Vick's holding out for one year

[Crown Royal]

This reminds me of hundreds of years ago when the rich nobles would be lead to the gallows or the giulatine ..... all the poor peasants would come out to revel and celebrate in their misery.

Yeah...I remember those days.......

 

[zrinkill]

Yeah...I remember those days.......

 

[jackrussell]

It's funny to come into this thread and see the gung-ho "I hate vick he is a thug and guilty and blah blah blah" posters bleating, patting themselves on the back for a job well done.

But it's hilarious when they continue to pronounce their superiority to phantom posters who 'defended' vick's 'innocence,' calling them his 'supporters.' I can remember arguments about due process, suspension before conviction, innocence before proven guilty in a court of law, but I don't really remember anyone saying that they thought he would come out innocent and would be cleared of all charges.

Why do people get so emotionally invested in other people?

I don't remember anyone proclaiming his innocence either.

I do remember real posters that claimed Vick's dogs were his to do what he wanted with...fight, kill, torture...posters that claim (and still do) that even found guilty, there is nothing wrong with dog fighting....posters that claim dog fighting has no affect on society...posters that found every excuse in the book as to his actions...blaming others...a victim himself.

Now that not only the court of public opinion has demonized his actions...so has the court of law. I personally am not emotionally invested in the people involved...I'm emotionally invested in the issue of cruelty to animals. We now have our poster boy to remind people or make them aware of these obscenities....that drugs are involved, guns, gambling...that maybe FiFi just didn't disappear from the yard one night...but taken to use as baiting in training.

If it was Mike Vick, it was his choice....I'm not to blame for his fall.

 

[Ben_n_austin]

I don't remember anyone proclaiming his innocence either.

I do remember real posters that claimed Vick's dogs were his to do what he wanted with...fight, kill, torture...posters that claim (and still do) that even found guilty, there is nothing wrong with dog fighting....posters that claim dog fighting has no affect on society...posters that found every excuse in the book as to his actions...blaming others...a victim himself.

Now that not only the court of public opinion has demonized his actions...so has the court of law. I personally am not emotionally invested in the people involved...I'm emotionally invested in the issue of cruelty to animals. We now have our poster boy to remind people or make them aware of these obscenities....that drugs are involved, guns, gambling...that maybe FiFi just didn't disappear from the yard one night...but taken to use as baiting in training.

If it was Mike Vick, it was his choice....I'm not to blame for his fall.

Oh my goodness. I can't believe the righteous slant that people take when they look at Vick. He did some horrendous things - to an animal.

The problem that Vick faces is that we live in a society that holds these particular animals, dogs, in a higher regard than most animals. Some even call them their babies.

But in other societies, it's not quite like this. I don't want to harp on that point, though, to make an argument for Vick. And while I do think that he should be punished to some extent of the law. The punishment should fit the crime. And a man spending 12 months in prison is a bit harsh if you ask me.

Rather than look beyond our own society to see that Vick might be being treated a little harshly to serve as an example. Because the media can get herds attention because Mike Vick is such a highly touted celebrity figure, look within our own.

You don't have a major network channel or sports channel that doesn't, isn't or hasn't mentioned his name - a poster boy indeed.

But, in reality, people eat animals every day. If Mike Vick were to have gone the extra mile and cooked FiFi, I doubt that he would be facing the possibility of a mandatory year in prison.

In the name of religion, this country's own dogmatic social norms and the devout love for best friends named Fifi around the world; we persecute Mike Vick.

It's a rather convenient ordeal in which I hope that some truth does pass. Because the truth of this whole matter is that the media and the public are hypocrites when it comes to the treatment of animals.

I'd say that, at least, 50% of prospective jurors, have at some point eaten things like say, veal, which isn't really any different from what Mike Vick did as far as comparisons of torture go.

So why are Vick's actions in this ordeal deemed to be unacceptable, as a social norm, amongst our society when, every day, we are, in some form or fashion, as a collective society, mistreating animals in similar manners?

All of the answers that I've heard in response to the above question contain absurd logic and rationale and are led quite heavily by emotional and reactionary responses and absurdity.

Bear in mind, Dick Cheney shot a man in the face while hunting birds; for sport.

Where's the justice?

 

[Ben_n_austin]

So after all of the hoopla and BS about Vick mistreating animals what do the animal rights organizations want to do ? You guessed it, Kill the dogs!



link

Yes I get the fact that these dog are too 'dangerous' to be maintained as pets but theres just something a little hypocritcal about all of this to me .

I once saw a man shoot into a crowd of city kids killing a friend of mine just missing me by a couple of feet. Because it was 'Gang-related' Mike Vick will do more time than he did.


Boo.

Again, where's the justice?

 

[Bob Sacamano]

Again - you have no idea what my stance is on this, yet you declare "game over." This must be why so many people love talking with you.

why don't you tell me what your argument is instead of acting like a whiny, lil brat?:

 

[HopeCowboyFan]

Leonard Little killed a human being and still plays in the NFL.

Vick committed a heinous crime and will serve his time. Serve his suspension and should be allowed to resume his career if any teams are interested. And thats a big if.

 

[burmafrd]

If its one thing I truly despise its the hypocrisy of the so called moral relativity- that there is no true right or wrong just shades of gray.
That is a cop out. That way you don't have to judge anyone- you don't have to make a stand.
Well guess what= society has made judgements and decided on laws and on social norms. And those that are involved in Dog Fighting are considered despicable. And as far as I am concerned rightly so.

 

[Ben_n_austin]

If its one thing I truly despise its the hypocrisy of the so called moral relativity- that there is no true right or wrong just shades of gray.
That is a cop out. That way you don't have to judge anyone- you don't have to make a stand.
Well guess what= society has made judgements and decided on laws and on social norms. And those that are involved in Dog Fighting are considered despicable. And as far as I am concerned rightly so.

Just because a man, or even the majority of men in a group makes a law; doesn't mean that the law is just.

These laws are as fallible as the individuals who make them. And the hypocrisy of those who make judgements without taking an honest look at their own makes me ill.

There is no dichotomy here unless a false one. But it's black and white to me that you just don't want to take a look at the similarities in your moral actions as far as universal law goes in regards to the flesh in your stomach.

But that's the reality of it--regardless of our laws that are derived from these fallacious social norms.

 

[jackrussell]

As I said before about the predictability...the Vick apologists continue.

Next up.....FREE MICHAEL VICK....FREE MICHAEL VICK!!!!!

Those who don't fight dogs are the evil doers!!! Those who don't break the law are the evil doers!!!!

 

[HopeCowboyFan]

As I said before about the predictability...the Vick apologists continue.

Next up.....FREE MICHAEL VICK....FREE MICHAEL VICK!!!!!

Those who don't fight dogs are the evil doers!!! Those who don't break the law are the evil doers!!!!

I don't see any apologists or anyone asking to free Vick. It's about 99% Vick deserves to go to jail. After he serves his time he has the right to try and resume his career.

If any team is interested is another story.

 

[Big Dakota]

This reminds me of hundreds of years ago when the rich nobles would be lead to the gallows or the giulatine ..... all the poor peasants would come out to revel and celebrate in their misery.

Hey, let's go to America and start a revolution!

 

[Big Dakota]

Oh my goodness. I can't believe the righteous slant that people take when they look at Vick. He did some horrendous things - to an animal.

The problem that Vick faces is that we live in a society that holds these particular animals, dogs, in a higher regard than most animals. Some even call them their babies.

But in other societies, it's not quite like this. I don't want to harp on that point, though, to make an argument for Vick. And while I do think that he should be punished to some extent of the law. The punishment should fit the crime. And a man spending 12 months in prison is a bit harsh if you ask me.

Rather than look beyond our own society to see that Vick might be being treated a little harshly to serve as an example. Because the media can get herds attention because Mike Vick is such a highly touted celebrity figure, look within our own.

You don't have a major network channel or sports channel that doesn't, isn't or hasn't mentioned his name - a poster boy indeed.

But, in reality, people eat animals every day. If Mike Vick were to have gone the extra mile and cooked FiFi, I doubt that he would be facing the possibility of a mandatory year in prison.

In the name of religion, this country's own dogmatic social norms and the devout love for best friends named Fifi around the world; we persecute Mike Vick.

It's a rather convenient ordeal in which I hope that some truth does pass. Because the truth of this whole matter is that the media and the public are hypocrites when it comes to the treatment of animals.

I'd say that, at least, 50% of prospective jurors, have at some point eaten things like say, veal, which isn't really any different from what Mike Vick did as far as comparisons of torture go.

So why are Vick's actions in this ordeal deemed to be unacceptable, as a social norm, amongst our society when, every day, we are, in some form or fashion, as a collective society, mistreating animals in similar manners?

All of the answers that I've heard in response to the above question contain absurd logic and rationale and are led quite heavily by emotional and reactionary responses and absurdity.

Bear in mind, Dick Cheney shot a man in the face while hunting birds; for sport.

Where's the justice?

Oh so eloquent:cry:. Why don't you send it to Vick in jail where he can ponder your deep understanding of our society while he's getting his Fifi violated :gassy2: .


I'm sure your stirring dissertation and a jar of this
will be of great relief.

 

[Ben_n_austin]

As I said before about the predictability...the Vick apologists continue.

Next up.....FREE MICHAEL VICK....FREE MICHAEL VICK!!!!!

Those who don't fight dogs are the evil doers!!! Those who don't break the law are the evil doers!!!!

I see that the logic is unable to get through to you, Mr. Russell. Your emotional diatribe suits your obvious "puppy love" agenda.

Peace and love to all puppies. Because dogs themselves would never kill anything.....

Nor do people hunt. . .

Nor do people dine on tortured animals for taste. . . .

Nor do people hesitate to ask what experiences that the animal went through when they lounge at a ski resort's bar in a fur coat.

Society says that's ok. We live in a "puppy love" society.

Yeah, you make a lot of sense. Hang Mike Vick by his manhood and go set your mouse traps....

Is it me? Because this poster doesn't seem to have the mental faculties to separate rationale from emotion?

We're talking apples to apples here. But I think that someone has seen "Old Yeller" one too many times....

 

[Ben_n_austin]

Oh so eloquent:cry:. Why don't you send it to Vick in jail where he can ponder your deep understanding of our society while he's getting his Fifi violated :gassy2: .


I'm sure your stirring dissertation and a jar of this
will be of great relief.

I'm sure that all of this attention to Micheal Vick will take a bite out of crime and make vegetarians out of us all, right?

 

[Concord]

I see that the logic is unable to get through to you, Mr. Russell. Your emotional diatribe suits your obvious "puppy love" agenda.

Peace and love to all puppies. Because dogs themselves would never kill anything.....

Nor do people hunt. . .

Nor do people dine on tortured animals for taste. . . .

Nor do people hesitate to ask what experiences that the animal went through when they lounge at a ski resort's bar in a fur coat.

Society says that's ok. We live in a "puppy love" society.

Yeah, you make a lot of sense. Hang Mike Vick by his manhood and go set your mouse traps....

Is it me? Because this poster doesn't seem to have the mental faculties to separate rationale from emotion?

We're talking apples to apples here. But I think that someone has seen "Old Yeller" one too many times....

Everything your bringing up here has been discussed Ad nauseam before in the 100 or so other Vick threads.

Vick's a Guilty POS and he deserves everything he gets...and more if where up to me.

If that's irrational...emotional Puppy Love so be it.

 

[wileedog]

Oh my goodness. I can't believe the righteous slant that people take when they look at Vick. He did some horrendous things - to an animal.

The problem that Vick faces is that we live in a society that holds these particular animals, dogs, in a higher regard than most animals. Some even call them their babies.

But in other societies, it's not quite like this.

Okay, but why do we care about other societies? In ours deliberate cruelty to animals, particularly dogs, is considered a crime. Vick grew up in our society.

Because other societies, that Vick does not live in, have less of a problem torturing dogs, why is that a rationale for leniency for Vick?

And a man spending 12 months in prison is a bit harsh if you ask me.

The laws and sentencing guidelines are quite clear for his crime. They were before he committed his crimes. They are now. No one asked you.

Rather than look beyond our own society to see that Vick might be being treated a little harshly to serve as an example.

Again, why are we looking beyond our own society? Vick is answerable to the laws and rules of this one. He is answerable to the public opinion that people who maliciously torture dogs are not welcome in *this* society.

Because the media can get herds attention because Mike Vick is such a highly touted celebrity figure, look within our own.

The media is jumping on it because the crimes he committed disgust most of the people in *this* society.

People read the stories and become increasingly horrified, which makes them follow the story even more. Thus they sell more advertising.

The media never has and never will have another agenda other than this, despite everyone's claims.

But, in reality, people eat animals every day. If Mike Vick were to have gone the extra mile and cooked FiFi, I doubt that he would be facing the possibility of a mandatory year in prison.

Yes we slaughter cows. We do so in a quick, efficient, consistent and relatively humane manner.

Yes veal is an exception. But again, no one sits around and thinks of new and creative ways to kill the cows or calves or chickens. They do what must be done so we can eat tasty meals, and the people who do said service of raising these animals for food can make a living.

Hosing a dog down and electrocuting it displays a basic lack of human empathy. Finding new and creative ways to torture and kill the dogs displays a mind and a soul with no respect for life.

This is not a mindset that is welcome in our society.

That is what you are missing with your 'we eat animals' argument.

Maiming, torturing and killing them for no other reason but sport is simply not the same. Breeding them in the first place for no other purpose than to be maimed and tortured and killed for sport is simply not the same.

And yes I have a dog. And yes, I think she is intelligent enough to understand she is part of a family, and that she would gladly lay down her life to protect her family.

When you find me a good watch-cow, maybe we can pick up this argument again....

 

[Big Dakota]

I'm sure that all of this attention to Micheal Vick will take a bite out of crime and make vegetarians out of us all, right?

Is the pencil neck geek you? I bet McGruff took a bite out of your any given sunday and you decided you like cows better, huh?

 

[Crown Royal]

I'll be honest, I too am sick of the likening of dog fighting to eating meat. It's a silly comparison, because they are completely different scenarios. I see where some similarities exist, but it doesn't even begin to be the same thing. To say that they are alike is asinine.

And I say this being, to my knowledge, the only poster in these threads who is actually a vegetarian for ethical reason. So seriously, unless you, too, walk the walk, cut it out.

 

[Big Dakota]

I'll be honest, I too am sick of the likening of dog fighting to eating meat. It's a silly comparison, because they are completely different scenarios. I see where some similarities exist, but it doesn't even begin to be the same thing. To say that they are alike is asinine.

And I say this being, to my knowledge, the only poster in these threads who is actually a vegetarian for ethical reason. So seriously, unless you, too, walk the walk, cut it out.

Also, do you own NOTHING derived of animal?