The Jared Gaither Thread **Merged**

[unionjack8]

It's actually going to be very difficult to compare. If you rely on objectivity for statistics and simply go ONLY by penalty yards or sacks allowed, how do you want to capture QB pressures allowed, QB hits allowed, blocks missed, blown assignments, etc.

You'll also have to take into account how many times the QB is blitzed...I doubt teams are blitzing Joe "Bus Driver" Flacco as often as they're blitzing a playmaker in Romo. Flacco won't pick you apart if you let him - Romo will, hence being one of the most blitzed QBs in the league.

I think we should just all agree that we're better off sticking with what we've got and building through the draft than attempting to play a Dan Snyder and win the free agency super bowl this off-season.

why should we all agree that, beacuse you say so? There's a difference between signing a 24 year old 2 years starter at LT than signing a holes like A Randle El andD Hall.

1. Its a position of need(hence everybody wanting an OT in rnd 1)
2. He's better than ANY OT in this draft because right now for all we know ANY or ALL those top OT's could flop

I posted the penalties beacuse Fuzzy said that Gaither gets way too many flags.

 

[casmith07]

why should we all agree that, beacuse you say so? There's a difference between signing a 24 year old 2 years starter at LT than signing a holes like A Randle El andD Hall.

1. Its a position of need(hence everybody wanting an OT in rnd 1)
2. He's better than ANY OT in this draft because right now for all we know ANY or ALL those top OT's could flop

I posted the penalties beacuse Fuzzy said that Gaither gets way too many flags.

Where did I ever compare a potential Gaither signing to the signing of Randle El or DeAngelo Hall?

And if you're going by that logic, we should just sign anyone that's currently in the league since they're better than ANY player available in the draft, since they all made it to the NFL already and ANY or ALL of those players in the draft could flop.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

If I wanted to know how they got their stats or formula they used then I would contact them and ask. If you want to know than contact them, what difference does it make if I want to quote them?

Because if you are going to quote something for truth then you need to be able to qualify the information. The burden of proof is on you to prove that the information is worthwhile. You are unable to do that.

I know that pff stats do not meet up with STATS who all the networks and the NFL uses. They also do not meet up with NFL.coms box scores apparently. As such, it leads me to believe that they are interpreting things differently at best and making things up at worst.

I have studied statistics, set theory etc so I can understand where numbers come from but I have a feeling that they do not correlate that statistic to anything at best its individual stats arbitrarily weighted and added together. If that is the case then they are worthless.

 

[NeonNinja]

Because if you are going to quote something for truth then you need to be able to qualify the information. The burden of proof is on you to prove that the information is worthwhile. You are unable to do that.

I know that pff stats do not meet up with STATS who all the networks and the NFL uses. They also do not meet up with NFL.coms box scores apparently. As such, it leads me to believe that they are interpreting things differently at best and making things up at worst.

I have studied statistics, set theory etc so I can understand where numbers come from but I have a feeling that they do not correlate that statistic to anything at best its individual stats arbitrarily weighted and added together. If that is the case then they are worthless.

Fair enough Fuzzy.

 

[CATCH17]

I can't believe people have actually talked themselves into saying Gaither just isn't that good of a player.

I wish we could get more average guys like that.


Ukinto is preachin in this thread.

 

[unionjack8]

I think we should just all agree that we're better off sticking with what we've got and building through the draft than attempting to play a Dan Snyder and win the free agency super bowl this off-season."

Casmith - your quote about winning the FA offseason i presume was about us signing gaither,a s this is a Gaither thread. He's so different from what Snyder did all those years its not even funny.

 

[casmith07]

Ukinto is reachin in this thread.

You're absolutely right he is.

 

[casmith07]

I think we should just all agree that we're better off sticking with what we've got and building through the draft than attempting to play a Dan Snyder and win the free agency super bowl this off-season."

Casmith - your quote about winning the FA offseason i presume was about us signing gaither,a s this is a Gaither thread. He's so different from what Snyder did all those years its not even funny.

You're picking and choosing now - I said that signing any free agent available, Jared Gaither in this case, that's been hyped really nowhere except on this forum and maybe a few blogs would be akin to a Dan Snyder-type move (i.e., the signing of Haynesworth last year based solely on hype.)

You're attempting to pigeonhole what I said to make it work strictly for some arbitrary point you're trying to prove, and I can see through it like glass.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I posted the penalties beacuse Fuzzy said that Gaither gets way too many flags.

He does, IMO.

Ozzie Newsome is regarded as one of the best personnel people in the business. They not only drafted Oher but they traded up to get him. They did indeed have a huge need at OT last season. In theory, trading Gaither away presents them with another huge need. Yet the esteemed personnel man Newsome essentially puts him on the trading block with that tender anyway with that tender.

Couple that with his injury history of constant nagging injuries that make him miss games and a long history of questionable work ethic and character and you should take pause. Those are huge waving neon flags.

Drew Rosenhaus is his agent. All Newsome did was give Rosenhaus more leverage because it gets more people interested to bid. Thats not a good idea with that agent especially.

All that over a few hundred thousand dollars difference in the tender amount?

I mean come on is Newsome really that stupid or maybe just maybe Gaither isn't as good and dependable as you think he is.

 

[unionjack8]

You're picking and choosing now - I said that signing any free agent available, Jared Gaither in this case, that's been hyped really nowhere except on this forum and maybe a few blogs would be akin to a Dan Snyder-type move (i.e., the signing of Haynesworth last year based solely on hype.)

You're attempting to pigeonhole what I said to make it work strictly for some arbitrary point you're trying to prove, and I can see through it like glass.

lmao - a whole lot of wind from you again.

 

[CATCH17]

I think we should just all agree that we're better off sticking with what we've got and building through the draft than attempting to play a Dan Snyder and win the free agency super bowl this off-season."

Casmith - your quote about winning the FA offseason i presume was about us signing gaither,a s this is a Gaither thread. He's so different from what Snyder did all those years its not even funny.

If you compare trading for Jared Gaither to a Dan Snyder type move than your opinion isn't much to begin with.



Heres a good post from Manster54

I watch the Ravens every week up here in BMore. He did a surprisingly good job coming in to replace a legend-Ogden. Gaither is a good player-right now better than Flozell and has the potential to get even bigger and better with experience. He has been in and out with injuries (I think to his leg(s) and/or ankle). I was initially shocked they did only the first round tender given his age.

This is CLEARLY a choice between him and Oher at left tackle. The Ravens view this as a win/win as he was a supplemental draft pick and they will get at least a 2nd rounder for him and won't have to pay for two left tackles.

Barring injury, which no one can predict, I think a first rounder would be a good trade for both teams. Even better for Dallas if they can get Gaither for a second. Adding Marty B would be too much. Marty B would be perfect for the Ravens running game and they need a second TE really bad. Marty B & 3rd sounds more like it.

Good stuff.

 

[unionjack8]

He does, IMO.

Ozzie Newsome is regarded as one of the best personnel people in the business. They not only drafted Oher but they traded up to get him. They did indeed have a huge need at OT last season. In theory, trading Gaither away presents them with another huge need. Yet the esteemed personnel man Newsome essentially puts him on the trading block with that tender anyway with that tender.

Couple that with his injury history of constant nagging injuries that make him miss games and a long history of questionable work ethic and character and you should take pause. Those are huge waving neon flags.

Drew Rosenhaus is his agent. All Newsome did was give Rosenhaus more leverage because it gets more people interested to bid. Thats not a good idea with that agent especially.

All that over a few hundred thousand dollars difference in the tender amount?

I mean come on is Newsome really that stupid or maybe just maybe Gaither isn't as good and dependable as you think he is.

Fuzzy, you're going round in circles and grabbing at straws. Only a few posts agao you were saying how Doug Free performed better at the combine. Then you said that gaither had lots of sacks and penalties, which he didn't. NOW you're trying to say Ozzie Newsome doesnt rate him. Look you dont like the player, great, but stop making stuff up.

 

[unionjack8]

If you compare trading for Jared Gaither to a Dan Snyder type move than your opinion isn't much to begin with.



Heres a good post from Manster54



Good stuff.

Catch - that wasnt my Dan Snyder quote mate, it was CAsmiths

 

[CATCH17]

Catch - that wasnt my Dan Snyder quote mate, it was CAsmiths

Oh I know. Im ejoying reading your posts in this thread and having a good time see'ing CA and Fuzzy have no idea what they are talking about in terms of what type of long term quality he brings to that position.

 

[unionjack8]

Oh I know. Im ejoying reading your posts in this thread and having a good time see'ing CA and Fuzzy have no idea what they are talking about in terms of what type of long term quality he brings to that position.

lol, in fact i'm done on this thread now. I have my opinion and they have theirs. I can see he has talent. They cant.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Good stuff.

Not really. They have Oher locked up for 4 more years. They just drafted him last year and in the second half of the first so his contract is a good one. They drafted him because they had a HUGE need at OT. Trading Gaither only puts them back to where they were last year.

If Gaither is so good then that would be taking a step back to put them in the same spot they were in in 2009 or even worse talent wise.

 

[CanuckCowboysFan]

If it costs us a 1st I say don't do it. Before I was all for him, especially because he was a greater OT then anyone we could have at 27. But now its looking more like ET will fall, especially with the Sheagles on the verge of signing Marlin Jackson, and the Texans stated that they might trade up for CJ Spiller. So if he does fall to us and we don't have that pick, I'll literally go crazy. Iupati is also a option at 27, and if he was there without our pick I'd go ballistic as well, but I'm 80% sure the Steelers are going to draft him, especially with the re signing of Clarke. ET WITH THE 27TH PICK!!

 

[CATCH17]

Not really. They have Oher locked up for 4 more years. They just drafted him last year and in the second half of the first so his contract is a good one. They drafted him because they had a HUGE need at OT. Trading Gaither only puts them back to where they were last year.

If Gaither is so good then that would be taking a step back to put them in the same spot they were in in 2009 or even worse talent wise.

Can Jared Gaither play at a high level in the NFL...? If you say no and think we are going to find a Left Tackle in this draft or Doug Free is a better prospect than Gaither then thats fine.. By all means believe that.

As far as talent and what he has already shown he can do on the NFL field combined with his age and us being able to dump Flos contract makes it a no brainer in my opinion.

 

[Dough Boy]

If you compare trading for Jared Gaither to a Dan Snyder type move than your opinion isn't much to begin with.



Heres a good post from Manster54



Good stuff.

My only problem getting Gaither is, the dreaded double dip. You have to trade a first round pick #27 and then you have to pay him top 10 money. I think Gaither will command a contract similar to Jason Peters 6 year $60M. The Eagirls gave up and 1st (#28) and a fourth, plus the contract. I think Peters is one of the best Left Tackles in football. Because Gaither is younger, I think he is going to demand similar money.

There is one other concern with Gaither. His attitude. Will he get lazy when he gets the money. Some think he is already lazy. We have one 'problem child' on the team with Marty B the Martian. Do we need another? I think Gaither is solid. Has the potential to be very very good. He will only get there through dedication. Will he dedicate himself to the game. The 27th pick is really a glorified high 2nd round pick in my mind. To get this bookend for the pick is solid if he is the 'GUY' and not Just a Guy. I have not seen enough of him to gather.

For all the people wondering why the Ravens are willing to move him, again, see Buffalo - they moved the best tackle in football. Also, see the Seahawks a few years ago, they allowed (thru the poison pill) Hutchinson to leave. They gave him a first round tender and Minn picked him up. I'm not saying Gaither is either of the two, but occasionally, very good players make their way onto the street. Gaither is very young, so this is very much like projecting a draft pick. He has as much upside as anyone in the draft. With three years under his belt, he is younger than T Newman when we drafted him. Add to that - that he can play at a high level for another 10+ years, I can see why so many like him.

I'm torn as I've not watched him play enough to get a read. I do hope that the staff is evaluating him, as he is certainly worthy of being evaluated.

 

[CATCH17]

If it costs us a 1st I say don't do it. Before I was all for him, especially because he was a greater OT then anyone we could have at 27. But now its looking more like ET will fall, especially with the Sheagles on the verge of signing Marlin Jackson, and the Texans stated that they might trade up for CJ Spiller. So if he does fall to us and we don't have that pick, I'll literally go crazy. Iupati is also a option at 27, and if he was there without our pick I'd go ballistic as well, but I'm 80% sure the Steelers are going to draft him, especially with the re signing of Clarke. ET WITH THE 27TH PICK!!

I can live with staying put and selecting any position but Oline.

If we want an olinemen and we can't get Gaither for any cheaper than a 1st then I would anti up and not worry about our LT position for the next decade.