The Penn State Aftermath Thread *Penalty Post #403*

[dcdallaschick]

Totally stolen from Twitter: they keep the statue, but turn it so it's looking the other way.

 

[big dog cowboy]

That would have been a great thread for a poll.

My vote is it comes down at some point but not immediately.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

A 'mistake' is something that happens briefly and the person has no real chance to take it back.

Jim Boeheim ranting against Bernie Fine's accuser was a mistake. We still don't know what the truth in that situation was and Syracuse University did investigate the matter (along with police), but he made the mistake of going out of his way to condemn Davis when he didn't know all of the facts. That was a mistake that could possibly have deterred any other alleged victims of Fine from coming forward.

Joe Paterno was involved in a process to cover up Sandusky's behavior from the public for years. He had plenty of time to bring Sandusky to justice and didn't. Furthermore, Sandusky continued to bring boys to Penn State and their facilities and this went on since 1998.

Sorry, that's not a 'mistake.' That's a pattern and it shows how somebody like Paterno thought about Sandusky and his situation and how it related to his football program, the University and his legacy.

The reason for a 'mob mentality' is that there are virtually no more defenders of the people involved outside of St. Joe. Nobody is defending Schultz and Curley anymore. Same goes with McQueary. Hell, Ray Gricar has been ripped to shreds by many people.

I know this has been said before, but I would like to think that if one of the victims was your child, you wouldn't look back and see Joe Paterno as making a 'mistake' and that 'we're all human and prone to making mistakes.' I'm guessing you would feel the same exact way the victim's parents do, who can't understand how those involved could keep it under wraps for years.

If there's a 'mob mentality' against Joe Pa., it's due to the continued mistruths, misleading statements and lies that his supporters continue to make for him. We were told that Schultz was 'in charge of the Police Department' only to find out that he has no legal arresting authority in the state of Pennsylvania and is more or less the head of budgetary control for many departments at Penn State and one of them happens to be the University's police department.

We've seen the claims that 'Paterno doesn't even use e-mail', which has been proven false.

And we've seen the claims that Paterno never covered up other stuff before, only to have Dr. Vicky Tripony show otherwise.

So that's where the 'mob mentality' against poor ole St. Joe comes from...the unwavering support from those who continue to spin Paterno anyway they can.







YR

 

[jimmy40]

bend it over and put it's head in the sand

 

[burmafrd]

A 'mistake' is something that happens briefly and the person has no real chance to take it back.

Jim Boeheim ranting against Bernie Fine's accuser was a mistake. We still don't know what the truth in that situation was and Syracuse University did investigate the matter (along with police), but he made the mistake of going out of his way to condemn Davis when he didn't know all of the facts. That was a mistake that could possibly have deterred any other alleged victims of Fine from coming forward.

Joe Paterno was involved in a process to cover up Sandusky's behavior from the public for years. He had plenty of time to bring Sandusky to justice and didn't. Furthermore, Sandusky continued to bring boys to Penn State and their facilities and this went on since 1998.

Sorry, that's not a 'mistake.' That's a pattern and it shows how somebody like Paterno thought about Sandusky and his situation and how it related to his football program, the University and his legacy.

The reason for a 'mob mentality' is that there are virtually no more defenders of the people involved outside of St. Joe. Nobody is defending Schultz and Curley anymore. Same goes with McQueary. Hell, Ray Gricar has been ripped to shreds by many people.

I know this has been said before, but I would like to think that if one of the victims was your child, you wouldn't look back and see Joe Paterno as making a 'mistake' and that 'we're all human and prone to making mistakes.' I'm guessing you would feel the same exact way the victim's parents do, who can't understand how those involved could keep it under wraps for years.

If there's a 'mob mentality' against Joe Pa., it's due to the continued mistruths, misleading statements and lies that his supporters continue to make for him. We were told that Schultz was 'in charge of the Police Department' only to find out that he has no legal arresting authority in the state of Pennsylvania and is more or less the head of budgetary control for many departments at Penn State and one of them happens to be the University's police department.

We've seen the claims that 'Paterno doesn't even use e-mail', which has been proven false.

And we've seen the claims that Paterno never covered up other stuff before, only to have Dr. Vicky Tripony show otherwise.

So that's where the 'mob mentality' against poor ole St. Joe comes from...the unwavering support from those who continue to spin Paterno anyway they can.







YR

Roy refuses to believe and nothing you can say will change that.

As you pointed out a mistake is made in a moment of stress or something. Confusion. Etc.


Vick killing dogs for YEARS is not a mistake; its a pattern of behavior.
JoePa covering up sandusky for YEARS is not a MISTAKE its a pattern of behavior.

 

[WV Cowboy]

A 'mistake' is something that happens briefly and the person has no real chance to take it back.

Jim Boeheim ranting against Bernie Fine's accuser was a mistake. We still don't know what the truth in that situation was and Syracuse University did investigate the matter (along with police), but he made the mistake of going out of his way to condemn Davis when he didn't know all of the facts. That was a mistake that could possibly have deterred any other alleged victims of Fine from coming forward.

Joe Paterno was involved in a process to cover up Sandusky's behavior from the public for years. He had plenty of time to bring Sandusky to justice and didn't. Furthermore, Sandusky continued to bring boys to Penn State and their facilities and this went on since 1998.

Sorry, that's not a 'mistake.' That's a pattern and it shows how somebody like Paterno thought about Sandusky and his situation and how it related to his football program, the University and his legacy.

The reason for a 'mob mentality' is that there are virtually no more defenders of the people involved outside of St. Joe. Nobody is defending Schultz and Curley anymore. Same goes with McQueary. Hell, Ray Gricar has been ripped to shreds by many people.

I know this has been said before, but I would like to think that if one of the victims was your child, you wouldn't look back and see Joe Paterno as making a 'mistake' and that 'we're all human and prone to making mistakes.' I'm guessing you would feel the same exact way the victim's parents do, who can't understand how those involved could keep it under wraps for years.

If there's a 'mob mentality' against Joe Pa., it's due to the continued mistruths, misleading statements and lies that his supporters continue to make for him. We were told that Schultz was 'in charge of the Police Department' only to find out that he has no legal arresting authority in the state of Pennsylvania and is more or less the head of budgetary control for many departments at Penn State and one of them happens to be the University's police department.

We've seen the claims that 'Paterno doesn't even use e-mail', which has been proven false.

And we've seen the claims that Paterno never covered up other stuff before, only to have Dr. Vicky Tripony show otherwise.

So that's where the 'mob mentality' against poor ole St. Joe comes from...the unwavering support from those who continue to spin Paterno anyway they can.

YR

I was putting together a similar post, .. but I'm glad I saw this one first because I could not have worded it that well.

14 yrs of turning your back to child molestation is not just a "mistake" or an "accident".

If he had covered this up because he feared for his own life, it could be understandable, and yet still unacceptable.

The fact that he covered this up to protect PSU, the football program and his own legacy is unimaginable.

When he first heard a whisper about this in 1998 he should have slammed his fist down on his desk, and said, "NO !, .. this will never happen on my watch again!, .. and then proceed to get to the bottom of it and exterminate the source."

He did not.

Good post YR.

 

[WV Cowboy]

bend it over and put it's head in the sand

:laugh2:

But seriously, .. how could they not take it down?

 

[Yakuza Rich]

Roy refuses to believe and nothing you can say will change that.

I perfectly understand that.

My reason for continued posting on the subject is that I don't want misleading spin control to attempt to become known as the truth to the public in any way, shape or form.

The victims are owed at least that much.






YR

 

[Yakuza Rich]

I think they should keep the statue up.

I want people to do things that they honestly believe in. That tells me a lot more about the person than the person who does thing based on whatever the public is feeling that day. We have plenty of those people, they are called politicians.

For me, after the Freeh report came out the school should have made up their mind that Joe Paterno was a selfish, lying, coward. That the man they thought they knew had a very different side to them to the point that he was more concerned with helping cover up the RAPE of children for his own selfish needs. To me, once the Freeh report came out showing proof of Paterno’s knowledge of the situation and helping cover it up, that should have sent the message that Joe Paterno is not the person I want associated with me or the school and I certainly do not want the school to lionize him.

Since the school has no plans of tearing down the statue and only will over time due to public demand…I would rather see them keep the statue so the world will really know what those at Penn State are really about.






YR

 

[WV Cowboy]

Since the school has no plans of tearing down the statue and only will over time due to public demand…I would rather see them keep the statue so the world will really know what those at Penn State are really about.

Then it will come down, .. because as we have now found out, PSU is all about perception and reputation.

 

[baj1dallas]

What say you? I think they should and will.

I don't think outsiders should have any say. It's nobody else's business but PSU's.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

I was putting together a similar post, .. but I'm glad I saw this one first because I could not have worded it that well.

14 yrs of turning your back to child molestation is not just a "mistake" or an "accident".

If he had covered this up because he feared for his own life, it could be understandable, and yet still unacceptable.

The fact that he covered this up to protect PSU, the football program and his own legacy is unimaginable.

When he first heard a whisper about this in 1998 he should have slammed his fist down on his desk, and said, "NO !, .. this will never happen on my watch again!, .. and then proceed to get to the bottom of it and exterminate the source."

Agree.

And cajun, I can't believe you'd claim that Paterno didn't know about the 1998 incident. Have you even read the Freeh report?

I thought the obvious lesson here was that even people you think you know can be extremely flawed human beings. Guess not.

 

[WV Cowboy]

I don't think outsiders should have any say. It's nobody else's business but PSU's.

LOL, .. just like having a child molestor walking amongst your children is nobody's business but PSU's.

Sorry, it does not work that way.

 

[casmith07]

The whole situation stinks like week old fish.

 

[Kingsmith88]

LOL, .. just like having a child molestor walking amongst your children is nobody's business but PSU's.

Sorry, it does not work that way.

Sorry but that argument doesn't work. One is a crime and the other is a decision that belongs solely to the University. You have no say and I have no say about the statue and we shouldn't.

They may end up bowing to National pressure and take it down. I doubt they receive that pressure in their community. I think they will take it down bowing down to national pressure.

 

[DallasEast]

The statue is a reminder of Joe Paterno's role (or non-role) in the entire affair. If removal of a reminder helps the university, its students and alma mater deal with what happened, they should not stop at simply removing the statue. Why the aborted piecemeal action? They should remove as many physical traces of Paterno from the university as humanly possible.

Is his name attached to university buildings? Change them to something or someone else.

Are his biographies, autobiographies, etc., located in the university's library? Remove them from shelves or online references.

Is there a street or streets named for him? Substitute them for something else or revert them back to their original designations.

And that's just a good start. Next, the university should request that the NCAA retract all gridiron accomplishments from its record books, during and following the time that Paterno was made aware of Jerry Sandusky's criminal behavior. These are also reminders of what the head coach oversaw despite his alleged knowledge of the tragic events involving Sandusky's pedophilia.

To slightly paraphrase a movie passage from The Ten Commandments:

Let the name of... Paterno... be stricken from every book and electronic library...

Stricken from all street signs and statues...

Stricken from every building on campus.

Let the name of... Paterno... be unheard and unspoken...

Erased from the memory of humanity...

For all time.



If all this seems extreme, I would only ask one thing:


In the grand scheme, what does the removal of a single statue truly accomplish?

 

[Kingsmith88]

I think the library is named after him.

 

[Joe Realist]

I think this is a ridiculous statement of ignorance uttered by someone who didn't attend the university and is creating this uninformed opinion based on the thoughts of a far too small sample size of current and former penn state students.

Edit: ..and actually, as ridiculous as this statement is if you're referring to PSU students, in general, feeling like they are better and that their school is better than any other in the country, if you're referring to PSU football and the "sports fan" in every student, it could also be completely true.

However, every student, hell every sports fan in the world shares that same perspective. "My team is the greatest and yours doesn't come close."

Call it ignorance if you must. It is based on personal experience, yes? Do I think it reflects every PSU alum, no. But how is what I said any dfferent than what people say here about Philly fans? Everyone lumps them together. The difference is it hit too close to home for you. I get it.

 

[WV Cowboy]

Sorry but that argument doesn't work. One is a crime and the other is a decision that belongs solely to the University. You have no say and I have no say about the statue and we shouldn't.

I wasn't comparing the two, I was just pointing out that having that statue there impacts more than just PSU.

 

[DallasEast]

I think the library is named after him.

Then, the media should attack it with as much vigor as the statue itself. I think that I have heard it mentioned on sports radio, but only in passing.