The Impossible (but Only) Solution

[Tabascocat]

I'm still in the opinion of (C).

I hope your right mrtxstar, I really do

 

[Doomsday101]

My idea is that we should listen to the feelings of fellow Americans and consider their views, life experiences, and feelings. I believe in the end we are better for this. I believe closing our mind to the pain of others does nothing to make us stronger as a country. We are uncomfortable with others perspectives and many of us would rather shut our eyes and ears instead of showing human empathy and decency. We should stop trying to interpret someone elses intent and for once talk about it..

This boycott and shutting ourselves away from things we are not comfortable with is troubling to me. Our current president (regardless of your political party) is not setting the right example for our children. He should be teaching to communicate with each other in times of differences and conflict. Instead he is handling the NFL situation like he is handling North Korea. Instead of trying to talk like a tough guy how about sitting down and talking about issues and differences. Both situations have the ability to blow up in his face.

There is a time and place for everything, a lot of people are not spending their hard earned cash on tickets to see over grown kids making political statements. For a lot of people they want 3 plus hours of entertainment. This is what these guys are paid for not their political stance. I have nothing against anyone exercising their freedom of speech but just like most of us when we are at our jobs we are there to work not protest. What we do on our dime is up to us.


All these players have a day off and if this is all that important then go our and express your views in protest rallies instead of using the day off to hang out at bars or strip clubs watching the girlies dance and making it rain. Really hard to take some of these guys serious when they can't control their own behavior

 

[Diehardblues]

We can't continue to ignore the social injustices of our time. We really shouldn't be surprised that sports dominated by black athletes would rise up for this issue.

It will play out unless those with the power push the pendulum bringing more attention to it.

Who do you think will win. The NFL or our national dumpster fire. Our Bulkyinchief . Lol

My money is on the NFL especially when owners like Jerry and the Krafts who were supporters of him step out in support of the movement .

I've never been prouder of Jerry and the NFL.

 

[jday]

I can agree with that. Being a white guy, I seriously doubt a photo would have even been taken, it doesn't fit the narrative. Like I said earlier, it is rumored that he went there to do just that which may turn out to be false.

I take that kind of stuff seriously, I lost a family member in the Gulf War and it still affects me to this day

It is protocol to always stand while viewing the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier, the guards/military are always on top of that and will let you know. I don't expect anyone to know that going in but once there that is something that will be learned quickly.

Again, I do apologize if it turns out to be false, I just don't think it will IMO. Lets squash this now, we both made our points I think

Well said. Thank you for making your motives and intent clear...and the respectful manner you handled this conversation.

 

[superonyx]

There is a time and place for everything, a lot of people are not spending their hard earned cash on tickets to see over grown kids making political statements. For a lot of people they want 3 plus hours of entertainment. This is what these guys are paid for not their political stance. I have nothing against anyone exercising their freedom of speech but just like most of us when we are at our jobs we are there to work not protest. What we do on our dime is up to us.


All these players have a day off and if this is all that important then go our and express your views in protest rallies instead of using the day off to hang out at bars or strip clubs watching the girlies dance and making it rain. Really hard to take some of these guys serious when they can't control their own behavior

I understand your point and I can see how people don’t like political type of issues pushed in their face when they just want to watch a football game.

But looking at it from the other side I see a young black who may have grown up in a community that was devastated by mass incarceration, high unemployment levels, low wages, constant police presence etc etc..and they are now in a position to have millions of people for a few seconds know that they feel pain for the communities they were lucky enough to come out of. They understand that some people don’t want to hear it and they see how the guy who started the whole thing has sacrificed his career to bring attention to this cause.

I’m pretty sure if they felt they could be heard on their day off then they would prefer to not risk their livelihood. But let’s be honest people would not give them or the pain they feel the attention if they are standing in a park holding a sign on Monday afternoon.

It’s just a shame that so many people seem to not care about what’s in the hearts of the guys they spend so much time watching. People just want to cheer for laundry and not be bothered by the human element of the teams. I didn’t grow up in these communities. I don’t know what it’s like to live as a black man in America. But as a human and American I hurt when fellow humans hurt. If someone wants me to listen to why they hurt this badly then I want to listen.I guess I lack the switch that allows me to be so cold.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

If I'm the league, I have the teams stay in the lorckerrooms for the anthem the rest of the season, and I have a moment of silence before each game prior to the anthem where everyone can focus on whatever generic message of unity each stadium wants to offer up for the next 3-4 weeks until the controversy boils over and we can get back to football. Teams can and should support players with the social issues involved elsewhere, outside of game day.

And then let's get on with it.

Worth pointing out that this did not work out to well for Pittsburgh

 

[jrumann59]

I've seen this photo but I have no idea why he's kneeling. It's only one person. For all I know, he is kneeling to steady his hands while he snaps a photo.

maybe he was going to tie his shoes...

 

[Doomsday101]

I understand your point and I can see how people don’t like political type of issues pushed in their face when they just want to watch a football game.

But looking at it from the other side I see a young black who may have grown up in a community that was devastated by mass incarceration, high unemployment levels, low wages, constant police presence etc etc..and they are now in a position to have millions of people for a few seconds know that they feel pain for the communities they were lucky enough to come out of. They understand that some people don’t want to hear it and they see how the guy who started the whole thing has sacrificed his career to bring attention to this cause.

I’m pretty sure if they felt they could be heard on their day off then they would prefer to not risk their livelihood. But let’s be honest people would not give them or the pain they feel the attention if they are standing in a park holding a sign on Monday afternoon.

It’s just a shame that so many people seem to not care about what’s in the hearts of the guys they spend so much time watching. People just want to cheer for laundry and not be bothered by the human element of the teams. I didn’t grow up in these communities. I don’t know what it’s like to live as a black man in America. But as a human and American I hurt when fellow humans hurt. If someone wants me to listen to why they hurt this badly then I want to listen.I guess I lack the switch that allows me to be so cold.

You talk about mass incarceration how about black victims who live in those neighborhood, do they not deserve justice to have thugs locked up? I do think many of these minority communities are inundated with crime so are we to not lock up the criminal at the expense of the victim. To me that is a bit of a catch 22 do we not lock up criminals at the victims expense? don't black victims deserve the same as everyone else? Fact is the leading cause of death of black teens are other black teens. As for high Unemployment I agree what has the left done to make that any better? Nothing, we think if we throw money at the situation it will get better, the roots of the problem are much deeper and some of the issues start with the person themselves.

Thus far many of the issues that are brought up like Michael Brown is a lie and proven even by Obama DOJ, the officer did not do wrong yet the community looted and burned business of innocent people costing them their livelihood?

Believe me I know there are problems out there and no easy solution but people of all color need to be responsible for their own action. When people of color have pointed to the same things I just did they chastised yet speak from the heart. People want scapegoats in life. To have a chance in this world it starts with families and education and personal responsibility. I know I will get slammed for this but so be it.

 

[jday]

You talk about mass incarceration how about black victims who live in those neighborhood, do they not deserve justice to have thugs locked up? I do think many of these minority communities are inundated with crime so are we to not lock up the criminal at the expense of the victim. To me that is a bit of a catch 22 do we not lock up criminals at the victims expense? don't black victims deserve the same as everyone else? Fact is the leading cause of death of black teens are other black teens. As for high Unemployment I agree what has the left done to make that any better? Nothing, we think if we throw money at the situation it will get better, the roots of the problem are much deeper and some of the issues start with the person themselves.

Thus far many of the issues that are brought up like Michael Brown is a lie and proven even by Obama DOJ, the officer did not do wrong yet the community looted and burned business of innocent people costing them their livelihood?

Believe me I know there are problems out there and no easy solution but people of all color need to be responsible for their own action. When people of color have pointed to the same things I just did they chastised yet speak from the heart. People want scapegoats in life. To have a chance in this world it starts with families and education and personal responsibility. I know I will get slammed for this but so be it.

No slam here; see op.

 

[Fritsch_the_cat]

To be fair, this may very well be an honest mistake and no harm intended.

It very well could be which is why I wouldn't judge the guy unless I knew for certain his intent.

I had something like this happen to me once at a game. The anthem started playing and I stood as usual. Thing was, I had on a cap and totally forgot I was wearing one. I mean, I once got home from work, stripped down, stepped in the shower, stuck my head under the water and that's when I realized I still had my cap on, so it happens.

Anyway, shortly after the anthem stated, some old man snatched the hat off my head, started swearing at me and people around us joined in. They were all sure they had found a commie I suppose. It was just a simple mistake. I certainly would have removed my hat had I remembered to.

 

[Tabascocat]

It very well could be which is why I wouldn't judge the guy unless I knew for certain his intent.

I had something like this happen to me once at a game. The anthem started playing and I stood as usual. Thing was, I had on a cap and totally forgot I was wearing one. I mean, I once got home from work, stripped down, stepped in the shower, stuck my head under the water and that's when I realized I still had my cap on, so it happens.

Anyway, shortly after the anthem stated, some old man snatched the hat off my head, started swearing at me and people around us joined in. They were all sure they had found a commie I suppose. It was just a simple mistake. I certainly would have removed my hat had I remembered to.

Basically the same thing happened to me!

I have a cousin who served on the USS Ronald Reagan and gave me and the wife a private tour in San Diego. It was awesome and we got to see the inner workings of the ship including the bridge.

Anyways, as were were navigating the ship, we encountered the galley. Well, I had on my Cowboys cap and never thought anything about it. I learned in a hurry to always take it off when in there. At first, I was like "why is everyone staring at me?". I had no idea about that tradition and I still feel like a donkey today

I am thankful the crewmen were polite about it yet got their point across swiftly

 

[jday]

It very well could be which is why I wouldn't judge the guy unless I knew for certain his intent.

I had something like this happen to me once at a game. The anthem started playing and I stood as usual. Thing was, I had on a cap and totally forgot I was wearing one. I mean, I once got home from work, stripped down, stepped in the shower, stuck my head under the water and that's when I realized I still had my cap on, so it happens.

Anyway, shortly after the anthem stated, some old man snatched the hat off my head, started swearing at me and people around us joined in. They were all sure they had found a commie I suppose. It was just a simple mistake. I certainly would have removed my hat had I remembered to.

Basically the same thing happened to me!

I have a cousin who served on the USS Ronald Reagan and gave me and the wife a private tour in San Diego. It was awesome and we got to see the inner workings of the ship including the bridge.

Anyways, as were were navigating the ship, we encountered the galley. Well, I had on my Cowboys cap and never thought anything about it. I learned in a hurry to always take it off when in there. At first, I was like "why is everyone staring at me?". I had no idea about that tradition and I still feel like a donkey today

I am thankful the crewmen were polite about it yet got their point across swiftly

This is exactly the dialogue I had hoped for guys; and the type of dialogue this nation needs right now. Keep it going, here and everywhere!

 

[superonyx]

You talk about mass incarceration how about black victims who live in those neighborhood, do they not deserve justice to have thugs locked up? I do think many of these minority communities are inundated with crime so are we to not lock up the criminal at the expense of the victim. To me that is a bit of a catch 22 do we not lock up criminals at the victims expense? don't black victims deserve the same as everyone else? Fact is the leading cause of death of black teens are other black teens. As for high Unemployment I agree what has the left done to make that any better? Nothing, we think if we throw money at the situation it will get better, the roots of the problem are much deeper and some of the issues start with the person themselves.

Thus far many of the issues that are brought up like Michael Brown is a lie and proven even by Obama DOJ, the officer did not do wrong yet the community looted and burned business of innocent people costing them their livelihood?

Believe me I know there are problems out there and no easy solution but people of all color need to be responsible for their own action. When people of color have pointed to the same things I just did they chastised yet speak from the heart. People want scapegoats in life. To have a chance in this world it starts with families and education and personal responsibility. I know I will get slammed for this but so be it.

Try to think about the real impact of mass incarceration. We have people locked up for excessively long prison sentences for non violent drug offenses. This takes a potential income earner out of the home and community which contributes to poverty which contributes to crime and the cycle continues. Of course people who commit crimes should have consequences for the crimes. The problem with mass incarceration and mandatory minimums is that having a person locked up for 10 years does not rehab them any better than 1 year would. However locking a person away for 10 years has a devastating impact on their family and their ability to even become a contributing member of society.

The Michael Brown has exploded the way it did due to an overall level of frustration and desperation within the community.
People burning businesses and looting is wrong obviously. Could it also be a person who feels like they have nothing to lose in life? A person who feels so powerless by a system that has wrecked their communities that this is their pain rising above the surface?

People don't want scapegoats in life....Why would they? Needing a scapegoat means your life hasn't gone very well. People don't want this for themselves. You know people of color and people all over the world all want the same thing from life when you really get down to it. They want to feel love, they want to feel like they belong, they want to feel security.
The personal responsibility narrative only holds up if you remove all environmental circumstances beyond our control.

 

[Idgit]

Worth pointing out that this did not work out to well for Pittsburgh

Good point. But that was a team-level thing (or, really, a player-level thing), and something they voted on right before the game. Do it league-level, announce it to everybody in advance, and the issues they had in PIT go away.

 

[Fritsch_the_cat]

I am thankful the crewmen were polite about it yet got their point across swiftly

LOL, that old man was rude as hell and slammed my cap into my chest. But to his credit, I never forget my hat anymore.

 

[CATCH17]

IMO, I don't think the NFL can get back the fans they're losing. They're gone.

They need a Cowboys Superbowl desperately.

 

[jday]

They need a Cowboys Superbowl desperately.

A self-serving solution, but it may help!

 

[Doomsday101]

Try to think about the real impact of mass incarceration. We have people locked up for excessively long prison sentences for non violent drug offenses. This takes a potential income earner out of the home and community which contributes to poverty which contributes to crime and the cycle continues. Of course people who commit crimes should have consequences for the crimes. The problem with mass incarceration and mandatory minimums is that having a person locked up for 10 years does not rehab them any better than 1 year would. However locking a person away for 10 years has a devastating impact on their family and their ability to even become a contributing member of society.

The Michael Brown has exploded the way it did due to an overall level of frustration and desperation within the community.
People burning businesses and looting is wrong obviously. Could it also be a person who feels like they have nothing to lose in life? A person who feels so powerless by a system that has wrecked their communities that this is their pain rising above the surface?

People don't want scapegoats in life....Why would they? Needing a scapegoat means your life hasn't gone very well. People don't want this for themselves. You know people of color and people all over the world all want the same thing from life when you really get down to it. They want to feel love, they want to feel like they belong, they want to feel security.
The personal responsibility narrative only holds up if you remove all environmental circumstances beyond our control.

We have neighborhood filled with drug dealers, we have problems with heroin overdoes do not tell me there are victimless crimes . Let’s not lock them up, let them keep dealing on the streets and selling to kids out there. I'm sorry that is not acceptable. These are not saints by any means they are looking for the quick money and do not give a damn who ends up dead because of it. I have seen many young black men trying to improve themselves and yet are told they are trying to act white? Why because they are trying to better themselves to get the out of those conditions? I have seen so many so called black leaders who are doing more harm than good. Liberal politicians do need a scapegoat since it is easier to blame all problems on others than to deal with real problems that can be solved by attacking the root of the problems.

 

[superonyx]

We have neighborhood filled with drug dealers, we have problems with heroin overdoes do not tell me there are victimless crimes . Let’s not lock them up, let them keep dealing on the streets and selling to kids out there. I'm sorry that is not acceptable. These are not saints by any means they are looking for the quick money and do not give a damn who ends up dead because of it. I have seen many young black men trying to improve themselves and yet are told they are trying to act white? Why because they are trying to better themselves to get the out of those conditions? I have seen so many so called black leaders who are doing more harm than good. Liberal politicians do need a scapegoat since it is easier to blame all problems on others than to deal with real problems that can be solved by attacking the root of the problems.

What is the root of the problem?

 

[superonyx]

We have neighborhood filled with drug dealers, we have problems with heroin overdoes do not tell me there are victimless crimes . Let’s not lock them up, let them keep dealing on the streets and selling to kids out there. I'm sorry that is not acceptable. These are not saints by any means they are looking for the quick money and do not give a damn who ends up dead because of it. I have seen many young black men trying to improve themselves and yet are told they are trying to act white? Why because they are trying to better themselves to get the out of those conditions? I have seen so many so called black leaders who are doing more harm than good. Liberal politicians do need a scapegoat since it is easier to blame all problems on others than to deal with real problems that can be solved by attacking the root of the problems.

Whats interesting is we have had this "War on Drugs" and this "Tough on Crime" policy since 1981. We had 300k people locked up in federal prison in 1980. We now have 3.5 million people locked up. Do you feel any safer? Show me where it has helped?

Lets lock up millions more and that will show em..then they will stop dealing drugs. Guess what? The only way you can and will ever stop the flow of drugs is to attack the root of the problem......the demand for the drugs. The only way you will stop the demand is if you look at the conditions that create drug users.

Yelling personal responsibility and BOOTSTRAPS! does nothing to solve any problems.
The death penalty doesn't lead to less murders and locking people up for drugs doesn't lead to less drugs. In fact it leads to more.