball in the air all the way up and down all day long racking up 400+ yards in the air but the td is always achieved by a 1 yard run OR a team that moves up and down the field with the run, then the qb throwing a 1 yard TD for every goal? I know most leagues I have ever been in would take the TD QB every time.

I know it is hypothetical question, but just goes to show you the differences with fantasy league vs real time NFL QB's worth because in the NFL, I believe it would be the opposite.

 

[BrassCowboy]

The argument is Troy had to start from scratch, Peyton had to start from scratch. Tony was put in a *playoff caliber* team and should have had playoff wins by now. And because he doesnt, that means he sucks.

well there goes all other arguments then :bang2:

 

[Idgit]

The argument is Troy had to start from scratch, Peyton had to start from scratch. Tony was put in a *playoff caliber* team and should have had playoff wins by now. And because he doesnt, that means he sucks.

The argument is dumb. Troy didn't win anything until he had a team around him either. That includes regular season games. And with a team around him he wasn't as productive at his position as Tony has been.

And this team wasn't playoff caliber without Tony in the lineup last year. I know in bizarro-world that means Brad Johnson sucks but that Tony Romo's not necessarily good, but I don't want to live in bizarro-world. The unicorn races I can handle, but the romantic walks on the beach with stilltheguru would get old real quick.

 

[RedRaiderCowboysFan]

Definitely #3. (Among others.)

While I am not a romo fan, I am not a Vick fan either, besides being a terrible person, Vick was never a very good passer, he could just run fast. So I wouldn't want either one, but Vick does have something romo doesn't, playoff wins.

You might not like Florio, but just because you don't agree with him doesn't make him wrong and the people in right places have a very high opinion of Florio and PFT. Dick Ebersoll's opinion counts way more then yours dallaseast, hence that is why PFT is now part of NBC.

 

[ScipioCowboy]

While I am not a romo fan, I am not a Vick fan either, besides being a terrible person, Vick was never a very good passer, he could just run fast. So I wouldn't want either one, but Vick does have something romo doesn't, playoff wins.

You might not like Florio, but just because you don't agree with him doesn't make him wrong and the people in right places have a very high opinion of Florio and PFT. Dick Ebersoll's opinion counts way more then yours dallaseast, hence that is why PFT is now part of NBC.

Dick Ebersoll's primary concerns are ratings and viewership -- a fact demonstrated by these rankings.

 

[Fletch]

Has Carson Palmer even led his team to the playoffs? I think maybe once? If he did, I know they lost.

 

[Silverstar]

yeah wow, thats what I said too when I saw your original post. In the context of the original thread post and my reply to yours, I really do not understand why it is so hard for you to not understand.

I think for most, just trying to "understand" this first paragraph is certainly understandable. :laugh2:

But to make it clearer for ya,

Oh, please do...

Vick is not a "QB" worthy of being compared to 80% of the NFL QBs and your post with all these rushing stats comfirmed that.

It does...who knew?

Seriously, you must be joking or just plain ignorant regarding those stats. Those rushing stats only confirm, that Vick accomplished something no other QB in the history of the NFL has....1,000 rushing yards in a season. The fact, you need to flush those accomplishments down the toilet, to make him "not worthy" is really pathetic and sad.

Am I to think his rushing stats make him a better QB worthy of playing on the same field that Romo plays on? That is laughable plain and simple.

Your opinions are the ones becoming laughable now. You need to realize the "fact", that Romo is not a playoff winning QB yet and Vick (regardless of his rushing accomplishments) already is one.....period.

There's just no way around it. If Romo wants that gorilla off his back, he's going to have to remove it "himself", by playing in January and guiding his team to victory in the postseason. As it stands right now, it's Vick's 2 postseason victories and QB rushing records > Romo's 0 postseason victories and high QB ratings.

Deal with it.... and just hope it changes.

Oh and your reply to my reply about Cunningham and Young AGAIN comfirms my point because the difference between Young/Cunningham and Vick is they can actually play the QB position effectively in the passing game.

You can't win in the playoffs twice and once on the road (Lambeau in January), if your QB is not an effective one....period.

But if it makes you feel better, I do like a QB that can run as well, it is just that Vick is not in the same league as most QBs run or non run alike.

Sounds like your trying to make "yourself" feel better. Vick belongs in the same league as any other NFL QB "run or no run alike" as you put it. His postseason victories put him there and you can't take those away from him....ever! No matter how you much want to condemn his running, it's that same ability, that helped get the Falcons to the playoffs.

BTW, some Cowboy fans think Romo IS a running QB and should run even more than he does.....OMG!!!

But don't worry...I think it's just a rumor.

Again you need to read the post of yours I was replying to and again I will clarify it, you bring up this "oh Vick is 2-2 in the playoffs" hmmmm I can tell you a broken clock is right twice a day also, but what is YOUR point?

see above...

Hell, I know a QB with a SB ring that is barely worthy of carrying Romo's socks..... See the phrase above my sig? it is not one man but a team....

True, but if you're going to place Romo among the best QB's in the game, you'll need a lot more from him in the postseason and that simply hasn't happened yet.